The St Regis Residences (former Whiskey Priest site) | 150 Seaport Blvd | Seaport

kmp1284

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I also wonder much the common fees will be in such a small building with so many amenities.
At Pier 4, which I think is the closest comparable, they start at $1450 for a 969 sqft third floor 1br/1.5ba($1.46 psf) and top out at $7532 for a 3644 sqft 4br/4.5ba penthouse($2.07psf). I'd wager that they'll be at least 30% higher here.
 

Czervik.Construction

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I wouldn't be surprised if was even higher. I was reading either here or elsewhere that there will be a crazy staff to resident ratio, butlers and all sorts of other stuff. When that is a hotel and residence (like the Ritz or FS) the costs can be spread out between hotel and condo. Here it is ultra high end hotel services in a small condo building. I know a lot of the people that own here will not care, but say a 1 Br has fees of ~$2K, that is $24K per year. That means the apartment has to appreciate in value $24K per year in perpetuity to break even. Yikes.

At Pier 4, which I think is the closest comparable, they start at $1450 for a 969 sqft third floor 1br/1.5ba($1.46 psf) and top out at $7532 for a 3644 sqft 4br/4.5ba penthouse($2.07psf). I'd wager that they'll be at least 30% higher here.
 

Vivanna

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I wouldn't be surprised if was even higher. I was reading either here or elsewhere that there will be a crazy staff to resident ratio, butlers and all sorts of other stuff. When that is a hotel and residence (like the Ritz or FS) the costs can be spread out between hotel and condo. Here it is ultra high end hotel services in a small condo building. I know a lot of the people that own here will not care, but say a 1 Br has fees of ~$2K, that is $24K per year. That means the apartment has to appreciate in value $24K per year in perpetuity to break even. Yikes.

From a local broker: "St. Regis condo fees are slightly higher than Pier 4 but lower than One Dalton"

1 BR's are selling for over $2M, so all you'd need, by the analysis you give to break even, is a 1% annual appreciation. The past 10 years Boston has averaged 5-6% appreciation and that includes the downturn that started in '08!
 

Czervik.Construction

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I think things will be fine in the long term, but I think that there are problems for the owner if they need to sell in the 5-7 year time frame and there is a slowdown coupled with these waterfront units being priced above what the market can bear.

There are a lot of condos starting to sit on the market down here in the $2-7M range There are only so many wall street guys and foreign investors that can buy these units. There is a building near me that just opened where the 1 br units are around $3-4M, 2 br are $6-8M. That is a ton of money, even for a Wall Street Managing Director making $1M-$1.5M per year, most of which being bonus (variable comp).

People are just getting fed up when a household making north of $500K per year can't find anything they can afford and are either sitting on the sidelines or moving to Jersey City, Brooklyn or Queens.
 
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stellarfun

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I think things will be fine in the long term, but I think that there are problems for the owner f they need to sell in the 5-7 year time frame and there is a slowdown coupled with these waterfront units being priced above what the market can bear.

There are a lot of condos starting to sit on the market down here in the $2-7M range There are only so many wall street guys and foreign investors that can buy these units. There is a building near me that just opened where the 1 br units are around $3-4M, 2 br are $6-8M. That is a ton of money, even for a Wall Street Managing Director making $1M-$1.5M per year, most of which being bonus (variable comp).

People are just getting fed up when a household making north of $500K per year can't find anything they an afford and are either sitting on the sidelines or moving to Jersey City, Brooklyn or Queens.
A prominent high end condo developer in DC recently announced he had stopped building condos. He gave as reasons the changes in the tax law, where state and local tax deductions are capped, and mortgage interest deduction is now capped as well. I would add the nativist mood at 1600 Pennsylvania Ave isn't helping either. American real estate might not be the best place to park your wealth.
 

stoweker

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I wouldn't be surprised if was even higher. I was reading either here or elsewhere that there will be a crazy staff to resident ratio, butlers and all sorts of other stuff. When that is a hotel and residence (like the Ritz or FS) the costs can be spread out between hotel and condo. Here it is ultra high end hotel services in a small condo building. I know a lot of the people that own here will not care, but say a 1 Br has fees of ~$2K, that is $24K per year. That means the apartment has to appreciate in value $24K per year in perpetuity to break even. Yikes.
i don't think people buy these units to make money on appreciation, they buy them for the lifestyle and have enough money to burn that it doesn't matter that they lose money in the long run on taxes fees & inusrance
 

meddlepal

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As with all things I'm sure there's a spectrum of reasons but I agree at a certain level of wealth 24k becomes nothing money.
 

HenryAlan

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I wouldn't be surprised if was even higher. I was reading either here or elsewhere that there will be a crazy staff to resident ratio, butlers and all sorts of other stuff. When that is a hotel and residence (like the Ritz or FS) the costs can be spread out between hotel and condo. Here it is ultra high end hotel services in a small condo building. I know a lot of the people that own here will not care, but say a 1 Br has fees of ~$2K, that is $24K per year. That means the apartment has to appreciate in value $24K per year in perpetuity to break even. Yikes.
From the sounds of things, we should expect to see more appreciation than that, but I think the notion is wrong to begin with, as the $24,000 is partly paying for services received by the owner. The only part that should be measured against appreciation would be building maintenance or funding for capital improvements. But these buildings have high fees specifically because the level of service is high. The cost of an on-call butler, chef, etc. needs to be backed out of the analysis.
 

Czervik.Construction

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@HenryAlan , that is an interesting way to think through actual costs that would impact appreciation. I included the whole cost bc that ~$2K fee comes out of the owners pocket and will come out of any subsequent owners pocket. It is not optional. I know a few real estate investors in NYC and Chicago and their models include the total monthly fee (amenities, services and maintenance) rather than a portion of it.

@meddlepal , I agree with the upper priced and penthouse units, but you would be surprised how shrewd and attention to every dollar wealthy people are. In my old building in the West Village, it had zero amenities, but condos would trade at a premium because the common charges were $500 a month. This was on multi-million $$ units that ended up being gut renovated for additional six figure $$. People buying $2-3M condos are going to negotiate harder and as a few more of these come online, maybe once this, Echelon, Raffles, 1 Dalton, etc are added to the market, this may become an issue.

Either way, this building will probably sell out due to its unique nature. Even with Echelon across the street, there are only a few hotel service condos in the city, even with 1 Dalton added to the mix. This niche market probably still has some runway.
 

tmac9wr

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“There has been a lot of interest from Chinese and Asian buyers but more for investments, and that’s not something we’re interested in at this stage,” he said. A potential buyer from the investment community wanted to buy six units, but Cronin said his company turned them down.
If that's accurate, that's very interesting (and good)
 

jl326

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If that's accurate, that's very interesting (and good)
Agreed this is a good thing in my opinion. However, what usually ends up happening of that some initial buyers simply either flip for a profit to the same investors or wait a couple of years to do the same. It’s difficult to control resales currently.
 

stick n move

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Definitely good because they have billions of dollars and park their money in American real estate and you cant possibly build enough units to bring prices down when each billionaire can buy dozens of units each for their portfolio. Then real estate prices actually keep increasing the more you build and the avg boston home buyer gets the shaft. Australia is going through this hard right now.
 

TallIsGood

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And then the units get leased and people still live in them . . .
 

Gunner02

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My office is the corner one above the Dunkin' in WTC, so I've had a front row seat to this and Echelon. Now that I'm online and since it's out my window, I feel a personal obligation to keep up with the progress and take a small, small portion off Beeline's loaded plate.


IMG_0499.jpg
 

BeeLine

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My office is the corner one above the Dunkin' in WTC, so I've had a front row seat to this and Echelon. Now that I'm online and since it's out my window, I feel a personal obligation to keep up with the progress and take a small, small portion off Beeline's loaded plate.


View attachment 542
Great stuff. Thanks for the offer, to take off some of the load, but if you haven't noticed I'm a nosey bugger and will still be stopping by from time to time. I see they have up the new billboard. Seems like a bit of a waste of money, but that's just me.
 

Gunner02

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I would agree. It's no cheap structure, that's for sure.

Really though, it's been an incredibly interesting development to watch. There is NO extra room to work with and there is a lot going on in just that little space.
 

Suffolk 83

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There was a temporary sidewalk that was basically in the street... they closed that?
 

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