Stadium & Riverwalk | Tidewater Landing | Pawtucket

Rover

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Rhode Island politicians are out of their minds if they make this deal. Pretty soon they'll be paying as much for a soccer stadium for a low level league as they would have to keep the Pawsox.
 

kingofsheeba

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It looks like this project is moving forward with the approval of a new funding plan from the state. No additional public funding (yet),
but most of the funds that were initially to be used for the non-stadium phase of the plan will be applied up front to the building of the stadium.

https://www.bostonglobe.com/2022/07...ing-tidewater-landing-soccer-stadium-project/
I’m not sure about this. It feels like Pawtucket will end up with nothing and USF is a joke in itself. This is all a mea cupla for dropping the ball on the PawSox. There’s also no retail or residential included in this plan.

My advice? Either hope that the MiLB and Manfred get a goddamn grip and revive single-A affiliate baseball and move the Spinners from Lowell down there. Or build and Apex Entertainment Center there.
 

Equilibria

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I’m not sure about this. It feels like Pawtucket will end up with nothing and USF is a joke in itself. This is all a mea cupla for dropping the ball on the PawSox. There’s also no retail or residential included in this plan.

My advice? Either hope that the MiLB and Manfred get a goddamn grip and revive single-A affiliate baseball and move the Spinners from Lowell down there. Or build and Apex Entertainment Center there.
RI should have started working Kraft for the Revolution the moment the PawSox announced their move, if they were bound and determined to blow public money on pro sports.
 
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The Lowell Spinners are no more as they were eliminated two years ago with the contraction of MLB associated minor league baseball. It has been reported that LeLacheur Park would need some $30M+ for upgrades in order to just attempt to attract another team. It looks like the City of Lowell is throwing in the towel as it just approved a sale of the venue to UMass-Lowell for $1M. The school has commited that is will immediately spend $1M to make upgrades so its NCAA D1 baseball team can play there. This follows a similar path to Tsongas Arena which the city earlier sold to the university. The arena is home to its NCAA D1 River Hawks hockey team and occasionally hosts other non school events.



There was once hope that McCoy Stadium in Pawtucket would get a lower level MLB associated minor league team. An owner of the Worcester Red Sox submitted a bid which would likely have meant he had the necessary WooSox approval. The same contraction of the minor league system which eliminated the Spinners however also likely doomed a new Pawtucket team. McCoy Stadium has sat empty for two years and it appears it is headed to demolition. The City of Pawtucket is looking to build a new single unified high school there after its plans to rehab its two aging high schools was rejected by the state. With one of the high shool's football stadiums right next to McCoy and little other open space for development left in the city, the site of the unused McCoy looks to be the future location of a new high school.
 
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The City of Pawtucket is in negotiations to purchase a sliver of land along the river just south of the Tidewater Landing project. It would be on the west bank along the Riverside Cemetery. My guess if acquired, it would be part of the long term path plan for the Blackstone River Bikeway. One would think a similar strategy could be extended in Providence through the Swan Point Cemetery, Butler Hospital grounds and Blackstone Park/River Road. Pawtucket has already built a small portion behind city hall and by Slater Mill. It has bought land north along the river between the Green & Daniels complex (where Collette has offices) on Central Ave and Tolman High on Exchange Street. The roughly 11 mile off road section from Cumberland to the River's Edge complex in Woonsocket is now the longest off road stretch of the Blackstone River Bikeway. A small 1 mile section is now open in Providence from India Point Park to Pittman Street. Another .6 mile section is open in the north end of Woonsocket by Cold Spring Park at the state line. Work is ongoing there on the MA side to connect it to the existing 3.7 mile stretch through Blackstone, Millville, and S Uxbridge. The former Blackstone Viaduct railroad bridges are being rehabbed to carry it some .5 miles to connect the other two sections which would then create a continuous 4.8 mile off road path.


 
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BBascule

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Here are some additional stadium renderings updated with the team's branding.

I'm torn about this project. I hate public money for stadium projects. I love this sport.
I'm happy that Pawtucket will get a team and hope that the owners can build the family atmosphere that visitors liked about McCoy Stadium.

I'm not sure about the location of the stadium. It feels disconnected from existing/future infrastructure such as the MBTA station. The industrial cleanup was absolutely necessary,
but I wonder if that land would've been better served as a beautiful riverside park.

I also wonder about the proposed edge along the waterfront. It's hard to tell exactly what's intended, but would it be better to create a natural edge that
could absorb high water and allow wildlife to colonize?

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Arenacale

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What is the attendance for this level of soccer, generally? That place looks big for what I feel like they'll be able to actually draw.
 

Lrfox

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Those are sharp renderings and it would look great if built as rendered (I love the black). It's still hard not to be skeptical of the whole thing though. I just question their ability to make the numbers work.

The timing kind of sucks because PC built/opened Anderson Stadium not all that long ago and I doubt they have any interest in playing somewhere else less then 10 years after opening a soccer specific stadium. But it would have potentially been mutually beneficial if they could have worked out an arrangement for the Friars Soccer team (at least the men's) to play home games at Tidewater. Tidewater would get an additional slate of events and PC would get a pretty impressive home venue with a larger capacity, alcohol sales, and the potential to draw bigger crowds. The Friar logo would look great against the black structure in those renderings too. Personally, I'd be more intrigued to watch tier level college soccer than the USL.
 
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Those are sharp renderings and it would look great if built as rendered (I love the black). It's still hard not to be skeptical of the whole thing though. I just question their ability to make the numbers work.

The timing kind of sucks because PC built/opened Anderson Stadium not all that long ago and I doubt they have any interest in playing somewhere else less then 10 years after opening a soccer specific stadium. But it would have potentially been mutually beneficial if they could have worked out an arrangement for the Friars Soccer team (at least the men's) to play home games at Tidewater. Tidewater would get an additional slate of events and PC would get a pretty impressive home venue with a larger capacity, alcohol sales, and the potential to draw bigger crowds. The Friar logo would look great against the black structure in those renderings too. Personally, I'd be more intrigued to watch tier level college soccer than the USL.

I would think if any college athletics events were held there, Brown football might be the most likely. Brown Stadium is already 1.75 miles from the main gates of the Brown campus. It is old with few comforts and no permanent field lighting with some neighbors also recently complaining about the side effects of games there. Tidewater Landing is only 3.5 miles from the Brown gates. It would offer adequate seating capacity, night games, and far more comforts in a modern up to date facility for Brown.
 

Lrfox

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I would think if any college athletics events were held there, Brown football might be the most likely. Brown Stadium is already 1.75 miles from the main gates of the Brown campus. It is old with few comforts and no permanent field lighting with some neighbors also recently complaining about the side effects of games there. Tidewater Landing is only 3.5 miles from the Brown gates. It would offer adequate seating capacity, night games, and far more comforts in a modern up to date facility for Brown.
Your logic makes sense, but I think the seating capacity might be a deal breaker Brown. Tidewater's 7,500 capacity should be OK for most games, but it isn't enough for the Brown Bears' signature event - the Harvard game - which regularly draws in the realm of 10,000 fans (or more). I have a hard time imagining the University hamstringing themselves like that just to play somewhere a bit nicer. And while the current stadium is certainly an uncomfortable relic, it is historic and I can see that carrying a lot of weight for a storied Ivy League institution like Brown who might view moving to a new modern facility as "selling their soul." That's why I thought PC would have made sense (prior to Anderson, anyway) given their relatively recent rise to prominence in soccer and their existing willingness to play off campus in a larger, modern(ish), non-school owned facility.

Admittedly, I know nothing about lacrosse. So if PC or Brown (or someone else) has a program that's good enough to warrant playing in a larger stadium, maybe that'd work. But if not, I just don't see any local college taking advantage of the new space.
 
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Your logic makes sense, but I think the seating capacity might be a deal breaker Brown. Tidewater's 7,500 capacity should be OK for most games, but it isn't enough for the Brown Bears' signature event - the Harvard game - which regularly draws in the realm of 10,000 fans (or more). I have a hard time imagining the University hamstringing themselves like that just to play somewhere a bit nicer. And while the current stadium is certainly an uncomfortable relic, it is historic and I can see that carrying a lot of weight for a storied Ivy League institution like Brown who might view moving to a new modern facility as "selling their soul." That's why I thought PC would have made sense (prior to Anderson, anyway) given their relatively recent rise to prominence in soccer and their existing willingness to play off campus in a larger, modern(ish), non-school owned facility.

Admittedly, I know nothing about lacrosse. So if PC or Brown (or someone else) has a program that's good enough to warrant playing in a larger stadium, maybe that'd work. But if not, I just don't see any local college taking advantage of the new space.
Where did you get Tidewater Landing's capacity at 7,500? I have seen mentions that they project average soccer attendance of about 7,500 per game but capacity has been typically listed in the 10-11k range. This is the language from the agenda the RI Commerce Board voted on back in August-2022.
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HenryAlan

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What is the attendance for this level of soccer, generally? That place looks big for what I feel like they'll be able to actually draw.
USL games averaged over 5K attendance per game last season. Not sure how big this stadium is, but it should probably be built to hold 7,500 to 10,000 spectators.
 

Lrfox

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Where did you get Tidewater Landing's capacity at 7,500? I have seen mentions that they project average soccer attendance of about 7,500 per game but capacity has been typically listed in the 10-11k range. This is the language from the agenda the RI Commerce Board voted on back in August-2022.
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Wikipedia's entry on the team says 7,500 for some reason. The Team's website also says 10k. So I'd definitely go with your number. 10k would make a more sense for Brown Football, but it would still be a 50% cut compared to the current capacity and the Harvard game often sees well over 10k fans. On top of everything else I mentioned before, I just don't see Brown having much interest.
 

BBascule

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That place looks big for what I feel like they'll be able to actually draw.
I imagine the stadium will draw well in the first couple of years based on novelty alone, and then the attendance will adjust according to
  • how well the team is received
  • accessibility of the stadium
  • on-field success
  • prices, etc
Even at its lowest, PawSox attendance still averaged 5-6k.
Much of the sustained success will depend on partnerships the ownership group forges with various parts of the community.

It will be interesting to see how the experience compares to a New England Revolution game.
 

MjolnirMan

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I would think if any college athletics events were held there, Brown football might be the most likely. Brown Stadium is already 1.75 miles from the main gates of the Brown campus. It is old with few comforts and no permanent field lighting with some neighbors also recently complaining about the side effects of games there. Tidewater Landing is only 3.5 miles from the Brown gates. It would offer adequate seating capacity, night games, and far more comforts in a modern up to date facility for Brown.
I agree with everything Lrfox said, with the addition that distance from the Van Wickle gates means very little from a practical perspective. The stadium is less than 3000 feet from all the main athletic fields and is easily walkable for many students by being centrally located in the densely-residential East Side neighborhood.
 

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