SKY Everett | 114 Spring Street | Everett

kmp1284 said:
There’s a difference between sticking your neck out and proposing to light a pallet of cash on fire. Nobody in their right mind is going to pay new construction prices to live in this wasteland.
Click to expand...

The Pioneer Everett building is one block away (one bedrooms rent for around $2400) and there is a big housing development going up in Chelsea which is 2-3 blocks away from this site.
 
kmp1284 said:
And it’s largely been a commercial failure.
Click to expand...
Do you think the pandemic had anything to do with this, and do you think we're always going to be in pandemic-mode?
kmp1284 said:
...had a lot more going for it...desirable and gentrified...
Click to expand...
Ouch.
kmp1284 said:
An irrelevant comparison.
Click to expand...
Not irrelevant at all, just more general.
JumboBuc said:
If the developer wants to risk "light[ing] a pallet of cash on fire" he can be my guest. Its his and his partners' money and risk, not mine and not yours.
Again, our cities were built on speculative risk. We need riskers to push the envelope.
Click to expand...
^this.

Some people on this forum clearly work in the industry of assessing and transacting real estate value. That is but one (highly abstracted) view of our reality. It is not the totality of reality, nor is it what touches most of the people who experience the city and environs. In fact, much of the real estate around us was developed before any of us were born, some of it involving tremendous risk, and some of its creators faced financial ruin - but they faced such ruin on their on volition after taking too much of a chance. And if you asked any of them again, after the fact, whether they'd prefer a life of chance versus a stable life of wealthlessness, most would still choose the former. Policy that allows people to take such chances, while minimizing the risk for the non-chance-takers, is good policy. A narrow, transactional view of this situation is: "but they could never get financing!" Yet the most amazing business success stories always start with that premise and end with a crazy, resourceful story of somehow finding a way...patching together the right proposal...weaving in benefits for tangential stakeholders...and, yes, tax breaks on occasion.

I, for one, would love the chance to stand back and watch someone else's pile of cash ablaze, while hoping that something great rises from the ashes.
 
kmp1284 said:
And it’s largely been a commercial failure.
Click to expand...

Based on what--the gossip mill? A quick look at their latest Quarterly Report demonstrates that, despite disruption from the pandemic and COVID-19-related restrictions, the Encore Boston Harbor continues to generate gaming revenue. It is not a commercial failure. Get your facts straight.

Assembly had a lot more going for it with highway/transit access plus Somerville was already a desirable and gentrified community. That can’t really be said of Everett.
Click to expand...

I bought a new construction townhome in Everett a year ago a 10-minute walk from 114 Spring Street--a former auto-body shop converted into 5 residential units. My neighbors that make up the association and I all hold college degrees (all from Northeastern, coincidentally), have household incomes above $100k, and we love the neighborhood. Our homes have already appreciated 15% in value since January 2020, and no sign of slowing. Everett may not have previously been 'a desirable and gentrified community,' but I can say with absolute certainty it is becoming one. Thus my earlier suggestion: unlearn whatever stigmas and history you assign to the built environment because there are no shortage of visionaries ready to make you eat your words otherwise.
 
dshoost88 said:
Based on what--the gossip mill? A quick look at their latest Quarterly Report demonstrates that, despite disruption from the pandemic and COVID-19-related restrictions, the Encore Boston Harbor continues to generate gaming revenue. It is not a commercial failure. Get your facts straight.



I bought a new construction townhome in Everett a year ago a 10-minute walk from 114 Spring Street--a former auto-body shop converted into 5 residential units. My neighbors that make up the association and I all hold college degrees (all from Northeastern, coincidentally), have household incomes above $100k, and we love the neighborhood. Our homes have already appreciated 15% in value since January 2020, and no sign of slowing. Everett may not have previously been 'a desirable and gentrified community,' but I can say with absolute certainty it is becoming one. Thus my earlier suggestion: unlearn whatever stigmas and history you assign to the built environment because there are no shortage of visionaries ready to make you eat your words otherwise.
Click to expand...

I'm with you: Boston needs Everett to be a success story (along with several other communities nearby). And we need visionaries to take crazy chances like this.

Real-estate-analyst types who don't think it's an issue if someone earning $100k can't live anywhere near the city center / employment centers are not rooting for Boston. They are just caught up in their job of caring whether certain numbers look "very attractive." That's their prerogative.

It's not yours/my concern whether this particular developer's numbers look "very attractive." If this developer needs to sell/rent at below Somerville rates to occupy this building, but the result is a systemic improvement of the greater-Boston-housing-employment-quality-of-life ecosystem, then it is a win for the majority of us. I'd be careful citing personal examples to folks with a different worldview than this, they'll come back with some argument about how your situation isn't "very attractive" in their realm. Don't listen to them. Your situation is great and I wish you much happiness in your new home.
 
stoweker said:
they did $233mm in gaming rev for 2020, let's generously say they hit another 40mm in room and F&B rev. with the state tax + gen op expense they probably netted ~120mm in NOI on $2.6bn in project costs so figure a 4.6% yield on cost. they likely didn't break even on debt service for the deal on an EBITDA basis let alone on cash flow when you strip out the heavy capex spend. there's no question it's going to generate gaming revenue, it's not generating it at a sustainable pace. will see how 2021 and beyond looks for them but i don't think i'd call wynn boston a screeching homerun; it looks more like a commercial failure.
Click to expand...

And all of the above is meaningless unless you are going to discuss pre-/post- pandemic performance. Which you can't, because it is unknown and unknowable at this point.
 
stoweker said:
deal still sucks wind. it wasn't doing great pre-pandemic, and hell, it was like the only entertainment venue open during the pandemic and it still didn't do well. i mean it was losing $40MM a quarter pre-pandemic.
Click to expand...

Either they will or they won't. The other projects that have broken ground in the Triangle haven't seemed to have issues with financing, but every project is different.
 
While I fully agree that counting this development out along with this area of Everett is foolish, this area of the city is sorely lacking the sort of infrastructural connection that areas like Assembly and Seaport had. Some sort of OL extension would really benefit any sort of renewal. A more comprehensive mix of PUDs and some serious remediation need to happen to erase the hell-hole vibe too.

Something like this with real height surely has the potential to draw in more density around it. It's a shame it's such a bland design. I really liked the idea of embracing the industrial aesthetic of the area with that proposal at the Exelon station and wish this was in that vein.

And this is anecdotal, but I went to Encore for the first time last month and was pretty floored just how crowded it was... Every table full, restaurants and hotel busy with activity. Could have fooled me we had a pandemic going on. I was a naysayer about the longevity of the casino before, but just on the face of it I can't imagine their normal business operations aren't raking in loads of money (it's still ugly and a stupidly tacky image of wealth/pleasure that I don't understand).
 
Last edited:
bigpicture7 said:
I'm with you: Boston needs Everett to be a success story (along with several other communities nearby). And we need visionaries to take crazy chances like this.

Real-estate-analyst types who don't think it's an issue if someone earning $100k can't live anywhere near the city center / employment centers are not rooting for Boston. They are just caught up in their job of caring whether certain numbers look "very attractive." That's their prerogative.

It's not yours/my concern whether this particular developer's numbers look "very attractive." If this developer needs to sell/rent at below Somerville rates to occupy this building, but the result is a systemic improvement of the greater-Boston-housing-employment-quality-of-life ecosystem, then it is a win for the majority of us. I'd be careful citing personal examples to folks with a different worldview than this, they'll come back with some argument about how your situation isn't "very attractive" in their realm. Don't listen to them. Your situation is great and I wish you much happiness in your new home.
Click to expand...

Well said. The level of pessimism on this site sometimes is insane. Everyone should be rooting for this project and this area in general. If it works - great; if it doesn't - good on someone for trying. I don't understand what predicting failure does for anyone.
 
I mean, Debbie Downer is originally from Lexington, so . . . maybe unrelenting pessimism is a core Masshole trait?
 
bigpicture7 said:
I'm with you: Boston needs Everett to be a success story (along with several other communities nearby). And we need visionaries to take crazy chances like this.

Real-estate-analyst types who don't think it's an issue if someone earning $100k can't live anywhere near the city center / employment centers are not rooting for Boston. They are just caught up in their job of caring whether certain numbers look "very attractive." That's their prerogative.

It's not yours/my concern whether this particular developer's numbers look "very attractive." If this developer needs to sell/rent at below Somerville rates to occupy this building, but the result is a systemic improvement of the greater-Boston-housing-employment-quality-of-life ecosystem, then it is a win for the majority of us. I'd be careful citing personal examples to folks with a different worldview than this, they'll come back with some argument about how your situation isn't "very attractive" in their realm. Don't listen to them. Your situation is great and I wish you much happiness in your new home.
Click to expand...

You'd have to be WALL-E to feel giddy about calling this little industrial corner home.

Additionally, Boston does not need blue collar Everett to succeed anymore than it needs white collar Brookline to succeed. These towns need Boston...
 
HarvardP said:
You'd have to be WALL-E to feel giddy about calling this little industrial corner home.

Additionally, Boston does not need blue collar Everett to succeed anymore than it needs white collar Brookline to succeed. These towns need Boston...
Click to expand...

They need each other. Yes, it certainly all centers on Boston. And, no, I am not saying we need the Everett of the past to succeed. Boston needs every creative proposal for more housing around the city that it can get. We need to look at housing as a system throughout the metro.
 
Got to start somewhere. You might have to wait for the next cycle but this is exactly the kind of place where redev should be happening.

Needs more Orange Line.
 
Everett, chelsea, this industrial area , could be an eventual host to 40+ 300ft residential buildings down the road
 
JeffDowntown said:
Not without a massive upgrade in transit access!
Click to expand...
  • New Chelsea Commuter Rail Station is due to open this year.
  • SLX Alternatives Analysis is underway; the final product will drastically improve transit access regionally to/from Everett.
  • City of Everett has implemented numerous dedicated bus lanes on key bus routes in recent years--including the first dedicated bus lane roundabout at Sweetster Circle--and has an eye on further embracing BRT-style service improvements throughout.
 
dshoost88 said:
  • New Chelsea Commuter Rail Station is due to open this year.
  • SLX Alternatives Analysis is underway; the final product will drastically improve transit access regionally to/from Everett.
  • City of Everett has implemented numerous dedicated bus lanes on key bus routes in recent years--including the first dedicated bus lane roundabout at Sweetster Circle--and has an eye on further embracing BRT-style service improvements throughout.
Click to expand...

The drastic improvement might not be from SLX... the CR station is in the first phase of Urban Rail on the "EJ Line". MassDOT's current projects (not crazy or even "reasonable" aB pitches) have this neighborhood a non-stop ride to North Station at 15-minute headways in the next decade. However, as some have pointed out, this site is a mile from the CR station. I'd feel better about the odds on this if it was on the Vale corridor dead-ending into the station.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Back
Top