General MBTA Topics (Multi Modal, Budget, MassDOT)

mass88 said:
Hopefully the MBTA moves this critical infrastructure to a safer location.
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Generally speaking, signal infrastructure must be near the signals. And generally speaking, signals must be next to the tracks. Also has to be within MBTA owned right of way.
 
HelloBostonHi said:
Generally speaking, signal infrastructure must be near the signals. And generally speaking, signals must be next to the tracks. Also has to be within MBTA owned right of way.
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They've already consolidated a lot of the signal plant in that spot into these bungaloes for easier servicing. On the plus side, consolidated hardware means the intensive repairs can go faster than if there were damage to relays all sprawled out over a couple acres. On the minus side, that train literally hit a hole-in-one on most disabling possible place to derail. Literally a dozen feet in either direction would've spared the bungaloes from getting struck.

On balance, though, consolidated plant is so much easier that it's well worth the single-point risk. This is a derailment you probably couldn't repeat in terms of specific lineside damage profile in a simulator 99,999 times out of 100,000. The derailment itself may have a cause, but the exact strike point is pure fluke.
 
ulrichomega said:
Any chance of meaningful upgrades happening while they're sourcing replacements?
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No this will almost certainly be a like for like replacement, a bare minimum to get things up and running ASAP using in stock parts. A full signal redesign for the red and orange line is already in process with Barletta and friends. The full signal system replacement along both lines is expected to reach substantial completion in mid-2022. Wouldn't make any sense to upgrade them now and again then.
 
An on-line Globe article earlier today said this set of bungalows is to be moved away from trackside at this location as part of the upgrade. That reference is not in the on-line articles this evening.
 
stellarfun said:
An on-line Globe article earlier today said this set of bungalows is to be moved away from trackside at this location as part of the upgrade. That reference is not in the on-line articles this evening.
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They struck that sentence and instead edited to reference a linky to an earlier article last year about the new RL signal system to avoid reader confusion about interpreting the "move the bungalow" statement as moving it for the accident repairs, rather than the upgrade project that needs 4 years to complete. Article ends up a little more informative that way, as the link-out to the piece from last Fall goes into some detail about what a signal bungalow is/does, what makes the T's so old, and how they're going to be made brand new again and more resilient to damage by 2021-22.

BTW...this is the major bungalow that got hit, with a view inside of all the equipment that sustained damage:
PSHSRFENDYI6TAIVQV7K3OWONQ.jpg
 
HelloBostonHi said:
No this will almost certainly be a like for like replacement, a bare minimum to get things up and running ASAP using in stock parts. A full signal redesign for the red and orange line is already in process with Barletta and friends. The full signal system replacement along both lines is expected to reach substantial completion in mid-2022. Wouldn't make any sense to upgrade them now and again then.
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Actually, the T is at least talking to the contractor scheduled for the signal upgrades, to see if they can so some accelerated work in the JFK location, in keeping with the 2022 upgrades. Trying to not duplicate the efforts, but also get the signals back on line.
 
Looks like some of the 3rd rail was damaged in that mishap!! :shock:
 
Charlie_mta said:
Good article from WGBH on MBTA funding needs and proposals:

https://www.wgbh.org/news/commentary/2019/06/12/wake-up-call-the-time-for-action-on-the-t-is-today
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I don't disagree with him, but it's sort of non specific.

The mbta is in the process of replacing all of the orange and red cars, and there is a 218 million dollar project set to update the signals on those lines to a modern system for 2022.

I think what we're seeing now is underinvestment 10-20 years ago that government is slow to overcome.
 
tysmith95 said:
I don't disagree with him, but it's sort of non specific.

The mbta is in the process of replacing all of the orange and red cars, and there is a 218 million dollar project set to update the signals on those lines to a modern system for 2022.

I think what we're seeing now is underinvestment 10-20 years ago that government is slow to overcome.
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Aloisi supports a lot of specific projects: Red-Blue Connector, NSRL, Regional Rail, West Station, etc.
 
Coyote137 said:
Aloisi supports a lot of specific projects: Red-Blue Connector, NSRL, Regional Rail, West Station, etc.
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All of which will have a positive impact beginning in about 2030.

Investments take time to happen. People don't like delayed gratification.
 
Equilibria said:
All of which will have a positive impact beginning in about 2030.

Investments take time to happen. People don't like delayed gratification.
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You're right, of course, but I believe the issue at hand is that we have no money to push for any of these construction projects because the money is going to the Red/Orange rehabilitation, GLX, and SCR. If we don't get the ball rolling on these other projects, 2030 will become the groundbreaking on transit solutions we need today. Jim Aloisi looks to be seizing the political will of the moment to get some big ideas funded.
 
tysmith95 said:
That's far from the biggest issue. Destroying the horribly outdated signal box is why it's taking so long to fix.
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It's more that the train being stuck under the bridge blocked one of the bungaloes when the several damaged ones are all interconnected. Need unobstructed access to them all to get repairs started.

This signal plant is all no older than 1988, when the current ATO signal system was installed Harvard-Andrew + the Ashmont Branch (it was there from Day 1 on the Quincy/Braintree and Alewife extensions). 31 years: not ancient, possibly not even at end of component life if stuff in those cabinets has been renewed once since '88. But the analog relays are definitely old tech that can be replicated much more reliably with fiber optics and digital routers. Which is exactly what the bigger signal project is going to do.
 
jbray said:
You're right, of course, but I believe the issue at hand is that we have no money to push for any of these construction projects because the money is going to the Red/Orange rehabilitation, GLX, and SCR. If we don't get the ball rolling on these other projects, 2030 will become the groundbreaking on transit solutions we need today. Jim Aloisi looks to be seizing the political will of the moment to get some big ideas funded.
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We have the money, the MBTA just isn't able to spend it fast enough. FY18 they spent half their allotted capital investments.
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HelloBostonHi said:
We have the money, the MBTA just isn't able to spend it fast enough. FY18 they spent half their allotted capital investments.
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Actual data. I have been lurking the chatter around r/Boston and UHub. Both are absolutely mad. But UHub is going full rage at Baker while Reddit has been mostly rage but the newest thread about the petition is noticing that the Democrats have the power to directly fix it rather than try to shame Baker to take action.

This graph above seems to tell me MBTA is still struggling to get up to full speed. It's absolutely frustrating, but apparently they can't identify, fund, and execute fast enough. At this point, I really feel like they should be doing this faster. I see slides they are presenting of their repair plans, but just start sending people out with tools to fix things where they see it or something. Anything is faster than this. We should not have trains derailing 4 years after that winter.
 
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