Retated Beal (née P&G)| 244-248 A Street | Fort Point

Beton Brut

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According to this graphic almost half the site is over the I90 tunnel. What affect will this have on density, height, and type of uses, if any?
This portion of the I-90 tunnel was precast in large sections and slid into place by giant hydraulic jacks. Recognizing that proximity to water, the flightpath of jets departing from Logan 9/27, and the geotechnical properties of filled land must also be considered I imagine we'll see a scale similar to the Bulfinch Triangle.

NB: I'm not an engineer.
 

stellarfun

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The Globe article mentioned there was about one million square feet of building that could be constructed. Assuming, 4.5 acres of the 6.5 acre site are built on, that's a building footprint of about 200,000 sq ft, more or less. Five floors gets you to a million GSF, six to 1.2 million GSF.
 

odurandina

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This post will doubtless incite consternation from the usual gang of unfriendlies.

Ain't a crisis. But they aren't encouraging that Big City feel right here.

This is way too conservative planning here. Go taller and leave out some of that land for the future.

i assume the 21 story Seven Channel Center proposal was disappeared with that mindset.
 

JohnAKeith

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I was curious how many new workers would be in that area at full build-out.

1,000,000 square feet @175 square feet/employee (found it on the internet) = 5,715 employees

How many were going into the GE buildings? 800?

These would all be new employees.

That's a lot of additional traffic on A Street and Congress St, depending on destination.
 

Jouhou

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This post will doubtless incite consternation from the usual gang of unfriendlies.

Ain't a crisis. But they aren't encouraging that Big City feel right here.

This is way too conservative planning here. Go taller and leave out some of that land for the future.

i assume the 21 story Seven Channel Center proposal was disappeared with that mindset.
Dude, the FAA max is only 300' here. And from what I can tell, nothing has been proposed yet for us to tell whether or not they are going to that max. 300' doesn't tend to meet much opposition when not located next to a single family residential neighborhood.
 

jklo

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That's a lot of additional traffic on A Street and Congress St, depending on destination.
Well, this land is currently a parking lot, so....

I do wonder if Related Beal is too late to build before the cycle ends although this is such a great spot that perhaps that doesn't matter.
 

FitchburgLine

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Well, this land is currently a parking lot, so....

I do wonder if Related Beal is too late to build before the cycle ends although this is such a great spot that perhaps that doesn't matter.
Fair enough, but lots of people were saying the cycle was peaking in 2016.
 

stellarfun

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This parcel is similar to those on the Greenway, as the jacked-in-place tunnel was not designed as a load-bearing structure. Which means one has to cantilever the weight of a structure built atop the tunnel. Which becomes increasingly expensive and complex the more weight one cantilevers. And, unlike Manhattan, bedrock is not very close to the surface.

If Related Beal indicates that the 6.5 acre site will support about one million gross square feet, and it paid $200+ million on that basis, it did so knowing the limitations of the site with respect to mass and height.

So, IMO, what you can build here, given the limitations, is ultra high-end residential, lab space, or commercial office space pre-sold to a corporate owner who can brand the building and cares not that much about the price.
_____________________
Edited to add this paragraph from an article in today's Globe on the sale of three lab buildings in Kendall Square.

Financial terms were not disclosed, but sources familiar with the deal said Harrison and Bulfinch will pay $1.1 billion for a 90 percent stake in the 679,000-square-foot complex, which includes a 650-space parking garage. That sum, which equates to about $1,625 per square foot, would smash [sic] recent records for office building deals in Boston, which have generally topped out at around $1,000 a square foot. Earlier this year, Alexandria Real Estate Equities sold a majority stake in one of its new buildings on Binney Street in Kendall Square in a deal worth $1,880 per square foot.
https://www.bostonglobe.com/busines...or-reported/kYksBT78MCHos1aCTAYhoK/story.html
 
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HarvardP

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Heres a massing model of this lot, plus Walsh’s coastal resiliency plan.

Maybe I put too much Bailey's in my coffee this morning, but what about filling in the Bass River/Fort Point Channel instead of these adorable waterside mini-parks? Look at the marshes around us, the great natural buffers against storm surge and erosion, do they look anything like these man-made mitigation efforts? No, these efforts look pretty on paper, pleasing to neighbors, pointless for coastal protection. Fill it in up to Northern Ave, extend the Bass River drainage pipe that currently ends at W 4th St to the new waterfront, huge new area for green space, development, maybe even a tram?

Seriously, is Irish coffee not the best?
 

stellarfun

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Maybe I put too much Bailey's in my coffee this morning, but what about filling in the Bass River/Fort Point Channel instead of these adorable waterside mini-parks? Look at the marshes around us, the great natural buffers against storm surge and erosion, do they look anything like these man-made mitigation efforts? No, these efforts look pretty on paper, pleasing to neighbors, pointless for coastal protection. Fill it in up to Northern Ave, extend the Bass River drainage pipe that currently ends at W 4th St to the new waterfront, huge new area for green space, development, maybe even a tram?
https://www.epa.gov/cwa-404/permit-program-under-cwa-section-404
 

HarvardP

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Something about going to the Army Corps of Engineers for the permit turns my stomach. They ruined rivers from Maine to Washington and largely passed the buck on rectifying the mistakes.
 

JohnAKeith

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Lol.

According to the agreement filed with the deed, the buyer (Related-Beal) will have abide by a previously-approved agreement that Gillette or GE agreed to, to have 0.7 parking spaces per 1,000-square feet of commercial/industrial/cultural space and 1.0 parking spaces per residential unit, so that's potentially 7,000 more cars on A Street.

The current parking lot is 1,256 spaces, according to online sources.

Add Alexandria's build-out next door and ..

Well, this land is currently a parking lot, so....

I do wonder if Related Beal is too late to build before the cycle ends although this is such a great spot that perhaps that doesn't matter.
 

jklo

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According to the agreement filed with the deed, the buyer (Related-Beal) will have abide by a previously-approved agreement that Gillette or GE agreed to, to have 0.7 parking spaces per 1,000-square feet of commercial/industrial/cultural space and 1.0 parking spaces per residential unit, so that's potentially 7,000 more cars on A Street.
I don't see how they could fit that much parking plus the building structure in there.
 

JohnAKeith

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There are a few neighbors and they have been vocal, a long time ago (YR 1999 & 2000) and now, including some on this board.

The homeowners down A Street at the Channel Center have raised a ruckus before, when the Indycar race was under consideration and, for better or worse, there are residential units in the Midway Studios, 326 A Street, and now at 63 Melcher (apartments) and at 346 Congress around 300 feet down the street.

There are still residents who live in the neighborhood from back when the 100 Acre Plan was built and they would be on-board with following those plans. Those who have moved to the Fort Point since then probably don't care (young and renting) (or, old and part-timers).


Just curious, but what neighbors are they speaking of? Its a parking lot surrounded by an industrial area. Does the "Where the Sun Don't Shine Preservation Committee" or the "Wharf Rat Alliance" really have standing to make demands in this location?
 

JohnAKeith

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No, but thank you for making me check the numbers on what's there now vs. possible. I can't imagine that much parking b/c it's on top of the tunnel, as mentioned.

Regarding the market, I think because of whom the buyer is (Related-Beal) and where the project is located (prime real estate), the state of the market might be of limited concern. It seems they have their hands full with many projects so this could even be a 5-10 year plan?

I don't see how they could fit that much parking plus the building structure in there.
 

JohnAKeith

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FINAL COMMENT I PROMISE: the agreement filed with the deed also seems to restrict what RBCS can build on the site. "Purchaser acknowledges that the Gillette Property is to be used only for industrial or commercial use ..." unless the Seller (Gillette) agrees, or doesn't disagree, from at least what I see.

I would guess this is because a residential use could lead to fights with owners/renters and/or because of land mitigation concerns?
 

stellarfun

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Lol.

According to the agreement filed with the deed, the buyer (Related-Beal) will have abide by a previously-approved agreement that Gillette or GE agreed to, to have 0.7 parking spaces per 1,000-square feet of commercial/industrial/cultural space and 1.0 parking spaces per residential unit, so that's potentially 7,000 more cars on A Street.

The current parking lot is 1,256 spaces, according to online sources.

Add Alexandria's build-out next door and ..
A million square feet is 700 spaces, not 7000.
 

stellarfun

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Related Beal unveils new plan for the Gillette parking lots.

Instead of four buildings on the site, as originally planned, there would be three, with two of them rising as high as 180 feet. They would be aligned differently than first envisioned, to create more pedestrian pathways and minimize construction directly above the Ted Williams Tunnel, which cuts beneath the site. There would be more green space and less parking. And there would be a 5-foot grade designed to protect both the low-lying site and its surroundings from rising waters ..
....
the lab building — 400,000 square feet — and a midrise office building — 334,000 square feet — it wants to put on the site. It hasn’t decided whether the 18-story residential building will be for apartments or condominiums
 

George_Apley

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On first glance, this looks like a major improvement over previous plans.
 

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