MBTA Red Line / Blue Line Connector

HenryAlan said:
Exactly! LA just opened their version of the Red-Blue connector, which included 3 new underground stations and a complex series of junctions because it involved merging 3 lines in to two. And yet, we sit here spinning our wheels for decades.
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Their projects aren't going swimmingly either. The MBTA just opened a big light rail extension, remember. Opening things isn't the same as performing well.
 
HenryAlan said:
Exactly! LA just opened their version of the Red-Blue connector, which included 3 new underground stations and a complex series of junctions because it involved merging 3 lines in to two. And yet, we sit here spinning our wheels for decades.
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We may have been held to an LA growth standard up to about 1960. Then, apples might have been apples when Boston proper was at or around 800k people. That number dropped to 510k. Boston and the MBTA have been playing a deficit game ever since… sadly out of sheer utility.
At 690k, we need to grow our tax base to play by those rules and to make that comparison.
 
BeyondRevenue said:
We may have been held to an LA growth standard up to about 1960. Then, apples might have been apples when Boston proper was at or around 800k people. That number dropped to 510k. Boston and the MBTA have been playing a deficit game ever since… sadly out of sheer utility.
At 690k, we need to grow our tax base to play by those rules and to make that comparison.
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That 800k included a lot more kids, remember.
 
jklo said:
That 800k included a lot more kids, remember.
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And the population of Greater Boston didn't decline, either, even with the white flight from Boston. It, in fact, has grown only grown during that period (with perhaps a slight decline for the first time due to the pandemic). It is the area serviced by the MBTA, which is a state agency and services significantly more than just the City of Boston itself. Furthermore, the MBTA took over from the MTA in 1964, and certainly hasn't been planning the deficit game since then, and was quite expansionist for most of the period up until 2000. Previous to the switch to 'forward funding' in 2000, the MBTA couldn't take on debt as the State was obligated to pay it's budget every year.

I would wager with the ratio of kids to working adults now, and the significant increase in residential units and commercial real-estate/businesses moving in that the tax base for the City of Boston (which is based on property, not number of people) is higher than in the 1950s.
 
bakgwailo said:
And the population of Greater Boston didn't decline, either, even with the white flight from Boston. It, in fact, has grown only grown during that period (with perhaps a slight decline for the first time due to the pandemic). It is the area serviced by the MBTA, which is a state agency and services significantly more than just the City of Boston itself. Furthermore, the MBTA took over from the MTA in 1964, and certainly hasn't been planning the deficit game since then, and was quite expansionist for most of the period up until 2000. Previous to the switch to 'forward funding' in 2000, the MBTA couldn't take on debt as the State was obligated to pay it's budget every year.

I would wager with the ratio of kids to working adults now, and the significant increase in residential units and commercial real-estate/businesses moving in that the tax base for the City of Boston (which is based on property, not number of people) is higher than in the 1950s.
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There was a four decade period of anti-city rhetoric and actions as well as anti-MBTA (= anti-minority dog whistling) from Governor Weld to present day). That hobbled us. Prop 2 1/2 killed a chunk of local revenue that then came from the Commonwealth instead of local budgets.
There’s no excuse why we can’t unwind history’s neglected, knotted rope. I’m for raising taxes. Find a politician who can say that and I’ll show you a heated primary where they’ll lose.
The will to change our behavior… That is what we need.
 
Another funding option is electronic tolling of the expressways inside I-95/128, and using the revenue thus raised for transit expansion. This has been discussed before on this site in depth. The current Federal laws don't allow it on Interstates, but I'm hoping this will change in the future with Congressional legislation.
 
Well, if you are specifically talking about Red-Blue... the "main" benefit is for Blue Line residents to get on the Red Line easier. But if Lynn is any indication, the State sure doesn't seem to care much about that area...

The "secondary" benefit is to make it easier for MIT and Kendall workers to get to/from the airport. That might be why it gets built.
 
Yeah, and also better access to MGH, Mass Eye and Ear, Shriner's, etc, from the blue line directly. In the long run, I think the biggest benefit is really just taking the load off the more central transfer points at Government Center, State, Park St, and DTX which, as ridership eventually recovers, will becoming overcrowded again as it was pre-2020. Direct access (or a 2 seat ride from a 3+ seat) from here to there is just the icing on the cake.
 
I noticed that MBTA just updated their Red-Blue connector page and it looks like according to their environmental justice screening form, they anticipate filing with MEPA on Oct 2, 2023. https://cdn.mbta.com/sites/default/files/2023-7-24-ej-screening-form-english.pdf

According to their 2021 presentation, the MEPA/NEPA process was supposed to happen in 2022 with final design starting in early 2023, so it seems like they're about a year behind that timeline, but at least things seem to be moving forward (?)
 
Great find, at least something is happening and it hasnt just stalled out again.
 
Updated Renderings of the RL/BL Connector!

Photos: @thembta

EDIT: This is the only updated render of the RL/BL Connector

IMG_7292.jpeg
 
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Charlie_mta said:
Okay, MBTA. Stop studying it to death and build it!
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The social media posts today are referencing how additional funding has been allocated in the FY24-28 CIP to get this to 30% design at the tune of ~$30 million.

Infrastructure costs don't seem real to me anymore. $30 million to get this to a schematic-level of design....
 
stefal said:
The social media posts today are referencing how additional funding has been allocated in the FY24-28 CIP to get this to 30% design at the tune of ~$30 million.

Infrastructure costs don't seem real to me anymore. $30 million to get this to a schematic-level of design....
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Ah, but you miss the simplicity of it all! $1M for every 1% of design. It makes such perfect mathematical sense anyone could do it!

Then $10M for every 1% of construction. Construction is harder, you see, so there's multiplication involved. USA! USA! :poop:
 
F-Line to Dudley said:
The first and third images are at least 2 years old and have appeared in other MBTA slide decks, but the second one showing the spatial representation of the new station level looks new to me.
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The second one is from the june 7 2021 presentation
https://cdn.mbta.com/sites/default/files/2021-06/2021-06-07-fmcb-O-red-blue-connector-update.pdf

And then you have a bunch more related renders here
https://cdn.mbta.com/sites/default/files/2021-12/2021-12-01-red-blue-concept-design-report.pdf

Which come from the project page here
https://www.mbta.com/projects/red-blue-connector
 
According to this article from boston.com, it seems like the project is moving forward however it states that the environmental review should be finished by early 2025 which means the project is about 2 years behind schedule.
www.boston.com

Here’s where the MBTA’s Red-Blue Connector stands

Touted by transit advocates, the Red-Blue Connector has idled for decades. Now, new funding aims to inch the long-awaited project forward.
www.boston.com
 
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