MBTA Red Line / Blue Line Connector

Good pdf.

I think they should eliminate bowdoin as a stop completely and bore down to charles MGH.
 
palindrome said:
Good pdf.

I think they should eliminate bowdoin as a stop completely and bore down to charles MGH.
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I always thought instead of re-doing the Charles/MGH stop, they should simply bury it.
 
mass88 said:
I always thought instead of re-doing the Charles/MGH stop, they should simply bury it.
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the whole thing? including the redline? That doesn't seem like it'd work out. They have provisions to create an in-system transfer, so i don't think it'd matter much.
 
So, here's a left field idea...

(i have no concept of whether it would be viable so I'll look forward to responses from those here who know more about this kind of thing than i do)...

...could you connect the blue and red tunnels? This would probably mean taking the blue line up Bowdoin street and then digging up the common in front of the state house to establish a junction. It wouldn't require any more under-street digging than a cambridge st. routing would, and it would open up the option of expanding a new segment of blue line service outbound from downtown somewhere in the future (perhaps down the grand junction right of way to cambridgeport / allston and then down the pike to newtown and watertown).

Would this be even remotely feasible, technically?
 
Here's an idea. Why not spend the attention and money on repairs and maintenance before the MBTA expands its system?
 
The heights and widths of the cars for the Red and Blue lines are drastically different, so it would not be possible to run Blue Line cars in the Red line tunnel for passenger use.

I do agree, though, that it is physically possible to extend the Blue Line tunnel from Bowdoin Station to Park Street Station, following the dashed blue alignment:

GCtunnel.jpg
 
Hold the phone. That's a very logical idea to bring the Blue Line to Park Street from Bowdoin. Other alternatives would be to bring it in from Government Center or from State Street.

The distance, as the crow flies, is .34 from Bowdoin to Park, .28 from Gov't Center to Park, and .29 from State Street to Park.

It's .44 from Bowdoin to Charles.

Am I missing something? Do you think they've considered this?
 
JohnAKeith said:
Do you think they've considered this?
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This has been a plan a few times. When the original subway was constructed there were various plans to connect the East Boston Tunnel (Blue Line) to the subway (Green Line). In the 1920s when the East Boston Tunnel was converted to heavy rail there was also a plan to covert the Green Line to heavy rail and connect the two exactly how CharlieMTA drew out.

Since then, however, commuting patterns have changed and I don't think this would ever be a serious consideration today. IMHO a better option would be to build a second Green Line tunnel to fix the bottleneck between Park St and Gov't Center.

Building the Blue Line to Park, while geographically shorter, would probably be twice as expensive since it would have to carefully maneuver its way around the State House and Park St church. Building a cut-and-cover tunnel down Cambridge St would be drastically cheaper and simpler; less for the T to fuck up.
 
vanshnookenraggen said:
This has been a plan a few times. When the original subway was constructed there were various plans to connect the East Boston Tunnel (Blue Line) to the subway (Green Line). In the 1920s when the East Boston Tunnel was converted to heavy rail there was also a plan to covert the Green Line to heavy rail and connect the two exactly how CharlieMTA drew out.

Since then, however, commuting patterns have changed and I don't think this would ever be a serious consideration today. IMHO a better option would be to build a second Green Line tunnel to fix the bottleneck between Park St and Gov't Center.

Building the Blue Line to Park, while geographically shorter, would probably be twice as expensive since it would have to carefully maneuver its way around the State House and Park St church. Building a cut-and-cover tunnel down Cambridge St would be drastically cheaper and simpler; less for the T to fuck up.
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I agree with your GL comment, but it's the MBTA. They'll fuck it up no matter what ...
 
vanshnookenraggen said:
Building a cut-and-cover tunnel down Cambridge St would be drastically cheaper and simpler; less for the T to fuck up.
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The other advantage is that there is actually some new real estate to be served by extending the line from Charles/MGH. If the Blue Line were extended to Park St, that would put a lot of pressure on the existing station infrastructure and a possible extension (Beacon St, which would require lots of digging under the Common) wouldn't serve that many new areas. The Esplenade, however, is lacking transit access, as is much of the riverfront in that area.

EDIT: On the other hand, a glance at the map shows that both routes could serve the same area, with a little creativity.
 
JohnAKeith said:
The distance, as the crow flies, is .34 from Bowdoin to Park, .28 from Gov't Center to Park, and .29 from State Street to Park.

It's .44 from Bowdoin to Charles.

Am I missing something? Do you think they've considered this?
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What you're missing, I think, is that the Blue Line tunnel already extends some distance beyond Bowdoin station, as 'tail tracks' used for storing cars at the end of the line.
 
There was something in today's Metro about this project. Unfortunately, the Metro's web page sucks and I can't find any info online. Anyone have a copy of the Metro laying around, or know what is going on?
 
statler said:
There was something in today's Metro about this project. Unfortunately, the Metro's web page sucks and I can't find any info online. Anyone have a copy of the Metro laying around, or know what is going on?
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It says little to nothing, I almost didn't notice it while reading it this morning.

Inside the cover on the bottom of the sidebar:

*insert T logo here*

Red meets Blue?
The MBTA held a public meeting on the proposal to link the Red and Blue lines. The proposal would extend the Blue Line from its current termination point at Bowdoin station to meet the Red line at the Charles MGH station. MassDOT's preferred alternative plan would eliminate the Bowdoin station.
(*)Metro
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I really hope they don't eliminate Bowdoin, but rather place it between Staniford and New Chardon.

This morning when I was coming out of Bowdoin I saw announcements of the public meeting still taped to the doors. Someone took a Sharpie and wrote "SAVE BOWDOIN" on all of them.
 
I'm fine with eliminating Bowdoin station. Maybe leave it as a ghost station instead of demolishing it! That would be boss.

BostonUrbEx said:
I really hope they don't eliminate Bowdoin, but rather place it between Staniford and New Chardon.
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The problem is there just ain't enough people over there to justify a station. It is so close to Gov't Center anyway.
 
Someone please explain how eliminating Bowdoin would result in MORE riders, like the slides claim?

Alternative 1 Alternative 2 Daily Users 8,020 7,550
 
The slide doesn't make it clear whether they're going cut-and-cover or bore?
 
according to the fact sheet i just discovered ( http://www.eot.state.ma.us/redblue/downloads/FactSheet2_050310.pdf ) The tunnel will be bored if the perfered alternative is chosen with a few exceptions. these exceptions are:

An area east of Bowdoin Station, 550 feet long, to realign the existing tracks and allow the tunnel boring machine to be removed;

A segment east of Charles/MGH Station to install the tunnel boring machine and build vertical station components east of Charles/MGH; and

Construction of short tail tracks west of Charles/ MGH Station would be undertaken using the sequential excavation mining method because there is a sharp bend in the tunnel alignment, making it impossible for the TBM to reach it.
Click to expand...
 
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