Portland Passenger Rail

[riptide]

Rail advocates renew push for passenger service to Bangor

A bill to be heard this week seeks federal seed funding for a proposal to restore passenger service from Portland through Auburn, Lewiston, Waterville and Bangor to Orono.

www.pressherald.com

After last year’s bill to begin studying a Portland-Bangor failed in the House, the same Maine state legislators who put forward that initiative last year are tabling a slightly-updated version this year.

The article says the main difference this time around is they want the studied rail corridor to be the “Back Road” (via L/A) rather than the “Lower Road” (via Brunswick). Thus, the main carrot they’re dangling to convince legislators who didn’t support the concept last time, to support it this time, is that now L/A’s 60,000-strong population is on the route. (Of course, when you subtract Brunswick and Augusta’s combined 40,000 residents, since this alternative corridor would bypass them, it’s really only an extra 20,000 people…not exactly an earth-shattering difference from last time.) They’re also pointing out CSX recently put some money into the Back Road so capital costs shouldn’t be quite as high as when they were last projected.

And as for institutional support:

The previous bill also drew strong opposition from officials with the MDOT, Portland Regional Chamber of Commerce and NNEPRA, who testified that passenger service to Bangor would be too slow, attract too few riders and cost too much to establish and operate.
…
Hasenfus and other proponents said they expect MDOT officials and others to resurrect their opposition…

You miss 100% of the shots you don’t take, as they say.

 

[PWMFlyer]

MDOT will always be against passenger rail aka SLR from Portland to Lewiston, MCRR/BAR to Bangor, MCRR Portland to North Conway as long as Nate Moulton is leading the rail division. He is an example of people who just collect a paycheck and a pension, no vision and he praised Gilford/PAR for providing exceptional service... LOL he has to go ... I rode the Downeaster last Sunday to the Celtics. Sold Out both ways. You can't beat it. 70 mph most of the way until MBTA regulated tracks. I don't know how the MDOT bus is doing from Lewiston, but I never see anyone on it. This is what the MDOT and Nate are pushing, rip up the rails, use the bus.....

 

[TC_zoid]

$32 million, and so by the time Portland would be ready for it's construction, maybe approaching $50 million? How do you justify that? And what about 24/7 security costs? I still think the best approach is to work with Concord Coach for a new terminal with dynamic food and drink options that both entities can share revenue from. Sometimes throughout the day the existing terminal is packed with passengers waiting for a train or bus and with connects from too. The potential revenue lost by only offering vending machines is disturbing. There could be beer and wine sales too (hello, Bissell). And how do you eat anything from a vending machine? We aren't Tokyo.

Looks nice though. Reminds me of the Old Saybrook station in CT.
https://www.mainebiz.biz/article/we...llow-for-additional-routes-for-southern-maine

**

 

[markhb]

$32 million, and so by the time Portland would be ready for it's construction, maybe approaching $50 million? How do you justify that? And what about 24/7 security costs? I still think the best approach is to work with Concord Coach for a new terminal with dynamic food and drink options that both entities can share revenue from. Sometimes throughout the day the existing terminal is packed with passengers waiting for a train or bus and with connects from too. The potential revenue lost by only offering vending machines is disturbing. There could be beer and wine sales too (hello, Bissell). And how do you eat anything from a vending machine? We aren't Tokyo.

Looks nice though. Reminds me of the Old Saybrook station in CT.
https://www.mainebiz.biz/article/we...llow-for-additional-routes-for-southern-maine

**

I've wondered how much business could be grabbed by a food truck lurking in the circle at the end of Sewall St. in the mornings, serving basic breakfast sandwiches, short-order lunch, etc.

 

[TC_zoid]

I've wondered how much business could be grabbed by a food truck lurking in the circle at the end of Sewall St. in the mornings, serving basic breakfast sandwiches, short-order lunch, etc.

People waiting around during the day with nothing to do confronted by convenient and fun food trucks results in... I'd put a big tent in the parking lot with seating too. Bissell could shuttle food and brews over. Make traveling/waiting around fun again.

 

[markhb]

I doubt it will shed more light on the decision-making process, but the final Site Relocation Planning Report for the Portland station is available on the NNEPRA website (PDF warning). Here's the conceptual drawing...

 

[NR2Portland]

I hope that’s phase 1/10 in the relocation of the station and redevelopment of the surrounding area. This growing urban center needs more than this and everyone knows that. Redo the awful one story strip mall that was put in place of the beautiful Union Station. Make offers on the surrounding properties to redevelop them for parking garages, mixed use buildings, and a true urban train station instead of this awful design.

 

[RandomWalk]

It’s a PoMo Amshack.

 

[TC_zoid]

I hope that’s phase 1/10 in the relocation of the station and redevelopment of the surrounding area. This growing urban center needs more than this and everyone knows that. Redo the awful one story strip mall that was put in place of the beautiful Union Station. Make offers on the surrounding properties to redevelop them for parking garages, mixed use buildings, and a true urban train station instead of this awful design.

Agree 110%. As I indicated earlier, it will look like the Old Saybrook station in CT, though at least that station has some surrounding food businesses. The population of Old Saybrook is 10,481 so with the new Portland station it will result as less-than of the Old Saybrook one! This kind of behavior needs to STOP, this do-the-minimum to solve a problem in Maine. It's embarrassing and just plain STUPID, and around the corner is the future and we got a problem again. But the state/city/county/authority does know how to spend money--it get's some credit for that.

 

[F-Line to Dudley]

I doubt it will shed more light on the decision-making process, but the final Site Relocation Planning Report for the Portland station is available on the NNEPRA website (PDF warning). Here's the conceptual drawing...

View attachment 60779

Jesus Christ....a 2-car platform??? Are they trying to murder dwell times?

Downeaster runs 5 cars every time. Ergo, you must have at least a 5-car platform at all stops but ESPECIALLY IN FREAKING PORTLAND.

 

[TC_zoid]

Here's a link to the NNEPRA contact page...
https://www.nnepra.com/contact/
I sent them my thoughts along with a link to our Arch page. You know, to get a bigger picture. Perhaps they can join our blog and contribute too (Lol). I think we should ALL send a note. This could be the single dumbest idea in regards to healthy and smart economics and infrastructure in the history of the state. And if necessary, I will point out the serious 24/7 security issue with this station, or late at night when people need to catch a rideshare and they are the only person around. Run the crime stats on muggings in the West End against women for the last few years. That's the good area too, up above on the hill.

 

[Portlander]

 

[F-Line to Dudley]

View attachment 60796

You know who doesn't nuke the dwells to uselessness with 2-car platforms? Meriden, CT. They're built for 6 cars.

Maybe this "possible station configuration" should be more similar to Meriden than it is.

 

[Cosakita18]

You know who doesn't nuke the dwells to uselessness with 2-car platforms? Meriden, CT. They're built for 6 cars.

Maybe this "possible station configuration" should be more similar to Meriden than it is.

I assume these mini-highs" are meant for freight clearance. Wouldn't be surprised if CSX is mandating that. Extremely shortsighted nonetheless.

The best solution would be two full-height platforms with a center-bypass track for freight, but that's probably more work than NNEPRA or CSX want to do.

I also can't get over the **750 square foot** waiting area. That's MICROSCOPIC. That's the size of a 2-bedroom apartment. Imagine 100+ people waiting for the morning southbound. Even the infamous "Amshacks" had waiting areas twice as large.

Just an all-around shortsighted and poorly thought-out concept

 

[F-Line to Dudley]

I assume these mini-highs" are meant for freight clearance. Wouldn't be surprised if CSX is mandating that. Extremely shortsighted nonetheless.

Mini-highs are 1-car only with flippable edges for high-and-wide freights, and then the rest of the platform is low-level for as many cars as you need so at least all doors in the consist can open for step-up boarding/alighting. Same as every DE stop from Haverhill to Old Orchard Beach.

This render is for 2-car full-highs, which are too long to have flippable edges so there's no freight clearance in the design (CSX will ream NNEPRA out for that on the cross-examination). And then...*nothing*...for the rest of the platform. You literally can only open doors on 2 cars of the consist, which means long lines in the aisles to/from the open doors for all the people that have to get on and off. With Portland being the #2 ridership stop behind North Station that's going to make for excruciating dwells of multiple minutes, squandering a decent chunk of the savings from eliminating the Mountain Jct. reverse. Nobody designs a major station's platform like this. It's totally defective for passenger movement.

It will cost more for sure, but Portland is a location you try like hell to fund real passing tracks for so the thing can be full length at fully level-boarding. At the very least the platform accommodations shouldn't be worse than the Thompson's Point platform they're vacating. But given how much they're skimping on the waiting room, they seem to think this has the ridership of a podunk MassDOT Cape Flyer flag stop.

 

[PWMFlyer]

Remember, The Downeaster is on the list for the New Amtrak Airos. Amtrak was planning to give them 4 cars vs 5 which I don't know that status on that.

Introducing Amtrak Airo

New Amtrak Airo Trains Quick Facts Program Status In Production Benefits Replacing 40 to 50-year-old passenger railcars with state-of-the-art

amtraknewera.com

 

[Cosakita18]

Remember, The Downeaster is on the list for the New Amtrak Airos. Amtrak was planning to give them 4 cars vs 5 which I don't know that status on that.

Small correction: The Downeaster is set to get the "B-1" subtype of the Airo which will have a Siemens Charger diesel locomotive and 5 coaches plus a sixth coach/cab at the rear. The coach closest to the locomotive will be an APV (Auxiliary Power Vehicle) with will have a pantograph and transformer that can power the Charger in electric mode.

So the new Airos will actually be a bit longer than the existing Downeaster trainsets.

 

[TC_zoid]

The Downeaster line between Boston and Brunswick falls into (or can) a kind of commuter/tourism/suburb train. And with Red Sox, Bruins, Celtics games it's no different a function than the D Line in Boston bringing in hundreds of fans for the game from the western locale suburbs (can take an hour's time too). Maine is Vacationland, right? I think the passenger cars should reflect that a bit, rather than simply the same configuration, only newer. More could be done in the summer to market to people in the Boston area and the hordes of American and especially international tourists visiting Boston, for a kind of two-day jaunt on the Downeaster up to Portland. Most International tourists are not going to drive and rent a car, so this could be an entirely new demographic to bring to the state (the Brits will drive on the wrong side of the road). European and Asian tourists who do not arrive on a cruise ship for a day will spend considerably more money. And cruise ship passengers do not benefit our hotels and lodging. Often, they are kind of an irritant in town (admit it). And yes, I know, I should stop dreaming of that Swiss-styled view car (but I can't).

 

[cneal]

Worth noting that this study was (mis)managed by vhb, the same firm that's flubbing the multi-billion dollar Allston Multimodal Project in Boston:
https://mass.streetsblog.org/2025/0...es-remain-unresolved-for-allston-i-90-project

I don't understand why agencies keep on making the mistake of hiring these guys. They obviously have no interest in designing or planning practical infrastructure projects. They can collect more consulting fees on "planning" studies that make dumb recommendations, and therefore require us to pay them for yet another "planning study" in a few years once everyone finally realizes their first planning study was awful.

 

[cneal]

Also amusing is that a huge part of this VHB study was a "zoning analysis," but they apparently didn't consider Recode until the last minute, and then they had to add an appendix at the end that basically says that all the zoning discussion in the main report is out of date.

By the way, their recommended station is illegal under the new zoning code: they want to build a 150-space parking lot on Saint John Street, but the ReCode specifies a maximum parking ratio of 1 parking spot per 500 square feet of station floor area for intermodal transportation facilities (see page 18-3).

Unless they're planning to build a station that's bigger than a football field, there's no way they'd be allowed to build that much new parking. The intent of the new parking maximum rules is that the city wants these kinds of facilities to be built near bus routes, instead of wasting more land on government-subsidized parking lots – but Patricia Quinn and VHB weren't paying attention, so they whiffed it.