Fenway Corners (Red Sox) | 1 Jersey Street | Fenway

These D'Angelo people blocked the development of a much-needed new Fenway Park back in the early 2000s and are now poised to benefit. Fenway has a limited life left of perhaps a few more decades. Then what will happen? We cant even built a new small soccer stadium in the urban core let alone a new ballpark - they are criminals and deserve only to live on in notorious infamy. Literally what eminent domain was invented for...
I'm very glad that Fenway was saved and renovated. To the extent that the D'Angelo family played a role in that, good for them.

Also, just getting rid of that parking lot on Brookline Ave. will be a huge win.
 
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Do the Red Sox already own rights to build over the pike, or would they need to get those rights somehow? Also, would it be possible to build a park over the pike from Brookline to Charlesgate or Mass Ave like with the Southwest Corridor or Greenway? What exactly would/could an air rights project look like on this stretch?

After considering it for a second, I'm thinking buildings along Brookline and Ipswich that open onto those streets? Could they connect Ipswich to Newbury?
There was a proposal in the early or perhaps mid-90s to build what amounted to a long greenhouse between Brookline Ave. and Mass Ave. above the Pike, along with some buildings and a new ball park. It never went anywhere, but I always really liked the idea of a year round garden above the Pike. The design even included a protected connection to the Hynes/Prudential complex. Had it been built, it would have been possible to walk from Kenmore Square to Copley Square entirely protected from the elements.
 
I'm in the "good for the D'Angelos" camp. In addition to maintaining and expanding a generational family business, they held out for decades against all offers and got themselves onto the masthead of a nine-figure development project that they'll continue to have some kind of stake in. Yeah, a lot of their buildings look shitty. That's life in the fabric of a city - things turn over block by block. Plus, I wouldn't give them too much grief for the condition of their real estate while also letting FSG off the hook for keeping so many undeveloped surface parking lots in place for almost 20 years (current ownership). FSG is still holding back a surface lot (on Van Ness) and a parking garage (on Ipswich) from this effort.
 
Do the Red Sox already own rights to build over the pike, or would they need to get those rights somehow? Also, would it be possible to build a park over the pike from Brookline to Charlesgate or Mass Ave like with the Southwest Corridor or Greenway? What exactly would/could an air rights project look like on this stretch?

After considering it for a second, I'm thinking buildings along Brookline and Ipswich that open onto those streets? Could they connect Ipswich to Newbury?
Yes, the Red Sox currently own development air-rights to Mass Pike parcels 8, 9 and 10. which is basically everything from the Brookline Ave bridge to Charlesgate. But an air rights project here would run into all the same issues that air rights projects everywhere run into.

Ipswich is at the same grade as the Pike and Worcester Line, so any future air rights project that fronts Ipswich would have step up and over the Pike and CR. That makes an active ground-level on Ipswich just about impossible. Stairs from Ipswich to Charlesgate are planned as part of Scape's development at 2 Charlesgate West, and some sort of footbridge or gerbil-tube from that at the grade of Charlesgate is probably the best hope of connecting Ipswich to anything above the Pike or N of it.
 
Yes, the Red Sox currently own development air-rights to Mass Pike parcels 8, 9 and 10. which is basically everything from the Brookline Ave bridge to Charlesgate. But an air rights project here would run into all the same issues that air rights projects everywhere run into.

Ipswich is at the same grade as the Pike and Worcester Line, so any future air rights project that fronts Ipswich would have step up and over the Pike and CR. That makes an active ground-level on Ipswich just about impossible. Stairs from Ipswich to Charlesgate are planned as part of Scape's development at 2 Charlesgate West, and some sort of footbridge or gerbil-tube from that at the grade of Charlesgate is probably the best hope of connecting Ipswich to anything above the Pike or N of it.

Are there any current plans for the Ipswich Street Garage as of now?
 
Now that I have had the day to sit with this, I have to put my baseball fan hat on for a spell. This will be emotional, subjective, and unsupported by evidence. Feel free to scroll right on through if you aren't feeling it.

The plan that's been articulated so far is fully meh to my eyes. Standard mixed use platitudes in a location that is anything but standard. The way I see it, this land is like Mookie Betts and this plan is like Alex Verdugo. Wow, maybe a hotel? Thrilling stuff. Can somebody please tell FSG that the luxury tax threshold is only a thing in baseball and not in real estate? That they have a singular asset in the Red Sox franchise, and that they would do well to treat their surrounding holdings as complementary not just to the neighborhood, but to their own asset as well? You're going to build out the land immediately surrounding Fenway Park, literally a once-in-a-century opportunity, and you're going to fill it with ... basically the same stuff it's already surrounded by?

The Globe piece linked in the OP says:

We are not some joint venture that is just looking to maximize height or density. We want to create value, but we have to make sure we do no harm to Fenway Park and the fan experience.

"Do no harm" really chafes me. When FSG bought the team, they took it upon themselves not just to "do no harm" to Fenway Park, but to preserve it and improve it. They largely did a commendable job over that first decade or so, but now they seem to be running out of steam. I suppose they feel that they have maximized their ROI on this asset. I can't help but disagree. In Fenway Park, you have one of three baseball destinations in the country capable of sustaining 365-day interest from locals and tourists alike, the others being Wrigley and Cooperstown. I think you could argue that it's the most significant American history site in the city proper that lies west of the Public Garden -- and if you don't buy that from me because it's "just" baseball, then take it up with Ken Burns.

As a cornerstone of any major development project with their name on it, FSG should be explaining what they are going to do to continue to preserve and improve Fenway Park and the fan experience, not just to "do no harm" to it. As we are constantly reminded while we squeeze into hundred-dollar seats on a concrete grandstand whose dimensions have been mostly unchanged since 1934, Fenway's footprint constitutes by far the smallest acreage of any MLB park. The music hall was at least an interesting idea from a development perspective, but it was a stunning waste of the only contiguous space available to them as a baseball franchise. All they seem to have added is a last-row function room at the top of the bleachers so that they can host more of what will certainly be the most garish weddings that any of us can ever hope to not be invited to.

The Globe briefly mentions the idea that the team might move its offices out of Jersey Street and the former Jeano Building, but to what end? "Freeing up concourse space" is squeezing blood from a stone at this point; they've cracked that nut as much as it will be cracked without taking the wrecking ball to the historical forms of the park's underbelly. Player amenities are always in short supply because of the space constraints, but that doesn't move the needle for regular visitors. More restaurants, some high-roller club space, a team store? You have all of that already, or you've just committed to building more of it in practically every compass direction. Where is the creativity, where is the stewardship of history, where is the commitment to public access, even if paid, to this national treasure?

I will continue to beat the drum for a year-round team hall of fame and museum on-site because it just seems to be such a no-brainer, and frankly shocking to me that it doesn't already exist. They should put it on either the Lansdowne parcel or the Jersey parcel, then tunnel a wiiiiide concourse underneath the street (think Logan Terminal A) to provide access directly into the park for museum visitors. Fenway tours are well and good enough as they are, but not by themselves a genuine attraction that draws real traffic to the neighborhood and probably not worth the price of entry. Those of us who care about these things have been fairly disgusted by Major League Baseball's shameful treatment of its minor league system, effectively taking organized baseball away from dozens of communities around the country where it had served as a gateway for a new generation of young fans. Where MLB has failed, the Red Sox should take the lead. Build a family friendly year-round attraction to complement the park, and those of us with kids interested in the sport and who live close by would be annual pass holders sight unseen. We would spend our days there the way one goes to the Children's Museum or the MOS. We would be far from the only ones, I assure you.

It has always been a concern of Fenway neighbors and the diehard fans alike that the gameday experience and the neighborhood at large would become some Disney-fied version of Red Sox Nation. Now that they've started to air these plans, I can't believe how much the Disney-fication has been turned down, to the point of being practically absent. With an opportunity to put a stamp on their surroundings, they're really just going to build more of the same, and I can't believe it. It's an incredible swing and a miss for everyone involved.
 
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Now that I have had the day to sit with this, I have to put my baseball fan hat on for a spell. This will be emotional, subjective, and unsupported by evidence. Feel free to scroll right on through if you aren't feeling it.

The plan that's been articulated so far is fully meh to my eyes. Standard mixed use platitudes in a location that is anything but standard. The way I see it, this land is like Mookie Betts and this plan is like Alex Verdugo. Wow, maybe a hotel? Thrilling stuff. Can somebody please tell FSG that the luxury tax threshold is only a thing in baseball and not in real estate? That they have a singular asset in the Red Sox franchise, and that they would do well to treat their surrounding holdings as complementary not just to the neighborhood, but to their own asset as well? You're going to build out the land immediately surrounding Fenway Park, literally a once-in-a-century opportunity, and you're going to fill it with ... basically the same stuff it's already surrounded by?

The Globe piece linked in the OP says:



"Do no harm" really chafes me. When FSG bought the team, they took it upon themselves not just to "do no harm" to Fenway Park, but to preserve it and improve it. They largely did a commendable job over that first decade or so, but now they seem to be running out of steam. I suppose they feel that they have maximized their ROI on this asset. I can't help but disagree. In Fenway Park, you have one of three baseball destinations in the country capable of sustaining 365-day interest from locals and tourists alike, the others being Wrigley and Cooperstown. I think you could argue that it's the most significant American history site in the city proper that lies west of the Public Garden -- and if you don't buy that from me because it's "just" baseball, then take it up with Ken Burns.

As a cornerstone of any major development project with their name on it, FSG should be explaining what they are going to do to continue to preserve and improve Fenway Park and the fan experience, not just to "do no harm" to it. As we are constantly reminded while we squeeze into hundred-dollar seats on a concrete grandstand whose dimensions have been mostly unchanged since 1934, Fenway's footprint constitutes by far the smallest acreage of any MLB park. The music hall was at least an interesting idea from a development perspective, but it was a stunning waste of the only contiguous space available to them as a baseball franchise. All they seem to have added is a last-row function room at the top of the bleachers so that they can host more of what will certainly be the most garish weddings that any of us can ever hope to not be invited to.

The Globe briefly mentions the idea that the team might move its offices out of Jersey Street and the former Jeano Building, but to what end? "Freeing up concourse space" is squeezing blood from a stone at this point; they've cracked that nut as much as it will be cracked without taking the wrecking ball to the historical forms of the park's underbelly. Player amenities are always in short supply because of the space constraints, but that doesn't move the needle for regular visitors. More restaurants, some high-roller club space, a team store? You have all of that already, or you've just committed to building more of it in practically every compass direction. Where is the creativity, where is the stewardship of history, where is the commitment to public access, even if paid, to this national treasure?

I will continue to beat the drum for a year-round team hall of fame and museum on-site because it just seems to be such a no-brainer, and frankly shocking to me that it doesn't already exist. They should put it on either the Lansdowne parcel or the Jersey parcel, then tunnel a wiiiiide concourse underneath the street (think Logan Terminal A) to provide access directly into the park for museum visitors. Fenway tours are well and good enough as they are, but not by themselves a genuine attraction that draws real traffic to the neighborhood and probably not worth the price of entry. Those of us who care about these things have been fairly disgusted by Major League Baseball's shameful treatment of its minor league system, effectively taking organized baseball away from dozens of communities around the country where it had served as a gateway for a new generation of young fans. Where MLB has failed, the Red Sox should take the lead. Build a family friendly year-round attraction to complement the park, and those of us with kids interested in the sport and who live close by would be annual pass holders sight unseen. We would spend our days there the way one goes to the Children's Museum or the MOS. We would be far from the only ones, I assure you.

It has always been a concern of Fenway neighbors and the diehard fans alike that the gameday experience and the neighborhood at large would become some Disney-fied version of Red Sox Nation. Now that they've started to air these plans, I can't believe how much the Disney-fication has been turned down, to the point of being practically absent. With an opportunity to put a stamp on their surroundings, they're really just going to build more of the same, and I can't believe it. It's an incredible swing and a miss for everyone involved.
Damn...This a stone in your shoe...I like it though...Nice job sir...
 
Not sure I agree with everything ErnieAdams had to say, but certainly a good deal of it. Fenway Park is a treasure and everything on the abutting streets should play to that without a doubt.
In Fenway Park, you have one of three baseball destinations in the country capable of sustaining 365-day interest from locals and tourists alike, the others being Wrigley and Cooperstown.
A baseball museum of similar quality to Cooperstown would be very successful across the street from Fenway Park.
I will continue to beat the drum for a year-round team hall of fame and museum on-site because it just seems to be such a no-brainer, and frankly shocking to me that it doesn't already exist.
Yes, this!
 
Now that I have had the day to sit with this, I have to put my baseball fan hat on for a spell. This will be emotional, subjective, and unsupported by evidence. Feel free to scroll right on through if you aren't feeling it.

The plan that's been articulated so far is fully meh to my eyes. Standard mixed use platitudes in a location that is anything but standard. The way I see it, this land is like Mookie Betts and this plan is like Alex Verdugo. Wow, maybe a hotel? Thrilling stuff. Can somebody please tell FSG that the luxury tax threshold is only a thing in baseball and not in real estate? That they have a singular asset in the Red Sox franchise, and that they would do well to treat their surrounding holdings as complementary not just to the neighborhood, but to their own asset as well? You're going to build out the land immediately surrounding Fenway Park, literally a once-in-a-century opportunity, and you're going to fill it with ... basically the same stuff it's already surrounded by?

The Globe piece linked in the OP says:



"Do no harm" really chafes me. When FSG bought the team, they took it upon themselves not just to "do no harm" to Fenway Park, but to preserve it and improve it. They largely did a commendable job over that first decade or so, but now they seem to be running out of steam. I suppose they feel that they have maximized their ROI on this asset. I can't help but disagree. In Fenway Park, you have one of three baseball destinations in the country capable of sustaining 365-day interest from locals and tourists alike, the others being Wrigley and Cooperstown. I think you could argue that it's the most significant American history site in the city proper that lies west of the Public Garden -- and if you don't buy that from me because it's "just" baseball, then take it up with Ken Burns.

As a cornerstone of any major development project with their name on it, FSG should be explaining what they are going to do to continue to preserve and improve Fenway Park and the fan experience, not just to "do no harm" to it. As we are constantly reminded while we squeeze into hundred-dollar seats on a concrete grandstand whose dimensions have been mostly unchanged since 1934, Fenway's footprint constitutes by far the smallest acreage of any MLB park. The music hall was at least an interesting idea from a development perspective, but it was a stunning waste of the only contiguous space available to them as a baseball franchise. All they seem to have added is a last-row function room at the top of the bleachers so that they can host more of what will certainly be the most garish weddings that any of us can ever hope to not be invited to.

The Globe briefly mentions the idea that the team might move its offices out of Jersey Street and the former Jeano Building, but to what end? "Freeing up concourse space" is squeezing blood from a stone at this point; they've cracked that nut as much as it will be cracked without taking the wrecking ball to the historical forms of the park's underbelly. Player amenities are always in short supply because of the space constraints, but that doesn't move the needle for regular visitors. More restaurants, some high-roller club space, a team store? You have all of that already, or you've just committed to building more of it in practically every compass direction. Where is the creativity, where is the stewardship of history, where is the commitment to public access, even if paid, to this national treasure?

I will continue to beat the drum for a year-round team hall of fame and museum on-site because it just seems to be such a no-brainer, and frankly shocking to me that it doesn't already exist. They should put it on either the Lansdowne parcel or the Jersey parcel, then tunnel a wiiiiide concourse underneath the street (think Logan Terminal A) to provide access directly into the park for museum visitors. Fenway tours are well and good enough as they are, but not by themselves a genuine attraction that draws real traffic to the neighborhood and probably not worth the price of entry. Those of us who care about these things have been fairly disgusted by Major League Baseball's shameful treatment of its minor league system, effectively taking organized baseball away from dozens of communities around the country where it had served as a gateway for a new generation of young fans. Where MLB has failed, the Red Sox should take the lead. Build a family friendly year-round attraction to complement the park, and those of us with kids interested in the sport and who live close by would be annual pass holders sight unseen. We would spend our days there the way one goes to the Children's Museum or the MOS. We would be far from the only ones, I assure you.

It has always been a concern of Fenway neighbors and the diehard fans alike that the gameday experience and the neighborhood at large would become some Disney-fied version of Red Sox Nation. Now that they've started to air these plans, I can't believe how much the Disney-fication has been turned down, to the point of being practically absent. With an opportunity to put a stamp on their surroundings, they're really just going to build more of the same, and I can't believe it. It's an incredible swing and a miss for everyone involved.


I love your ideas and passion, there Ernie. However, I am haunted by the thought regarding this development that John Henry sees the writing on the wall regarding the future popularity of Baseball vs. the sport where YOU work. :)
 

1611954484236.png
 
Whoa. Cant wait to see the renders.

See, tight vibrant alleys with cafe's and breweries and shopping isn't that hard. Hopefully this can be a very vibrant, outgoing area. (Looks a bit European-esque to me?). But loving that design
 
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BBJ has a few more renders (all from WS Development):

Looking N up Jersey from the corner of Jersey and Van Ness:
1611955811244.png


Looking S down Jersey from corner of Jersey and Brookline:
1611955859714.png


I love that they're keeping the old bank building at the corner of Brookline and Jersey, and trashing everything else S of that along Jersey. The redone Arthur's Way in Equilibria's screenshot looks great too.

Also very interesting that the Sox and WS highlight Pike Parcel 8 as a "Development Parcel." The original announcement back in October was 5 acres of terra firma, now it's 8 acres including the air rights.
 
Wow, looks like what Downtown Crossing woulda, shoulda, coulda been.
 
Wow, even the gerbil tube looks fine in that! Wonder how they are going to block that off on game days, though. Truly gone are the days of the ol' smoker's paradise/prison.
 
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Roaming the comment section, we have the NIMBY, in it's natural habitat. Complaining about lack of a library in the plans. The NIMBY, is about to be devoured by the carnivorous "reasoned commenter" in the comment response below
IMG_5586.jpg
.
 
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I have a feeling when the proposal comes out it will be transformative and actually gorgeous.

We all have to serve a duty to bombard the BPDA with good comments in support of the project to offset the inevitable NIMBYs who you know will complain for desolate open spaces. (like it's not a 10 minute walk to the charles...) Granted this project comes out nice.
 
Wow, looks like what Downtown Crossing woulda, shoulda, coulda been.

Gee, you think that has anything to do with the fact that there are more than [checks notes] ... THREE major commercial property owners in DTX?

<i.e., when compared to the three in Fenway that have conjured up this scheme>

It just might be possible that it's (massively massively massively) more difficult to harmonize into a collective vision for a dense urban district when there are (almost certainly way way way way) more than a trio of major players on the scene.
 
Gee, you think that has anything to do with the fact that there are more than [checks notes] ... THREE major commercial property owners in DTX?

<i.e., when compared to the three in Fenway that have conjured up this scheme>

It just might be possible that it's (massively massively massively) more difficult to harmonize into a collective vision for a dense urban district when there are (almost certainly way way way way) more than a trio of major players on the scene.
We have exactly that problem in Chinatown. Surface parking lots sit undeveloped because the lots are actually owned by 5, 6, 7 absentee family associations, who won't play nice with each other. Each family owns one or two row house size lots, often scattered in different parking areas.
 

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