Rose Kennedy Greenway

DudeUrSistersHot said:
Has any MassHighway infrastructure ever had any failure even remotely close to the failure of the big dig?
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Well, in Ipswich, almost all of their bridges were damaged and closed by recent flooding.
 
Ron Newman said:
DudeUrSistersHot said:
Has any MassHighway infrastructure ever had any failure even remotely close to the failure of the big dig?
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Well, in Ipswich, almost all of their bridges were damaged and closed by recent flooding.
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By a natural disaster, not by incompetent construction and design.
 
Lack of maintenance and repair, compounded by a natural disaster.
 
You shouldn't leave structures prone to being destroyed during natural disasters if you can help it.

As an example: When they designed the twin towers, they made a design that could take being hit by a plane. However, the planes they were talking about were Cessnas and Learjets, never dreamed of 767s. I'm not saying that it was poor planning (who ever thought this would/could happen?) or that even if they did design it to take a hit from a 767 that it would have worked, but who knows?

I think the maintenence comment was key though. A bridge, if not maintained, it VERY prone to being destroyed during heavy rains. I know this was the worst flooding in X many years, but a flood is way more predictable around these parts than, say, a big tornado.
 
castevens said:
You shouldn't leave structures prone to being destroyed during natural disasters if you can help it.

As an example: When they designed the twin towers, they made a design that could take being hit by a plane. However, the planes they were talking about were Cessnas and Learjets, never dreamed of 767s. I'm not saying that it was poor planning (who ever thought this would/could happen?) or that even if they did design it to take a hit from a 767 that it would have worked, but who knows?
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The Twin Tower were designed for an impact with a 747 (the largest at the time?). What was not accounted for was the intense heat from the jet fuel that compromised the steel structure. This is still and issue that engineers cannot cost effectively design for.

One of the reasons you may see more concrete towers in the future.
 
More fireproofing was added to all renovated spaces within the WTC after the first terrorist incident. Engineers realized how the core could potentially act as a chimney and how the outer secondary structure could create an internal oven effect. I forget which tower had more renovations done, and thus more added fireproofing, but it lasted significantly longer before failure. The guy who decided against the cost of fully improving the fireproofing at once vs. phasing it in with annual office lease renovations is pretty much wasting away with guilt.

The convection of the heat from the fires within an enclosed space was sufficient enough to cause a cascade of failures at the rigid joints within the buildings. The strength of the steel doesn't mean diddly if the connections between members start to yield to rotational forces. All it took was one floor to fail and start sliding down the central core to start a chain reaction. The failing floors compressed superheated air downward causing the blow out effects that all the conspiracy theorists have their panties in a wad over. This blast of heat pretty much screwed any rigid joints in addition to the weight of the floors above. The thick central cores of the buildings kept the structure falling within a relatively straight line, so there was no chance of enough material drifting to spare the lower floors. If more of the outer skeleton had been removed the fire would have burned at a lower temperature not being starved for oxygen and convecting inwards, possibly buying enough time for the NYFD to cool down the flames. However 110 story buildings lacking their sheer reinforcement from a damaged outer skeleton with the amount of sway the WTC had at high altitude winds, could have proved just as catastrophic. You can bet that EVERY new skyscraper built since 2001 now has a helluvalot more fireproofing added.

Getting back to highways, the whole steel system built in the 1950s is falling apart due to neglect and the cost of repair and that's why all new structures are reinforced concrete. Concrete is cheaper to repair and if reinforcing steel is properly jacketed it'll never rust, hence infrastructure with much greater longevity.
 
North End Greenway Update

The businesses of the North End are starting to reclaim that enormous sidewalk along the Surface Artery (not too busy though)...


The trellis is up and the North End Parks are coming along nicely...


And of course the urban fabric of the city is seamlessly stitched back together... :wink:
 
Well, those last two pictures are of the ramp parcels, right? You can't judge the Greenway on the ramp parcels. Wait until one of the buildings is up on that spot, then you can judge it.
 
The problem right now is that all Greenway construction has been halted temporarily while the Ted Williams Tunnel is closed. I don't understand why, since the Greenway is unrelated to any roadway repairs.
 
Because everything in Boston must take twice as long as it should.
 
Construction of the Greenway hasn't halted. In fact, at least at the Portal Park by the Zakim/Strada234, work has started up again after what feels like months of nothing.

For the past week contractors have been laying the brick sidewalks in the area.
 
But I no longer see any work going on in the North End or Wharf parks.
 
Work was halted for a while because of traffic concerns. Work has recommenced at both the North End Parks and the Wharf District Parks, although the pace has been slow since the tunnel collapse. However, just this morning I noticed that the level of work has picked up substantially on some of the Wharf District park sites. It still seems to be slower than before the accident on the North End park sites, but hopefully that will change soon.
 
laramaro said:
Work was halted for a while because of traffic concerns. Work has recommenced at both the North End Parks and the Wharf District Parks, although the pace has been slow since the tunnel collapse. .
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I can't get over that. That sounds so.. awful. Can anyone have imagined this (literally) a year ago? I saw a good amount of construction on the greenway earlier this week. There were a couple of crews laying brick down to make what appeared to be an enormously wide sidewalk. Anyone else think the greenway name should be changed to the Melina del Valle Greenway?
 
un-fucking-believeable

Governor vetoes $31m for Greenway

By Michael Levenson, Globe Staff | July 30, 2006

Governor Mitt Romney has vetoed $31 million for the Rose Kennedy Greenway, the 27-acre ribbon of parks and development being built in downtown Boston, saying it is much more important to use the money to repair the Big Dig tunnels underground.

The move has surprised and angered supporters of the Greenway, who said the veto could delay construction of two highly anticipated cultural institutions -- The Boston Museum, a history center near Quincy Market; and the New

Center for Arts and Culture, a forum for music, theater, and dance near The Boston Harbor Hotel. And tentative plans for a YMCA community center near the TD Banknorth Garden might have to be scrapped altogether, said John M. Ferrell, president and chief executive of the YMCA of Greater Boston.

Supporters fear that Romney is losing sight of the grand vision of renewal for Boston that Big Dig planners promised, epitomized by the replacement of the hulking Central Artery with an inviting green space and a walkway from the North End to downtown.

``You've got to take the long view, and the long view is the tunnel is going to be repaired, public confidence is going to be restored, and we have to create the Greenway that has been envisioned all along," said Ronald M. Druker , chairman of the New Center.
big dig: Problems Coverage Traffic Updates

The Legislature had approved the money to build covers over the ramps that connect Interstate 93 to streets near the North End, Faneuil Hall, and Rowes Wharf, where each of the proposed buildings is planned.

But Romney -- having seized control of Big Dig inspections from the Massachusetts Turnpike Authority and forced out its chairman, Matthew J. Amorello -- said the state must reserve the money for fixes to the project's highways and tunnels.

The state has been conducting what Romney calls a ``stem-to-stern" audit of the highway system since the July 10 death of Milena Del Valle.

A Jamaica Plain mother of three, Del Valle was killed in the Interstate 90 connector when concrete fell from the ceiling onto her car.

``We may need these funds for repairing these tunnels, and repairing the tunnels is our first priority," said Eric Fehrnstrom, Romney's spokesman.

State officials have said they do not know how much the repairs will cost.

Romney also argued that spending $31 million on Greenway ramps placed an unfair burden on the millions of taxpayers who live outside Boston.

``Massachusetts taxpayers throughout the state should not be forced to pay for the build-out and development of parcels that will benefit predominantly residents of the city of Boston and select organizations that are capable of accessing private funds," Romney wrote in a letter to the Legislature accompanying his veto Friday. ``It is more appropriate to rely on the private sector and the City of Boston for additional costs."

Romney vetoed the $31 million as part of $56 million that he cut from an approximately $189 million spending bill passed by the Legislature.

Greenway supporters said they would push legislators to override the veto tomorrow, the last day of formal sessions.

``It's not realistic to expect nonprofit organizations to pay for those ramps, and if you look at the record, it's always been up to the government to do that," Ferrell said. ``And I'm surprised that the governor doesn't see it that way because the legislative leaders in the House and Senate and the Boston Redevelopment Authority have been very supportive of this, and the governor is the only public official I know who is not."

Spokesmen for House Speaker Salvatore F. DiMasi and Senate President Robert E. Travaglini, both Boston Democrats, did not return calls for comment.

The veto surprised city leaders because the state agreed to pay for the ramps in the early 1990s when it certified the Big Dig's environmental credentials, said Richard A. Dimino, president and chief executive of A Better City, a coalition of downtown business leaders formerly known as the Artery Business Committee.
big dig: Problems Coverage Traffic Updates

Mayor Thomas M. Menino said the city never expected to pay for the roads and ramps leading to the Greenway.

``The governor doesn't understand the fact that . . . the Rose Kennedy Greenway is a state project; the city doesn't have any piece of that, so either he's misinformed or someone wrote him a letter saying it was the city's responsibility," Menino said. ``I'm a little perplexed by his quotes in the letter [to the Legislature] because it doesn't fit the political rhetoric we've heard for a long time on state and city relations when it comes to the Rose Kennedy Greenway."

Amorello considers the veto ``an unfortunate move," his spokeswoman, Mariellen Burns, said.

``Chairman Amorello thought it was very important to assist in covering the ramps," Burns said. ``This is the state fulfilling its responsibility per the environmental permitting for the project."

Peter G. Meade, chairman of the Greenway Conservancy, the 10-member board that raises money for the area's parks and cultural activities, disputed Romney's contention that private interests could pay for Greenway ramps.

``Building the highway, including the ramps, is absolutely, clearly, and totally the government's responsibility," he said.

Michael Levenson can be reached at mlevenson@globe.com.
? Copyright 2006 Globe Newspaper Company.
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:roll: :evil: :twisted: :evil: :twisted: :x
 
Punishing the city of Boston plays well to his buddies in Iowa, where he was yesterday spending our money, after a tough week of blaming others and putting Joe Malones hacks in charge.

Now the story goes, in Iowa, that it was "Democratic Ward Bosses" in Massachusetts who cooked the books... not Jim Kerasiotes, the great privatizer who himself was supposed to come in and save this state from the Dem ward bosses and trade unions.
 
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