Ann & Hope Mill Conversion | Cumberland

[New England Born & Raised]

Thought this large mill conversion was worth having its own thread. The old textile mill on the Blackstone River in the Lonsdale neighborhood of Cumberland which later became the original Ann & Hope Dept Store and HQ is getting close to redevelopment and conversion. It will be mixed use with 241 residential units.

Mixed Ann & Hope project returns for detailed review

CUMBERLAND – The developer seeking to revive the former Ann & Hope Mill has met all conditions placed by the Planning Board during conceptual master plan approvals, and submitted all

www.valleybreeze.com

 

[Lrfox]

Great project and definitely worth of its own thread!

I love the train in the rendering. Usually train tracks running alongside a residential project outside of a transit corridor in the city are not viewed as a good thing. But it almost (to my eyes, anyway) looks like they're trying to make it look like this is on a passenger rail line? I mean, it's not terribly far from Pawtucket/CF or S. Attleboro, but it's certainly not TOD.

 

[New England Born & Raised]

Great project and definitely worth of its own thread!

I love the train in the rendering. Usually train tracks running alongside a residential project outside of a transit corridor in the city are not viewed as a good thing. But it almost (to my eyes, anyway) looks like they're trying to make it look like this is on a passenger rail line? I mean, it's not terribly far from Pawtucket/CF or S. Attleboro, but it's certainly not TOD.

It is a still active freight line using the old Providence and Worcester tracks linking the cities. It long ago stopped regular passenger service. It actually once had a station here (photo below).

 

[New England Born & Raised]

All approvals for Ann & Hope expected soon

CUMBERLAND – Representatives for the planned redevelopment of the Ann & Hope Mill say they hope to have all approvals in place by this spring.

www.valleybreeze.com

 

[F-Line to Dudley]

I love the train in the rendering. Usually train tracks running alongside a residential project outside of a transit corridor in the city are not viewed as a good thing. But it almost (to my eyes, anyway) looks like they're trying to make it look like this is on a passenger rail line? I mean, it's not terribly far from Pawtucket/CF or S. Attleboro, but it's certainly not TOD.

The P&W mainline is planned long-term for Woonsocket-Pawtucket-Providence commuter rail per a feasibility study done about 15 years ago that's still highly rated by RIDOT despite their slow overall progress on implementing overall intrastate commuter rail. That study earmarked a Cumberland intermediate stop at Martin St. about 1.5 miles north of this site, accessible from the same RIPTA bus 75 that passes this site.

So it is technically TOD if you encompass those further-reaching plans. It would be great if RIDOT got a little more serious about infilling its extra Northeast Corridor stations to Wickford Junction and increasing Wickford Junction (and Westerly) service levels as that would be a necessary prerequisite before proceeding with the Blackstone Valley corridor. The renders showing passenger trains might be jumping the gun by a decade at the rate the state is going, but it's definitely a further-future consideration here.

 

[New England Born & Raised]

I doubt most of us will ever see regular train service from Woonsocket during our lifetimes. RI would better be served extending commuter rail service to Kingston and Westerly where most all the necessary infrastructure is already in place.

The P&W lines that run by Ann & Hope meet up with and run parallel to the northeast corridor Amtrak/mbta lines just north of the old Pawtucket train depot and go through the new MBTA station. This track however is not connected to either of the two passenger platforms.


Pawtucket Station looking south. The P&W freight line is the the far right. The two lines between the platforms are used by Amtrak and the MBTA.

 

[Lrfox]

It is a still active freight line using the old Providence and Worcester tracks linking the cities. It long ago stopped regular passenger service. It actually once had a station here (photo below).

View attachment 61850

Love the photo! Was the line double tracked through here, or was that second track just for station access?

 

[Lrfox]

The P&W mainline is planned long-term for Woonsocket-Pawtucket-Providence commuter rail per a feasibility study done about 15 years ago that's still highly rated by RIDOT despite their slow overall progress on implementing overall intrastate commuter rail. That study earmarked a Cumberland intermediate stop at Martin St. about 1.5 miles north of this site, accessible from the same RIPTA bus 75 that passes this site.

So it is technically TOD if you encompass those further-reaching plans. It would be great if RIDOT got a little more serious about infilling its extra Northeast Corridor stations to Wickford Junction and increasing Wickford Junction (and Westerly) service levels as that would be a necessary prerequisite before proceeding with the Blackstone Valley corridor. The renders showing passenger trains might be jumping the gun by a decade at the rate the state is going, but it's definitely a further-future consideration here.

Thanks. I actually didn't realize that there was consideration for a Woonsocket-Pawtucket-Providence commuter rail line. So those renders are optimistic, but not fully dishonest.

 

[New England Born & Raised]

Love the photo! Was the line double tracked through here, or was that second track just for station access?

Do not know about the past. It is today just a single line up to Worcester. It runs along a good portion of the Blackstone River Bikeway north of Lonsdale.

 

[F-Line to Dudley]

Do not know about the past. It is today just a single line up to Worcester. It runs along a good portion of the Blackstone River Bikeway north of Lonsdale.

It was double-tracked in the past, and the '09 feasibility study proposed double-tracking everything from Valley Falls freight yard through the Cumberland Station.

I checked the study...they did indeed consider an alternate Cumberland station location right at the Ann & Hope site, contingent on lots of TOD redeveloping the area. So, yeah, the renders are optimistic but accurate.

 

[Stlin]

I grew up around here through the age of 10, so I remember that Ann & Hope well - as a small kid, this is where my parents liked to shop, pre outlet. That said, despite my issues with its mixed use being primarily a self storage facility (bleh) and too much parking, it'd be really nice to see this restored - especially in its later Ann & Hope Outlet / flea market days it was fairly decrepit and sad, and the ranks of loading docks never helped. It'll be good for the area, although I do hope they rebuild the clock in the tower.

As for the future of transit, my impression of the area is that Lincoln and Cumberland are provincial enough that it'll be an uphill challenge to get them to densify to any appreciable degree that justifies rail service. Here I'll point to the Albion traffic beacon controversy (which I had a coloring page of in elementary school) so while Martin St is a better location for stop spacing to Woonsocket, here is probably better for the existing density.

Also, does anyone know what the plan is for the parking lot on the other side of Ann & Hope Way? That was part of the Ann & Hope mill property at one point, but it appears that the Ann & Hope company still owns it.

 

[riptide]

I doubt most of us will ever see regular train service from Woonsocket during our lifetimes. RI would better be served extending commuter rail service to Kingston and Westerly where most all the necessary infrastructure is already in place.

I actually think an optimistic, yet reasonable timeline for getting a Woonsocket train service going would be 15 or 20 years. The success of Pawtucket-Central Falls station seems to have given the state the confidence it needed to feel it was finally safe to poke its head out of the foxhole it dove into when Wickford Junction underperformed, and pick up where it left off on building the full, Woonsocket-to-Westerly rail service corridor.

There was an article in the Journal a few weeks ago saying initial design work for high-level platforms at the Westerly station is expected to begin next year. Once Westerly has what it needs to be a functional southern terminus, RIDOT could start running their first intrastate line on the Northeast Corridor. They may well prefer to add infills on that line before taking on a new one to Woonsocket, but if they decided full statewide coverage was worth prioritizing, then 15-20 years may not be crazy.

 

[riptide]

I grew up around here through the age of 10, so I remember that Ann & Hope well - as a small kid, this is where my parents liked to shop, pre outlet. That said, despite my issues with its mixed use being primarily a self storage facility (bleh) and too much parking, it'd be really nice to see this restored - especially in its later Ann & Hope Outlet / flea market days it was fairly decrepit and sad, and the ranks of loading docks never helped. It'll be good for the area, although I do hope they rebuild the clock in the tower.

As for the future of transit, my impression of the area is that Lincoln and Cumberland are provincial enough that it'll be an uphill challenge to get them to densify to any appreciable degree that justifies rail service. Here I'll point to the Albion traffic beacon controversy (which I had a coloring page of in elementary school) so while Martin St is a better location for stop spacing to Woonsocket, here is probably better for the existing density.

Also, does anyone know what the plan is for the parking lot on the other side of Ann & Hope Way? That was part of the Ann & Hope mill property at one point, but it appears that the Ann & Hope company still owns it.

I agree it’s overparked. Also, I’ve been seeing the self storage and residential combination more often on these sorts of mill reconversions. Seems to be an insatiable demand for self storage, and if the floor plates of the mill buildings are deep enough that residential units can’t reach in far enough to take advantage, and you’re left with windowless interior space, I understand the appeal of using that space for self storage.

 

[Stlin]

I agree it’s overparked. Also, I’ve been seeing the self storage and residential combination more often on these sorts of mill reconversions. Seems to be an insatiable demand for self storage, and if the floor plates of the mill buildings are deep enough that residential units can’t reach in far enough to take advantage, and you’re left with windowless interior space, I understand the appeal of using that space for self storage.

At least here that's not the case - the self storage facility will occupy the entire basement area that was most recently the flea market space. (I do wonder if they'll restore the cart escalator...) Given that there's no windows, it's fair enough - I just kinda wish they'd been able put the parking there instead, even if that is unrealistic. That said, given that this is going to be a rental building, I think there's potential that the owner may choose to put up additional buildings on the parking areas in the future, though I think it unlikely.

I'm also not sure that what RI needs for Intrastate Commuter Rail is Westerly - that's so much more a CT / New London oriented community it makes much more sense as SLE. I honestly think the next piece for Intrastate is an infill in Cranston wherever the RIPTA high capacity corridor crosses the NEC. Once both of those are done, Woonsocket begins to look left out.