Lynn Central Square

[BostonUrbEx]

I've always wanted to explore this area ( preferably when it is light out, for at least two reasons ), but never have much time. But from what I'm gathering from Google maps, Google streetview, and a quick drive around at night, this area should really be primed for something good.

Pedestrian access to the station is great -- with a main entrance centered not just on the garage and busway, but also with a very well lit path to Munroe St. There's also a secondary access point to the east, at Exchange & Union. It appears that there's potential retail space under the viaduct at this eastern egress. Why it is not put to use is beyond me. There doesn't seem to be terribly many vacancies in the area, surprisingly. And I was surprised to see businesses open at 10pm on a Sunday. Almost puts Boston's Financial District to shame (how sad)! It also seems there may be a pedestrian passageway sheltered by the inbound track in between the two access points.

Like I said, business must be decent. Or maybe there were other activities going on in the back room. It does seem to still be an auto-reliant area, though, despite how well suited it is for transit. I'm guessing alot of city regulation is holding more development back.

Does anyone know anything about the spaces under the rail viaduct? Were these ever retail shops?

 

[Shepard]

Central Lynn is surprisingly great for blocks at a time until you turn a corner and - surprise! - strip mall, massive parking lot, vacant land. Nonetheless, this place is going to see tons of investment if and when rapid transit ever comes.

At this point, wouldn't it make sense for Lynn to advocate for a DMU express to North Station rather than waiting for the Blue Line? That would of course benefit cities like Chelsea also.

 

[F-Line to Dudley]

Central Lynn is surprisingly great for blocks at a time until you turn a corner and - surprise! - strip mall, massive parking lot, vacant land. Nonetheless, this place is going to see tons of investment if and when rapid transit ever comes.

At this point, wouldn't it make sense for Lynn to advocate for a DMU express to North Station rather than waiting for the Blue Line? That would of course benefit cities like Chelsea also.

Not with the Eastern Route in the condition it's in. Need to fix the crippling speed restrictions through the Chelsea grade crossings. Need to fix the 2 decrepit movable bridges that are chewing up 6 figures annually in duct tape repairs and millions for small patch jobs every couple of years. The movable spans alone are probably $400M for permanent replacements of the pair. Need to fix the old signal system so those long straightaways can do > 59 MPH. Need to do lots and lots of station repair work from ADA'ing Chelsea to structurally repairing fast-crumbling Lynn to raising platforms. Need to add a second platform to Salem station (which they omitted in the massive overbudget ongoing parking sink construction project) to stage train meets around the tunnel pinch point if they want frequencies to approach what they used to be 50 years ago.

Half-billion dollars just in state-of-repair to keep the existing Newburyport/Rockport commuters from seeing precipitous decay in OTP and get the line up to spec for supporting basic schedule increases on those existing high-demand branches. You can't even think about introducing DMU shuttles until they eat their peas on all that mainline work.


And even then the Reading Line is a far more attractive entry point for northside DMU's with higher ridership projections than an Eastern Route shuttle (Boston MPO has ballparked the numbers, and it's not even close) and ability to shove thru Haverhill trains back to the underutilized Lowell Line for instant capacity. By that point if you've got Newburyport/Rockport + Reading DMU's co-mingled through the single-track squeeze through Sullivan Sq. you won't have enough schedule slots for clock-facing shuttle service on the Eastern Route without harming headways on the Newburyport/Rockport branches.

You can get some increases to N/R and also a schedule to Peabody if clock-facing Reading DMU's pause in Somerville and yield priority every time to the Eastern Route trains. That doesn't delay a short run to Reading, or the Haverhill trains using the Lowell Line, so it's win-win. It DOES delay many Newburyport or Rockport static slots to put 2 clock-facing shuttles in direct conflict with each other at the Somerville squeeze with no way for both to yield to a long-distance N/R run. So Newburyport and Rockport commuters are the ones who eat it on the delays and capped schedules. That's not going to be acceptable at all with how much those two branches are already underperforming vs. demand. Greater good says they've got more to lose punishing those commuters then they've got to gain helping those commuters AND prioritizing Reading DMU's where there's capacity to give.

Basically, you can get much more frequent commuter rail to Lynn by doing the eat-your-peas state of repair, increasing N/R schedules, and instituting the Peabody branch. But it'll always have to be on a static schedule, not clock-facing. You may get something almost as frequent...because 3 heavy-use branches are a whole lot of regular trains...but it'll never be "walk in, always have 20 minutes or fewer wait" convenience. There will always be a train-to-train variance in the headways with the branch endpoints driving the schedules and the spacing, and that's going to take some luster off the convenience aspect by still needing to refer to the paper schedule (not only for arrival times, but also for checking whether it's a branch train that usually has any seats free by the time it hits Lynn). There won't be a way to serve the max possible audience any other way.


This is why Blue-Lynn is so important. There is freaking no other way to half-approximate those frequencies on the Purple Line. Blame the I-93 viaduct for forcing that Somerville pinch when they built the Orange Line, and then blame the failure to finish the OL to Reading for making that pinch permanent. But there are no stopgaps or substitutes for the real thing. Lynn needs Blue...full-stop. Nothing else matters until that happens.

 

[coleslaw]

This is why Blue-Lynn is so important. There is freaking no other way to half-approximate those frequencies on the Purple Line. Blame the I-93 viaduct for forcing that Somerville pinch when they built the Orange Line, and then blame the failure to finish the OL to Reading for making that pinch permanent.

I for one would rather have Somerville well served than have the Orange Line run to a distant suburb. If the MBTA was not utterly incompetent they could work on more than one expansion at a time, and we wouldn't have to wait until after the green line expansion is completed. This is what we should complain about, not the deadline forcing them to work fast, but the idiocy of an agency incapable of actually working fast enough to meet demand.

 

[cozzyd]

Would a DMU between Oak Grove and NS be significanly faster than the OL? I see that the scheduled time for the Haverhill line between Malden Center and NS is 12 minutes while for the Orange Line (according to wikipedia) it is 10 minutes. If the Reading DMU operated primarily as a shuttle to Oak Grove with a cross-platform (maybe even timed!) transfer then that seems like it would solve the Somerville choke?

Rush hour trains could still continue to NS if that made sense.

 

[Shepard]

But is gearing up the Eastern Route for DMUs the way you've described it cost-comparable to the BLX, or is the BLX that much cheaper? I ask only because it sounds like the upgrades and maintenance you describe on the Eastern Route is going to need to get done sooner or later in any case.

 

[F-Line to Dudley]

Would a DMU between Oak Grove and NS be significanly faster than the OL? I see that the scheduled time for the Haverhill line between Malden Center and NS is 12 minutes while for the Orange Line (according to wikipedia) it is 10 minutes. If the Reading DMU operated primarily as a shuttle to Oak Grove with a cross-platform (maybe even timed!) transfer then that seems like it would solve the Somerville choke?

Rush hour trains could still continue to NS if that made sense.

No. Everything from the Somerville squeeze to NS is inside yard limits and running 20-something MPH, then slower when it passes through Boston Engine Terminal over into NS-proper. An OL train making all stops will beat it handily to Sullivan, and be negligible difference to OG because of the Malden Ctr. CR stop. Plus, HRT >>>>> DMU and the bigger OL fleet will substantially increase headways and ridership from CC-OG in a few years flat. You would never ever want to introduce CR schedule dependencies into the mix at any of these stops. That's more harm than good to everyone else...especially Newburyport/Rockport if the Western Route has to get priority through the squeeze to make any timed transfers. Clock-facing Reading DMU's and punting Haverhill to Anderson-Wilmington helps relax--not increase--the pressure through here and help N/R/Peabody have carte blanche on priority through Somerville. 3 mins. of schedule fudge factor built into every 25-30 minute Reading DMU schedule for a pause in Somerville to let any N/R/P train is a nothing price to pay for making everyone on every route quite very happy with their increased service.


Like I said, no easy answers. You MUST do Blue to serve Lynn and make all the transfers to the North Shore's Yellow Line routes work properly. The buses are the real wildcard here if they can finally be reasonable-length local routes terminating at Lynn instead of having to all run in crush-load traffic to Wonderland or express to downtown over 1A. The figures for all-new transit riders with BL-Lynn are so mind-bogglingly high because of all the bus trips gained. And probably all the brand new bus routes that could be instituted from that demand. More CR does not encourage Yellow Line patronage to meaningful degrees. Blue Line EXPLODES it across the entire North Shore.

Other than GLX and Red-Blue, NOTHING whatsoever on the project pile matters more than BL-Lynn. And if there's justice in the world, nothing will usurp it on priority. Downtown heavies like the BCEC might be able to swing the big dick to get Waterfront transit prioritized over it, but in reality no project serves more new transit riders or saves more car trips than BL-Lynn and its long coattails through the bus system. This thing's been on-the-verge for 60 years for a damn good reason.

 

[cozzyd]

F-Line, I was suggesting that Reading DMU's would only go Reading<->Oak Grove with a cross-platform transfer at Oak Grove.

 

[F-Line to Dudley]

F-Line, I was suggesting that Reading DMU's would only go Reading<->Oak Grove with a cross-platform transfer at Oak Grove.

That kills the Reading ridership dead if they do that. Reading has always had a one-seat to NS, and we're gonna take that away? Melrose, Wakefield, and Reading get in their cars and hit 93 if that happens. The Orange Line becomes standing-room-only well before it reaches Sullivan. And the single CR track at Oak Grove leaves no place to lay over on turnbacks, and blocks any chance of mixing in NS-Reading thru service or the occasional Haverhill extended run with that single track always occupied. It would be a debacle worsening service for everyone...for what, playing favorites with Lynn when the higher study-projected CR ridership is on Reading clock-facing + the branches? That's insane.

My argument is a real thru DMU on Reading does work with a substantially increased triple-branch regular CR schedule on the Eastern Route, and brings something meaningful for everyone. Robbing from many high- CR patronage communities to serve a few...justified by a new and novel excuse for not building a rapid transit extension they were once committed-by-law to building...is destructive and nuts.


And doesn't serve the real need here. That was my point talking about the buses...the bus transfers at Lynn are what make the Blue Line extension sizzle. The riders don't arrive in mass numbers for a Zone 1A fare once every 20 minutes at peak. They continue to hold their nose and proceed to Wonderland or downtown on the same awful Route 1A express buses same as ever to reach the 5-minute headway transfer points. And continuing those express routes to downtown instead of trimming at Lynn Terminal chokes off the supply of vehicles, bus headways, and overall bus capacity for the whole North Shore because all those schedules remain dependent...same as they ever were...on reaching Wonderland and downtown before they turn around. If Lynn garage could actually be used to feed a real Dudley-esque terminal instead of its capacity getting siphoned by all the redundancy downwind, you could pack all those anemic North Shore schedules full and have capacity to spare to add new routes. That's where the bulk of the all-new transit riders come from and where the car trips get saved: the transfers to Blue from the surrounding North Shore communities taking reasonable bus trips, not the direct walk-up to Blue from Lynn Central Sq.

You don't get any of that bus transformation with a DMU because the routes, schedules, and mode capacity don't change at all. And there aren't enough short-term solutions that substantially rehab the compromised buses either as long as that extended-run 1A/downtown dependency exists for nearly every route. It doesn't address the need square-on like Blue does. That is, in essence, why Blue to Lynn is irreplaceable and un-delayable as the solution. It's the only one that blows the ceiling off the transfers and incoming headways from all around. It's a regional project, not a Lynn-specific project. CR with no possibility of bus route reconfiguration doesn't even scratch the surface even if the northside were rigged up to prioritize DMU headways. You need the bus terminal to be a real terminal.

 

[cozzyd]

That kills the Reading ridership dead if they do that. Reading has always had a one-seat to NS, and we're gonna take that away? Melrose, Wakefield, and Reading get in their cars and hit 93 if that happens.

Maybe... but if the transfer can be timed correctly, it doesn't take any longer, and many probably don't have NS as a final destination anyway. Rush hour trains would continue to go to NS anyway, but outside of rush hour, the increased frequency with the same number of DMU's might be preferable.

The Orange Line becomes standing-room-only well before it reaches Sullivan.

Yeah, that's why you would need extra OL capacity.

And the single CR track at Oak Grove leaves no place to lay over on turnbacks, and blocks any chance of mixing in NS-Reading thru service or the occasional Haverhill extended run with that single track always occupied.

There is plenty of room in the parking lot to change the track configuration.

It would be a debacle worsening service for everyone...for what, playing favorites with Lynn when the higher study-projected CR ridership is on Reading clock-facing + the branches? That's insane.

My argument is a real thru DMU on Reading does work with a substantially increased triple-branch regular CR schedule on the Eastern Route, and brings something meaningful for everyone. Robbing from many high- CR patronage communities to serve a few...justified by a new and novel excuse for not building a rapid transit extension they were once committed-by-law to building...is destructive and nuts.


And doesn't serve the real need here. That was my point talking about the buses...the bus transfers at Lynn are what make the Blue Line extension sizzle. The riders don't arrive in mass numbers for a Zone 1A fare once every 20 minutes at peak. They continue to hold their nose and proceed to Wonderland or downtown on the same awful Route 1A express buses same as ever to reach the 5-minute headway transfer points. And continuing those express routes to downtown instead of trimming at Lynn Terminal chokes off the supply of vehicles, bus headways, and overall bus capacity for the whole North Shore because all those schedules remain dependent...same as they ever were...on reaching Wonderland and downtown before they turn around. If Lynn garage could actually be used to feed a real Dudley-esque terminal instead of its capacity getting siphoned by all the redundancy downwind, you could pack all those anemic North Shore schedules full and have capacity to spare to add new routes. That's where the bulk of the all-new transit riders come from and where the car trips get saved: the transfers to Blue from the surrounding North Shore communities taking reasonable bus trips, not the direct walk-up to Blue from Lynn Central Sq.

You don't get any of that bus transformation with a DMU because the routes, schedules, and mode capacity don't change at all. And there aren't enough short-term solutions that substantially rehab the compromised buses either as long as that extended-run 1A/downtown dependency exists for nearly every route. It doesn't address the need square-on like Blue does. That is, in essence, why Blue to Lynn is irreplaceable and un-delayable as the solution. It's the only one that blows the ceiling off the transfers and incoming headways from all around. It's a regional project, not a Lynn-specific project. CR with no possibility of bus route reconfiguration doesn't even scratch the surface even if the northside were rigged up to prioritize DMU headways. You need the bus terminal to be a real terminal.

I agree that this makes sense in the long term, but Lynn (and Chelsea) need better access ASAP.

 

[winstonoboogie]

Robbing from many high- CR patronage communities to serve a few...justified by a new and novel excuse for not building a rapid transit extension they were once committed-by-law to building...is destructive and nuts.


And doesn't serve the real need here. That was my point talking about the buses...the bus transfers at Lynn are what make the Blue Line extension sizzle. The riders don't arrive in mass numbers for a Zone 1A fare once every 20 minutes at peak. They continue to hold their nose and proceed to Wonderland or downtown on the same awful Route 1A express buses same as ever to reach the 5-minute headway transfer points. .

Extending the Blue Line to Lynn was never part of the mitigation for the Central Artery, it was never "committed-by-law".

Commuter rail to Lynn is a Zone 2 pass, that costs $189 per month. Somebody taking the bus to Wonderland only has to pay $70 for a Link Pass. I suspect if the Lynn fare was dropped from Zone 2 to 1A, more might be willing to make a bus to commuter rail transfer. Most of the bus routes in Lynn only operate every 30-60 minutes, coordinating those with an every 20-30 minute commuter rail service would not be as hard as trying to co-ordinate the rail with a high frequency bus route. The high price really puts many Lynn riders on the bus. The existing peak frequency for the Eastern route is not bad:
http://www.mbta.com/uploadedfiles/Documents/Schedules_and_Maps/Commuter_Rail/newburyport.pdf
Its the off-peak frequency that could use some help. Operating a combined 30-minute off-peak frequency between Boston and Beverly with DMUs filling in gaps in between Newburyport/Rockport trips can be done with existing infrastructure. Look at the Halloween Eve schedule:
http://www.mbta.com/uploadedfiles/Haunted Happenings 2013 Halloween Night Schedules.pdf
Notice that the 6:30 PM extra train from Boston to Beverly stops in Salem at 7:01 PM, just three minutes before the 7:00 PM train from Beverly stops at Salem at 7:04 PM. Trains from the north heading to the single track at Salem can go as far south as the interlocking at Northey Point to hold for meets, while trains from the south can travel as far north as McNall interlocking. They do not have to wait at Swampscott or Beverly stations for the single track to be clear. It is 0.7 miles of single track from McNall to Northey Point. As the existing peak and the special holiday schedule show, this can accommodate 15-20 minute frequencies. Also note that the existing travel time from Lynn to Boston is 24-25 minutes, even with the long standing speed restrictions in Chelsea.

On the other hand, the single track on the Western Route from Reading Junction near Sullivan to Fells near Oak Grove (3.9 miles of single track) greatly restricts how much service can be operated to Reading in the peak.

here is the existing schedule:
http://www.mbta.com/uploadedfiles/Documents/Schedules_and_Maps/Commuter_Rail/haverhill.pdf
Note that reverse-peak trains use the Wildcat in order to maintain some 20 minute frequencies in the peak direction in the evening rush-hour while every 30 minute service is operated from Reading with short-turn trains in the AM rush-hour, achieved by sending the Haverhill trains over the Wildcat. That's about the best the single track will allow.

 

[F-Line to Dudley]

Maybe... but if the transfer can be timed correctly, it doesn't take any longer, and many probably don't have NS as a final destination anyway. Rush hour trains would continue to go to NS anyway, but outside of rush hour, the increased frequency with the same number of DMU's might be preferable.

Check the Blue Book boardings at Malden Ctr. 26 per day. It's a stop that gets more exits for people transferring to the OL in the A.M., but not nearly like Ruggles does. And much >90% of the P.M. ridership boards at NS. Those 200-900 boardings at each of the post-Oak Grove stops are not coming back if you truncate it at a forced transfer. Doesn't matter how frequent. This is the same reason why Needham's schedule is stuck. They can't increase the thru schedule to SS to satiate demand, and the riders will revolt if they get a Forest Hills dinky with a forced transfer. The losses outstrip the frequency gains to such a lopsided degree the very act of bringing in the DMU dinky destabilizes otherwise rock-stable services into candidates for outright abandonment.

There is no sugarcoating that. It's fatal to force a shuttle on communities that have had frequent one-seat schedules for 150 years. The only successful two-seat dinkys are lines like the Metro North CT branches that have always been shuttles, or wholly new services where no transit whatsoever existed.

There is plenty of room in the parking lot to change the track configuration.

No there isn't. Oak Grove is in a below street-level cut bounded by the Winter St. embankment on the south end of the property and the street grid + adjacent private buildings on the north end of the property. There isn't enough room to shiv a turnout in there with a layover yard large enough to support dense service and keep the mainline free. If blowing up buildings and relocating local streets is the only solution to fixing it, you are banking on full cooperation from the City of Malden to aid in a disruptive project solely for the sake of transit loss. Never in a million years will they agree to that. They will sue with Melrose, Wakefield, and Reading as co-filers to stop it at any cost.

I agree that this makes sense in the long term, but Lynn (and Chelsea) need better access ASAP.

Then fix the crumbling Eastern Route infrastructure and they will get a whole lot more service on the regular CR schedule. Let's not get all modal-fetish here about DMU's being a cure-all. Saugus drawbridge is still slowly sinking into the river and gets 15 MPH speed restrictions slapped on it every few months when it needs a new roll of duct tape. The Chelsea crossings are still the worst speed bottleneck on the entire system. The signal system is still in frail condition and speed-capped well below what the line could do. The platforms at Lynn and Chelsea are in godawful condition. And they totally spaced with this ludicrous Salem station boondoggle on fixing the tunnel pinch point with a second platform, and until that's fixed this DMU will never be able to get to/from Salem or Beverly while staying out of its own way in the opposite-direction.

$500-$600M. Right there. A good 10 years worth of work with how total it is end-to-end. Fucking fix it all or it doesn't matter what vehicle you run on the line; service won't be able to improve enough, and OTP will keep decaying and decaying the worse shape the physical plant gets. You can't speed that timetable up by kneecapping Newburyport and Rockport for this precious DMU. That harms more people than it serves, and the line is still crumbling beneath your feet all the same.

No easy solutions here. No gimmicks. No shortcuts. No cherry-picking or optional steps. Fix the fucking commuter rail route or everything gets worse and nothing has any potential for getting better. Fix the fucking commuter rail route and everything WILL get better...for everyone.

Build the fucking Blue Line or nothing gets more than marginally better.




This is very dangerous, caustic thinking...robbing transit from one place to give it to another. It brings transit inequity on a large scale. Look at all the sway the rich suburbanites already have. Do you really want to start playing God with who loses existing service in the inner 'burbs when the tail wags the dog in the outer 'burbs? It won't break out as a capacity redistribution; it'll break out as a wealth redistribution. It could boomerang back on lower-class Lynn and result in horse-trading that gives their capacity right back to richer communities. It already has when the rich 'burbs have gotten all the Transit Commitment resources that were supposed to go to the higher-need communities like Lynn. It could result in things like Brockton getting its service cut if Hingham stamps its feet about wanting more, because...fuck it...anything goes and insider pull is a zero-sum game when it's town-on-town. It means they can take a run at abandoning the Needham Line while giving the South Coast Task Force even more ammo. It means they can slowly siphon those DMU's away from Fairmount and leave that service perpetually half-formed.

Don't think it could ever come to that? I offer two counterpoints: Roxbury and JP.

Never again. Never again do they get allowed the opportunity to do a transit wealth redistribution anywhere. Attitudes with the power brokers have NOT changed with time, and neither has the degree of have/have-nots segregation in this region.

 

[winstonoboogie]

Then fix the crumbling Eastern Route infrastructure and they will get a whole lot more service on the regular CR schedule. Let's not get all modal-fetish here about DMU's being a cure-all. Saugus drawbridge is still slowly sinking into the river and gets 15 MPH speed restrictions slapped on it every few months when it needs a new roll of duct tape. The Chelsea crossings are still the worst speed bottleneck on the entire system. The signal system is still in frail condition and speed-capped well below what the line could do. The platforms at Lynn and Chelsea are in godawful condition. And they totally spaced with this ludicrous Salem station boondoggle on fixing the tunnel pinch point with a second platform, and until that's fixed this DMU will never be able to get to/from Salem or Beverly while staying out of its own way in the opposite-direction.

$500-$600M. Right there. A good 10 years worth of work with how total it is end-to-end. .

The cost of the Beverly drawbridge work is estimated at $12 mil while the complete Gloucester draw replacement is $28 million, both to be put out to bid soon.
http://www.mbta.com/business_center/bidding_solicitations/future_solicitations/

The work done on the Saugus Draw last year restored 40 MPH over the bridge, although the work had to be done as an emergency response, the work they did was permanent.

There was extensive track and signal work done on the Eastern route in the late 1980s and early 1990s. It is all welded rail with Pandrol tie clips. Again, even with the speed restriction in Chelsea (the result of a fatal grade-crossing accident in the 1960s) the travel time from Lynn to Boston is 24 minutes, faster than Blue Line to Lynn will ever be, and faster than the existing travel time to take a bus to Wonderland and transfer.

Operating more frequent service in the off-peak is something they can do already. They do not need DMUs per say, but they could potentially reduce fuel costs if they used DMUs instead of additional short trains of push-pull equipment for Boston-Beverly short-turns. They already run extra rush-hour Boston-Beverly short-turns now with existing equipment, and can run an every 15-20 minute combined frequency Boston-Beverly service even with the single track for 0.7 miles through Salem from McNall to Northey Point. I'm not talking about theoretical capacity, I'm talking about expending the span of what they already do. The primary thing stopping them from not operating more off-peak service now is just the operating cost. The line already operates every 15-20 minutes in the peak and obviously would be possible to run every 30 in the off-peak with no capital investment. If they can do it for a few additional hours at Halloween, they could do it for the rest of the year.

 

[F-Line to Dudley]

The cost of the Beverly drawbridge work is estimated at $12 mil while the complete Gloucester draw replacement is $28 million, both to be put out to bid soon.
http://www.mbta.com/business_center/bidding_solicitations/future_solicitations/

Gloucester is an all-new bridge. It's a tiny span, though.

Beverly work is to address repairs done 6 years ago after a barge strike damaged the swing span. It hasn't worked right ever since despite the '08 repairs fixing the barge damage, and they have no idea why. So they're replacing the wonky machinery to improve reliability, per recommendation from the engineering assessment. They still do not know the root cause or if that's going to be the end of the issues, only that it should be a substantial improvement. The bridge is 130 years old. It is not going to last another quarter-century.

The work done on the Saugus Draw last year restored 40 MPH over the bridge, although the work had to be done as an emergency response, the work they did was permanent.

Except the piers are slowly sinking into the river silt. This "permanent" fix was to close the gap that had opened up. It does not address the root cause of the piers settling, so they must monitor the progression and be prepared to do more of the same fixes in the future. It's also got other misc. aches and pains that flare up. What they are doing is not going to reduce the maintenance strain. It is getting to be a more temperamental a span by the year, and is likewise not likely to last greater than 20 years without full replacement.

That's within the span of time when these North Shore transit increases we are talking about in this thread need to crest to max build. I would consider this a pressing issue.

There was extensive track and signal work done on the Eastern route in the late 1980s and early 1990s. It is all welded rail with Pandrol tie clips. Again, even with the speed restriction in Chelsea (the result of a fatal grade-crossing accident in the 1960s) the travel time from Lynn to Boston is 24 minutes, faster than Blue Line to Lynn will ever be, and faster than the existing travel time to take a bus to Wonderland and transfer.

You're conflating direct travel time on the commuter rail with heavy rail serving many many destinations at high frequencies and many many transfer options on one subway fare. Apples-oranges. If that was the prevailing attraction Forest Hills, Braintee, Quincy Ctr., JFK/UMass, and Malden Ctr. commuter rail would see many more boardings as a shortcut into town when a train happens to pass by. So would Ruggles, Back Bay, Porter. They don't. I've been using Porter for the last 10 years, and yes the freebie to North Station on the Fitchburg Line is mighty convenient. Nobody uses it unless the Red Line is borked and the masses come streaming upstairs. People do not associate commuter rail with a rapid transit shortcut or bypass. Maybe that's something they can work on encouraging more of with proper promotion and finally getting the CR Charlied, but it's going to be psychologically elusive barrier to overcome because you don't have to check a timetable to ride rapid transit or one of the key bus routes. You just show up, and if service isn't borked something comes along within 5 minutes. You do have to check a timetable to guarantee you timed your arrival correctly for a CR headway. And you do have to check what zone fare it is, which probably isn't going to be a 1A ever in Lynn.

No amount of encouragement is going to totally overcome those extra mental steps 100%. Frankly, 30-40% inroads would be a hell of an impressive accomplishment given current utilization of the cross-platform HRT<-->CR transfers outside downtown. Hell yes they should strive for that. But it's not going to lick the demand out in Lynn. Not even close.

Operating more frequent service in the off-peak is something they can do already. They do not need DMUs per say, but they could potentially reduce fuel costs if they used DMUs instead of additional short trains of push-pull equipment for Boston-Beverly short-turns. They already run extra rush-hour Boston-Beverly short-turns now with existing equipment, and can run an every 15-20 minute combined frequency Boston-Beverly service even with the single track for 0.7 miles through Salem from McNall to Northey Point. I'm not talking about theoretical capacity, I'm talking about expending the span of what they already do. The primary thing stopping them from not operating more off-peak service now is just the operating cost. The line already operates every 15-20 minutes in the peak and obviously would be possible to run every 30 in the off-peak with no capital investment. If they can do it for a few additional hours at Halloween, they could do it for the rest of the year.

Yep. And I think that's why Zone 1A just ain't gonna happen outside of the Fairmount Line or Track 61. It's too much of a loss leader. And it defrays a portion of the cost for the 495-oriented service, so it risks a transit wealth transfer hurting existing riders if runs like Newburyport and Rockport have more trouble covering their costs. They don't get additional service, and they risk getting less service if the operating costs spike from a redistribution elsewhere.

This unfortunately greatly inhibits the potential here for serving Lynn's needs effectively based on my last point about the extra mental steps for acclimating to a CR schedule. Even one that is clock-facing or is Charlied. You would have to make a compelling case that the existing outside-downtown transfer stops would see a similar bump in boardings as shortcut, and that's just not going to happen meaningfully with how near-zero their current utilization is beyond exit-only inbounds where rapid transit destinations trump raw travel time to the terminals.



I'm resolute about this: it opens Pandora's Box to Robin Hood transit from one place to give to another. It encourages too many unintended consequences that could boomerang back and end up hurting the most transit-dependent riders who you would think such a redistribution would favor. Playing with fire. Transit equity is important, and keeping existing services sacred is vital protection against powerful interests horse-trading off people's mobility.

 

[winstonoboogie]

It appears that there's potential retail space under the viaduct at this eastern egress. Why it is not put to use is beyond me. ?

The present Lynn station dates to 1992. The B&M station it replaced was on top of the viaduct to the east, you can still see the space for the low-level platforms where it was. I believe the MBTA did intend to lease out the space under the viaduct to retail when the station relocation work was done in the 1990s, but didn't find any interested takers at the time. The busway was originally on Mt. Vernon St. when the station relocated in 1992, but was moved to its present location in what was a driveway for the new station in 2003. When they moved the busway, they put in that angle parking on Mt. Vernon and sealed up part of the space under the viaduct, which had been left open in anticipation of being leased out.

 

[winstonoboogie]

“Beverly work is to address repairs done 6 years ago after a barge strike damaged the swing span. It hasn't worked right ever since despite the '08 repairs fixing the barge damage, and they have no idea why. So they're replacing the wonky machinery to improve reliability, per recommendation from the engineering assessment. They still do not know the root cause or if that's going to be the end of the issues, only that it should be a substantial improvement. The bridge is 130 years old. It is not going to last another quarter-century.”

A reminder that much of the Beverly-Salem bridge burned in 1984 and was replaced in 1985. The draw mechanism did not burn and was just refurbished at the time. That is the 130 year old component. The $12 million project they are planning on putting out for bid soon will replace the mechanical infrastructure of the draw.

“You're conflating direct travel time on the commuter rail with heavy rail serving many many destinations at high frequencies and many many transfer options on one subway fare. Apples-oranges. If that was the prevailing attraction Forest Hills, Braintee, Quincy Ctr., JFK/UMass, and Malden Ctr. commuter rail would see many more boardings as a shortcut into town when a train happens to pass by. So would Ruggles, Back Bay, Porter.”

My point is that the existing commuter rail travel times and speeds between Lynn and Boston are more than adequate and if operated with improved frequency, perhaps at a lower fare, could attract riders and could help to make Lynn more accessible now, not 25-40 years from now. Sure, if rapid transit already existed from Lynn to Boston at high-frequencies at a much lower fare, it would attract more riders than the higher speed commuter rail. But it doesn’t, and it won’t exist for another generation, if at all.

“People do not associate commuter rail with a rapid transit shortcut or bypass. Maybe that's something they can work on encouraging more of with proper promotion and finally getting the CR Charlied, but it's going to be psychologically elusive barrier to overcome because you don't have to check a timetable to ride rapid transit or one of the key bus routes. You just show up, and if service isn't borked something comes along within 5 minutes. You do have to check a timetable to guarantee you timed your arrival correctly for a CR headway. And you do have to check what zone fare it is, which probably isn't going to be a 1A ever in Lynn.”

But that in theory could be part of the motivation for getting DMUs. Using them not just because they might be more economical for short trains, but because it is also a way to market the service as something different, not quite rapid transit, but more frequent than conventional commuter rail. Running Boston-Beverly service every 20 minutes in the peak and every 30 in the off-peak is not true rapid transit service, but it would be a big improvement over the existing level of service. The cost to try out a regular off-peak headway is relatively cheap compared to just about any other capital expansion project out there. And Boston-Beverly is a much better corridor to try this out on than Boston-Reading. The 3.9 miles of single track between Sullivan and Oak Grove on the Reading line is a real constraint to operating any type of high-frequency service with DMUs.

Iit also seems clear that the MBTA is no longer pursuing Charlie Cards for commuter rail, and if anything is more likely to pursue smart phone payments for fare gates at subway stations and fare boxes on buses and light-rail.

“Yep. And I think that's why Zone 1A just ain't gonna happen outside of the Fairmount Line or Track 61. It's too much of a loss leader.”

Not as much of a loss leader as the cost to build and operate a Blue Line extension to Lynn

 

[alexander]

I've always wanted to explore this area ( preferably when it is light out, for at least two reasons ), but never have much time. But from what I'm gathering from Google maps, Google streetview, and a quick drive around at night, this area should really be primed for something good.

I feel rather strange commenting on a thread thats a few years old, but I'm new to archBOSTON, and couldn't help myself. As someone who recently purchased a home in Lynn (outside of downtown), my wife and I have been exploring downtown Lynn in bits and pieces. We've been pleasantly surprised with the quantity and quality of local restaurants and bars in the area (especially the ones with evening/late-night music venues). From what I've heard this "renaissance" of Lynn has been slowly (snails pace) progressing since the early 90s. Although Lynn still has crime (what city doesn't), its now isolated to very specific residential neighborhoods, rather than all of DTL. More evening programming, vigilant police and well-lit streets have certainly helped.

Like I said, business must be decent. Or maybe there were other activities going on in the back room. It does seem to still be an auto-reliant area, though, despite how well suited it is for transit. I'm guessing alot of city regulation is holding more development back. Does anyone know anything about the spaces under the rail viaduct? Were these ever retail shops?

The local business in Lynn are strong-ish, but are mainly held up by local favorites such as Zimman's, The Blue Ox etc. The fact that Downtown has so many vacant lots keeps the vacant retail space at bay, while demand increases with new loft/condo conversions. Lynn has been lucky enough to keep some absolutely beautiful mill/warehouse buildings, that are just in need of a little TLC. Its only a matter of time before these vacant lots are developed... As for the viaduct "storefronts" I'm not sure, but I have seen various public art displayed by the local "RAW Art Works.

 

[alexander]

Central Lynn is surprisingly great for blocks at a time until you turn a corner and - surprise! - strip mall, massive parking lot, vacant land. Nonetheless, this place is going to see tons of investment if and when rapid transit ever comes.

At this point, wouldn't it make sense for Lynn to advocate for a DMU express to North Station rather than waiting for the Blue Line? That would of course benefit cities like Chelsea also.

At what point do market priorities shift, allowing those strip malls and vacant lots to be redeveloped? Is frequent public transit necessary (DMU, Blue Line) or can things develop with a ferry and 10 minute drive to wonderland?

 

[Shepard]

At what point do market priorities shift, allowing those strip malls and vacant lots to be redeveloped? Is frequent public transit necessary (DMU, Blue Line) or can things develop with a ferry and 10 minute drive to wonderland?

My feeling is that the calculus changes when walking into and within the neighborhood becomes more convenient and more preferred than driving. At that point, the parking spaces of strip malls become less valuable than street frontage. And vacant lots are more likely to be redeveloped as part of the urban fabric.

Witness all the places in Lynn (as in many other places around here) where an X intersection - a typical Boston "square" - sees at least one (if not multiple) of the intersection's triangles devoted to parking and a one-story fast food structure.* That "ten minute drive" being hyped just encourages that. Ditto for a ferry that you wouldn't want to walk to and from (and doesn't have anywhere near rapid transit headways). The twenty-minute ride to Government Center (or North Station, with rapid transit headways) would, I feel, do the opposite.

*Actually, Lynn has many fewer of these than places like Dorchester. Many of Lynn's major intersections are surprisingly well-appointed with a sense of enclosure and solid streetwalls (though not typically active ones).

 

[kjdonovan]

Alexander, would you please tell your city council to take up a vote for the bike to the sea initiative? http://www.biketothesea.com/

It is the only town that hasn't taken up a simple tourist draw that, at least for me, is a no-brainer. The Lynn area beaches north of Nahant are quite nice and deserve more attention.