Logan Airport Flights and Airlines Discussion

Additionally, in partnership with Massport, Delta plans to assume operations at all gates at Logan's Terminal A by the third quarter of 2019.
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Southwest is moving elsewhere
 
Yeah Southwest is taking space in B that's getting freed up as a result of the AA-US merger.
 
Manchester news:

"Manchester-Boston Regional Airport (MHT) is pleased to announce new non-stop service to Chicago O’Hare International Airport (ORD) on American Airlines. Daily service between Manchester and American’s Chicago hub will begin June 6, 2019. Seats will be available for sale beginning Monday December 17, 2018 through the American Airlines website www.aa.com."

https://manchesterinklink.com/american-airlines-adds-new-service-from-manchester-to-chicagos-ohare/



As an aside, in 2005, MHT had 4,329,478 customers. In 2017, it was 1,970,688.

What the hell happened?
 
jass said:
Manchester news:

"Manchester-Boston Regional Airport (MHT) is pleased to announce new non-stop service to Chicago O’Hare International Airport (ORD) on American Airlines. Daily service between Manchester and American’s Chicago hub will begin June 6, 2019. Seats will be available for sale beginning Monday December 17, 2018 through the American Airlines website www.aa.com."

https://manchesterinklink.com/american-airlines-adds-new-service-from-manchester-to-chicagos-ohare/



As an aside, in 2005, MHT had 4,329,478 customers. In 2017, it was 1,970,688.

What the hell happened?
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The big thing? Southwest started flying from Logan with competitive pricing to what they offered from MHT.
 
North Shore said:
The big thing? Southwest started flying from Logan with competitive pricing to what they offered from MHT.
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Frequencies/connectivity on a lot of routes seem to be better via BOS.

I'll often put in a destination I have in mind from MHT and have to connect in MDW or BWI to make that trip from there (on Southwest, some other connection if another airline), but I can get a non-stop out of BOS.

Or there's only 2 trips a day from MHT that don't work well for me, but I've got a half-dozen choices out of BOS.

Might as well drive another hour from NH for people up there to get a non-stop. (although BOS's parking prices are higher).

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I'll also suggest that MHT is in a tougher competitive position because access to BOS is easier from NH. You don't have to go through the city to get there and are less likely to hit severe traffic you can't get around as a result. Driving from PVD is much more unpredictable time-wise, because if there's a problem downtown you can't easily get around it.
 
millerm277 said:
Frequencies/connectivity on a lot of routes seem to be better via BOS.

I'll often put in a destination I have in mind from MHT and have to connect in MDW or BWI to make that trip from there (on Southwest, some other connection if another airline), but I can get a non-stop out of BOS.

Or there's only 2 trips a day from MHT that don't work well for me, but I've got a half-dozen choices out of BOS.

Might as well drive another hour from NH for people up there to get a non-stop. (although BOS's parking prices are higher).

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I'll also suggest that MHT is in a tougher competitive position because access to BOS is easier from NH. You don't have to go through the city to get there and are less likely to hit severe traffic you can't get around as a result. Driving from PVD is much more unpredictable time-wise, because if there's a problem downtown you can't easily get around it.
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I think there's a combination of factors. The biggest being that fares at Logan have dropped thanks to Southwest beginning operations and Jetblue's rapid growth. It's also put pressure on legacy carriers to price competitively. So most of the time it's cheaper to fly out of Boston. BOS definitely offers more directs and better frequencies which is attractive to most travelers. Big dig didn't hurt either with the Ted Williams opening.

The last piece of that is why I don't know that I agree with your point about MHT being in a tougher position competitively. Traffic in PVD isn't usually that much of a factor (there's traffic, but not ultra-lengthy delays like Boston), and the majority of Metro PVD's population wouldn't have to pass through downtown Providence. And traffic to Logan from the south has the Ted Williams tunnel which is a much easier/more straightforward way to the airport than Callahan/Sumner. They also have a longer HOV lane inbound during the morning rush. The entrance to the Ted Williams is south of downtown, so it's actually easier to avoid the city center coming from the South than it is from 93 in the North. Route 1/1a from the North isn't a breeze either.

Honestly, the tough thing for MHT vs. PVD is that PVD is just a much more populated area that's closer to other more populated areas. It's a bigger market.
 
Lrfox said:
Honestly, the tough thing for MHT vs. PVD is that PVD is just a much more populated area that's closer to other more populated areas. It's a bigger market.
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It also competes with PWM in addition to Logan. PVD's market doesn't bleed into BDL in quite that same way.
 
Lrfox said:
I think there's a combination of factors. The biggest being that fares at Logan have dropped thanks to Southwest beginning operations and Jetblue's rapid growth. It's also put pressure on legacy carriers to price competitively. So most of the time it's cheaper to fly out of Boston. BOS definitely offers more directs and better frequencies which is attractive to most travelers. Big dig didn't hurt either with the Ted Williams opening.

The last piece of that is why I don't know that I agree with your point about MHT being in a tougher position competitively. Traffic in PVD isn't usually that much of a factor (there's traffic, but not ultra-lengthy delays like Boston), and the majority of Metro PVD's population wouldn't have to pass through downtown Providence. And traffic to Logan from the south has the Ted Williams tunnel which is a much easier/more straightforward way to the airport than Callahan/Sumner. They also have a longer HOV lane inbound during the morning rush. The entrance to the Ted Williams is south of downtown, so it's actually easier to avoid the city center coming from the South than it is from 93 in the North. Route 1/1a from the North isn't a breeze either.

Honestly, the tough thing for MHT vs. PVD is that PVD is just a much more populated area that's closer to other more populated areas. It's a bigger market.
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Not only does PVD serve a larger population area (people often forget that Bristol County in Massachusetts is a part of Providence’s metro area), there is also a decent sized business base in the Providence area, something that NH lacks.
 
mass88 said:
Not only does PVD serve a larger population area (people often forget that Bristol County in Massachusetts is a part of Providence’s metro area), there is also a decent sized business base in the Providence area, something that NH lacks.
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Does it? Manchester is the only airport of significance north of Boston. Thats all of Maine, NH, and Vermont!
 
jass said:
Does it? Manchester is the only airport of significance north of Boston. Thats all of Maine, NH, and Vermont!
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RE airports of significance north of Boston...

Based on MHT's rate of decline and PWM's higher number of markets served, I think it's worth keeping Portland Jetport in the conversation.

As a Manchester resident (for a couple weeks longer, anyway), all I'll contribute is that it's a perfectly simple airport and very easy to get to by car... and only by car. Boston Express buses and other Coach bus services have been very successful with running trips from park and ride facilities along I-93 in Southern NH, which I think is a contributing consideration for the ease of getting to Logan and not worrying about parking. The drive from Manchester's Downtown to BOS is under 1 hour under optimal conditions (i.e. anytime except AM rush hour). I've made the choice to fly Jetblue directly from BOS to my desired destinations at least 2 dozen times since moving to Manchester in 2016, and only ever taken 1 flight out of MHT (a flight to LGA). Cheaper, non-stop, and international options will continue to make BOS > MHT for NH residents.
 
dshoost88 said:
RE airports of significance north of Boston...

Based on MHT's rate of decline and PWM's higher number of markets served, I think it's worth keeping Portland Jetport in the conversation.
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It’s more than just in the conversation. They’re only 200k apart in terms of passengers served and trending different directions. As you pointed out, PWM serves more markets.

PVD doesn’t have similar competition and it’s a much bigger, more densely populated area.
 
MHT is 95 miles from PWM. There is some overlap, but the competition for MHT is more with Logan (55 miles) than it is with PWM.

If you're in Southern NH, driving to BOS is often easier than going to MHT and having a connection. For people up in Maine, it's a longer drive to BOS to the point that having a connection after a PWM flight is preferable to going to BOS.
 
tysmith95 said:
MHT is 95 miles from PWM. There is some overlap, but the competition for MHT is more with Logan (55 miles) than it is with PWM.

If you're in Southern NH, driving to BOS is often easier than going to MHT and having a connection. For people up in Maine, it's a longer drive to BOS to the point that having a connection after a PWM flight is preferable to going to BOS.
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For myself in southern NH hopping on the bus to BOS is easier than flying out of anywhere else. Bus terminal is right next to PSM too, but I a.) Don't want to fly with ulcc style airlines and b.) have no use for the destinations served from PSM.
 
Portland has turned into a nice little tourist destination over the last 6 years or so and they've really expanded their air service. They now have year round, daily non-stop flights to all of the main East Coast hubs - Charlotte, Philadelphia, New York LaGuardia, Atlanta, Detroit, New York JFK, Baltimore/Washington, Newark, Chicago O'Hare and Washington Dulles. Unless you're going somewhere like Seattle or San Diego and want a non-stop, you can get pretty much anywhere one-stop from Portland.
 
Off topic, but I noticed Lufthansa has stopped operating the 748 on the FRA-BOS route...is that just a summer seasonal thing???
 
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