Does Boston really need the E line anymore?

[Ron Newman]

I bet Roslindale would gladly take an Orange Line extension in order to get huge numbers of buses off Washington Street between there and Forest Hills.

 

[statler]

I'd bet you would be wrong.

While there would be fewer people opposed than in W. Roxbury, there is still a large population of people who fear that rapid transit would make Roslindale "too urban" and bring in the ""wrong element".

 

[ablarc]

To be fair, there was a ton of political will behind tearing down the Central Artery. That thing was hated from the day it was erected.

Maybe not so much. Everyone found it convenient as it was --until it grew so crowded that it inched bumper-to-bumper most daylight hours.

When you could whiz by on it, it was a thrilling ride. Because it zoomed so close to buildings, it was like flying through the City of the Future; you could see folks sitting at their desks.

And it took a few decades for the bird guano to accumulate beneath.

At the risk of sounding geriatric, I'll divulge I mentioned burying the highway to Bob Campbell, back when he still had hair. Since the idea was both preposterous and unfamiliar, he naturally pooh-poohed it for practical reasons.

It was the first mention of the idea that I'm personally aware of, but I'm sure he became an early supporter.

Later I repented; Sundays and summer evenings, it was a great thrill-ride for out-of-town visitors, and I knew I would miss showing it off. It was so big-city Boston --everything the Greenway isn't.

Plus the Big Dig promised less traffic congestion. So it had the unified urban/suburban/business nexus going for it.

After a while.

It was the congestion on the elevated roadway that really sold the concept, though no doubt there was a growing aesthetic component.

 

[statler]

I seem to remember reading that the South Station tunnel was a last minute change due a lot of negative feedback on the Artery.
But that long before I was born, so I'm more than willing to defer to your recollection.

 

[ablarc]

Not sure I know what you mean by the South Station Tunnel.

Edit: Oh, are you referring to the tunnel that was part of the original Central Artery?

I don't go back that far.

 

[statler]

Yeah, that was the tunnel I was referring to. I'll see if I can find a source for that tid-bit. I did a lot of reading about the CA and Big Dig when it was under construction, so I can't remember what I read where.

Edit: The Dewey Square Tunnel is the proper name I guess.

From an un-sourced Wikipedia entry:

Because of public outcry during construction in the late 1950s, it was decided by then-Governor John A. Volpe that the final section of the artery was to be put underground from just south of Congress Street to Kneeland Street near Boston's Chinatown section.

 

[belmont square]

I bet Roslindale would gladly take an Orange Line extension in order to get huge numbers of buses off Washington Street between there and Forest Hills.

Getting huge numbers of buses off of Washington Street would only be accomplished by turning Roslindale Station into the new bus terminal for the 7 or 8 routes that use that stretch of Washington. And you'd probably need a layover space in Roslindale for a few Orange Line trainsets. Not clear that supporters would carry the day.

 

[HenryAlan]

Not sure I know what you mean by the South Station Tunnel.

Edit: Oh, are you referring to the tunnel that was part of the original Central Artery?

I don't go back that far.

I loved the South Station Tunnel, along with what you've described about the elevated portion. It was incredibly thrilling to approach the city from the south. Suddenly the skyline would rear up in front of you, then just as quickly you would swoosh underground, a minute or two later to emerge in the middle of all the building's you had just seen.

 

[HenryAlan]

Getting huge numbers of buses off of Washington Street would only be accomplished by turning Roslindale Station into the new bus terminal for the 7 or 8 routes that use that stretch of Washington. And you'd probably need a layover space in Roslindale for a few Orange Line trainsets. Not clear that supporters would carry the day.

The layover would be where it is now, which is between Forest Hills and Roslindale Square. An OL extension to Roslindale would be a stub end where the train would reverse direction either to go back into town, or to go to Forest Hills yard. It would be an incredibly easy and inexpensive extension. Most of the buses would just turn at Adams Park, so no new infrastructure would be required beyond the OL platform and fare gates.

 

[statler]

I loved the South Station Tunnel, along with what you've described about the elevated portion. It was incredibly thrilling to approach the city from the south. Suddenly the skyline would rear up in front of you, then just as quickly you would swoosh underground, a minute or two later to emerge in the middle of all the building's you had just seen.

That's very true, but I will say the merge right before the tunnel sucked!

 

[belmont square]

It would be an incredibly easy and inexpensive extension. Most of the buses would just turn at Adams Park, so no new infrastructure would be required beyond the OL platform and fare gates.

Inexpensive? You'd need to add two new tracks beyond Forest Hills (there's currently only one carrying the Needham CR line).

Buses could just turn at Adams Park, but that would make this the only terminal transfer point where passengers were required to walk 3 blocks to access their connecting bus. You may also have trouble convincing the business owners adjacent to Adams Park that idling buses on Poplar Street are preferable to customer parking. The quality of that park space would also be signficantly degraded if all the activity at the Forest Hills Washington Street busway was transfered to Adams Park.