What is the rational for being against this? Do 2 lane roads in dense urban areas, complete with cars parking and making turns, really outperform single-lane travel roads with appropriate turn lanes? Do businesses really get more customers when it's difficult for pedestrians to safely cross the street. As someone who like to play devil's advocate, I'm having a hard time understanding any legitimate opposition beyond a desire to drive through the stretch at 40-50mph.
Biking in Boston
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What is the rational for being against this? Do 2 lane roads in dense urban areas, complete with cars parking and making turns, really outperform single-lane travel roads with appropriate turn lanes? Do businesses really get more customers when it's difficult for pedestrians to safely cross the street. As someone who like to play devil's advocate, I'm having a hard time understanding any legitimate opposition beyond a desire to drive through the stretch at 40-50mph.
Chickenman
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It's been funny seeing all the Bill Macgregor (and one Robert Orthman one, oddly enough) campaign signs go down, replaced with the Save Center Street ones. They've got the gall to say something like "Save Center, Safe Center".
Also, for the opposition meeting, they're going to ID people. I live here, but I wouldn't even be allowed in because my license's address is where I lived previously. Hope their effort is in vain.
Also, for the opposition meeting, they're going to ID people. I live here, but I wouldn't even be allowed in because my license's address is where I lived previously. Hope their effort is in vain.
HenryAlan
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I can somewhat see a rationale for opposition by business owners. If their business plan works in the current environment, they might not want to risk some alternative environment. I get that. I think they are wrong, and studies tend to back that notion, but I understand their concern. But I think mostly it's just contempt among a certain segment of the Westie population for any type of change whatsoever, which is universally seen as an imposition by outsiders. Outsiders being bike riders, politicians from Chicago, "yuppies" who came to school in Boston and stayed, etc. There is an old guard in that neighborhood that in many cases are the children of people who previously moved there from more core neighborhoods after fleeing displacement, who are desperate not to have that happen again. It's not easy to sway such opinions.
millerm277
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Probably not, but with a giant pile of asterisks about the word "appropriate".
- If the turn lanes aren't sized appropriately, a turning queue backup now stops all thru-traffic.
- Away from the intersections, if there isn't a constant center turn lane + there's anything at all to make a left turn into - same deal - one guy wanting to make a left into his driveway now stops all thru-traffic.
- When there aren't cars waiting to turn (or where we're currently talking 2 lanes each way + left turn lane) at the intersection - it does get more queued up cars through a light cycle. You may not need 2 lanes away from the intersection queues, but at them it does move more cars - even if they just compress back down to 1 lane a couple hundred feet on either side of the intersection.
- You mention parking cars and that's another obstacle - if you've got 2 lanes or at least a center turn lane you just go around the guy trying to parallel park.
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Boston-specific:
- The extreme abuse of double-parking in the city and lack of enforcement means lots of roads wind up with outright roadblocks in a lane for 5-15min at a time, if it's a single-lane road that requires going around into oncoming traffic. This is especially bad in "downtown" areas with Uber Eats + entitled idiots.
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To be clear I'm not making a value statement about if a road diet is bad here, especially since I don't go to this part of the city much. As general opinion I don't think going from 2|2 to 1|turn|1 cuts capacity much, but going to 1|1 does in a lot of places.
JeffDowntown
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This is why so many one-way roads in Boston Proper that theoretically have three travel lanes really only have one!
dhawkins
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This could be posted in Dorchester Small Projects as well. The Neponset/ Tenean Beach trail is being extended north to Morrisey Blvd. I don't know why, but I'm excited for this project! For environmental justice reasons or just Boston / DCR following thru on their promise I guess. But I feel this project is needed just because it must.
Dorchester Reporter article
Dorchester Reporter (Last Year)
The NOI - drawings and such The flood studies in this package are interesting as well
Dorchester Reporter article
Dorchester Reporter (Last Year)
The NOI - drawings and such The flood studies in this package are interesting as well
BeyondRevenue
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I would have liked a 1000' boardwalk/bridge on the waterside connecting Tenean Beach to Victory Park, but this'll do the job well enough.
This takes care of Big Thing #1: Ability to stay the hell away from the Morrissey Blvd / 93 underpass when Biking NB. It's an absolutely treacherous spot on a bike and a pointless Level 10 anxiety creator.
There was room to do that spot right way back when by shifting the NB lanes to the left, but they said no. "Sorry. Cars only, hippie!"
bigeman312
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I attended the Boylston Street Community Walk last night. Here's a rough summary of events:
- Roughly 50 people attended.
- I estimate 40 or so were mostly in favor, with a median age of about 35. This group was overwhelmingly respectful, calm, and would raise their hand to speak.
- Roughly 10 or so people were opposed, with a median age of about 65. About five people from this group were loudly disrespectful, dominating the discourse without allowing others to speak, insulting the BTD staff, screaming, and repeatedly asking answered questions while seemingly not understanding very basic aspects of the projects, and displaying an inability to decipher basic maps, generally displaying pretty shockingly low levels of cognition, cooperation, patience, and communication.
- For the first half of the event, it was impossible to get to the purpose of the event, which was to bring up small issues like curb cuts or resurfacing, while the five or so older people screamed over everyone.
- It started raining.
- The angry people left.
- The second half of the event was pleasant and informative, with a productive exchange of ideas, such as:
- one resident telling another resident about success with painting the curb yellow around their driveway to inform drivers where not to park
- a resident pointing out to BTD an area that could use a crosswalk
- a resident pointing out to BTD an area that needs a curb cut for a specific cycling movement
- a brainstorming of solutions to the scarcity of parking, such as areas where resident parking permits could be useful
- BTD informing residents of specifics of the project
Koopzilla24
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I don’t know why they have the Melnea Cass bike path ending at Albany when it goes all the way to Mass Ave.Which is why we get this, as a result.
The fact that several good projects approach the same 10 block area but none of them connect to each other is a complete travesty.
bigeman312
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HenryAlan
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I'm with @bigeman312 on this, the sidewalk section constitutes a gap in the path, especially when there is a fairly active amount of pedestrian use along that stretch.
[eta]
For further context, the map doesn't even consider the non-buffered paint lanes on Mass Ave to be legit bike lanes. Sidewalks certainly would not qualify.
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Koopzilla24
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I agree. But it returns to being a separated bike path a few hundred feet later at Hampden st
"Boston Globe: Fear, loathing, and bike lanes in West Roxbury"
The degree of animosity towards bike lanes is really baffling to me; I say that as a year-round cycle commuter.
I also almost got clobbered today on Dot Ave northbound at A St. Jeep was trying to jump the light/cross two lanes of traffic to get into the left turn bay at the next intersection with W 4th. The intersection with A has no bike infrastructure and as such, no designated space for me creating these dangerous situations like that described above in the article.
Bike lanes are a luxury in some parts of this dense, older city, but where space can be made, they do wonders for drivers and cyclists.
The degree of animosity towards bike lanes is really baffling to me; I say that as a year-round cycle commuter.
I also almost got clobbered today on Dot Ave northbound at A St. Jeep was trying to jump the light/cross two lanes of traffic to get into the left turn bay at the next intersection with W 4th. The intersection with A has no bike infrastructure and as such, no designated space for me creating these dangerous situations like that described above in the article.
Bike lanes are a luxury in some parts of this dense, older city, but where space can be made, they do wonders for drivers and cyclists.
I hear you on these common issues on Boston 4-lane roads, but as someone who drives here all the time, I can assure you that the backups from people waiting to take lefts are a very minor issue on this particular road, and double parking actually never happens here (odd, in the South End and other roadways, the outside lane=double park your car--weird how custom rather than rule determines where this happens with impunity). For whatever reason, Centre always moves. I drive to my dad's outside Boston and can either take the VFW or Centre and the time difference is pretty comparable. I cant explain it. But thats the reality. And the changes are definitely going to make the traffic worse. All of that is fine, the changes should be made nonetheless. But what I dont like, and what I think adds fuel to the fire for the old asshole troglodytes the city (and country) over, is when bogus data is given that everyone knows is false. The traffic will get worse, not better. No need to lie about it. This isn't being done for traffic improvement, its being done for safety and quality of life. The whole left/Dem/progressive factions in this country need to really get a lot more behind a "we are doing this for everyone's well being" rather than selling ideas on "facts" and "data" which aren't true.
What's a complete travesty is the city water dept building that swallows up a huge amount of unused lawn and pavement, right where the bike lane could otherwise be running. I know in these hopelessly ossified and kafkaesque times it's beyond stupid to imagine that the city could simply cleave off a sliver of a plot of land that it already owns, but in a smarter and more nimble world, thats exactly what would be done.
Old news from last weekend, but the Sommerville community path just opened (connecting lechmere to Davis & Alewife). This provides a good bike connection from almost all of sommerville to downtown. Anyone ride it have any sense on how it connects to protected bike infrastructure downtown?
I also wish we'd stop branding these new paths as "community paths" which perpetuates the view that these should be only used for recreation and dog-walking, and that bikes are toys rather than a serious means of transportation.
JeffDowntown
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Given the dimensions on this path and the mixed mode of operation, I think the branding of "Community Path" is to signal this is really not a high speed bikeway.
RandomWalk
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Based on my experience, it will take some time for folks to figure out how to negotiate the path, whether as a high speed biker or a pedestrian.
hipster_garbage
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I've ridden it the past two days going to/from work just to see how it compares to my normal ride down Beacon/Hampshire. It's not as direct or as fast but it's more relaxing. The path is pretty narrow and there are some head scratchers like the curb cut at School St. being completely misaligned from where the path actually is. You either have to take it at a mile an hour while you do a semi-trackstand or walk it, there's just not enough room to have bikes in both directions make two back-to-back 90 degree turns safely. Connections to downtown seem to be fine. I've been taking it along Morgan Ave in Cambridge Crossing then turning onto Museum Way and then the bike lanes on McGrath/O'Brien/Charles River Dam to cut over to the Paul Dudley White path along the Esplanade. I don't think I'll have it replace my regular commute if I'm going for pure speed/efficiency but if I'm not in a rush or I don't feel like dealing with stoplights and cars and doors flying open it's a great alternative.
Edit: for anybody wondering on my ride back today I looked at my cycling computer while climbing the viaduct over the rail yard on the path. The steepest it got was 5.1% with the average being about 4.5% overall. So not incredibly steep but also not pan flat like you’d expect a traditional rail trail to be.
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HelloBostonHi
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You have a pretty accurate cycling computer! By law it can't be more than 5% anywhere otherwise it's considered a ramp which can be up to 8.3% but requires railings and level rest areas. I rode the whole thing over the weekend and I didn't see any ramps so it should all be below 5% running slope and 2% cross slope (these are the sorts of ADA punchlist things that were holding up the opening, the difference between say 1.8% and 2.3% slope is invisible to the eye but makes something noncompliant)