Westwood Station Developments

this is my first post, i live within 1 minute from this site... before you read on, i'm 100% against it, however there is nothing i or any other nearby residents can do to prevent it. to give you an idea a different point of view of someone who lives near this:

1) "high end apartments, only for sale" marketed to "young professionals" was what was advertised when the idea first came up. this has since become "section 8 housing only for lease".

2) "high end stores", as advertised at the project's conception, apparently includes the likes of Home Depot and Target. If this is their idea of High end stores, I can't wait to see what they come up with next. The latest "high end store" they've come up with is a super-supermarket with a beer and liquor license that is going to push our local Roche Bro's out of business.

3) there has been little traffic mitigation research put into this, at least from any information that's available on the internet. So far all they are doing at the moment is expanding capacity on Rt. 128. Yes, that will solve problems alright. Just make the lanes wider. regardless, any "solution" they come up with will not work. i am more familiar with the surrounding roads and area than any Engineer that works on this project. a project of this magnitude will absolutely destroy the environment and value of surrounding neighborhoods. there are an expected 55,000 cars per day that are going to be driving through this monstrosity, and i haven't read one thing about preventing cut through traffic through surrounding local neighborhoods.

-The project is accessible from Route 1, a high traffic road, through local neighborhoods.
-The project is accessible from Rt. 138, a high traffic road, through local neighborhoods.
-Canton Street, well let's just say I'm glad I don't live on it.
-The 128/95/93 intersection at the center of this project was/is already a nightmare before the project began. To give you an idea, 3 highways intersect at the same place, right at this project site. It is already a high volume area. Adding another 55,000 cars per day is going to be an absolute nightmare. Think the Braintree split x 500.

4) Enough about traffic. Let's talk about the MBTA system. 10,000 more people added to an already crowded 128 train station. Presently, They run commuter rail trains every half hour to an hour, depending on time of day. They are crowded every day to the point where you can't sit down in the morning or afternoon. The 128 line is shared with Providence which is an extremely slow, high volume, never-on-time line. I haven't read one thing about what they plan on doing to fix this. Perhaps that's because there is no fix.

5) To gain the rest of the town's support, Cabot has decided to shove millions into parks and playing fields at the other end of the town. That's all fine and dandy. I'm sure all the parents will be thrilled when they learn Westwood High School is going to have to accept 200 more students per year from Section 8 housing.

6) Enough with the shopping "lifestyle" centers - Legacy place is opening right next door. People aren't going out to eat, people aren't buying housing, and people are shopping less. This is the wrong time to do a project like this. Besides, we all know what happens to malls every 50 years - they tank, and something new and better comes up. Anyone remember the Dedham mall? What has that sh*t hole become? Expect the same thing to happen to South Shore Plaza and places like this.

I will gladly post some pictures of the site if you guys are that interested. As of now they have torn down many of the industrial buildings that used to be on the premises, and construction is beginning. There are high fences up everywhere which obstructs the view, but there are places you can go to get a better view.

Anyways, enough with the crap. That's just my opinion. You guys are welcome to come down when the place opens. I'll be extremely surpised (and delighted) if the project turns out anything like what its being advertised as. Who wouldn't want such a great place down the street? However, thinking beyond what Cabot says causes me to be very skeptical.
 
chris86 said:
6) Enough with the shopping "lifestyle" centers - Legacy place is opening right next door. People aren't going out to eat, people aren't buying housing, and people are shopping less. This is the wrong time to do a project like this.
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Now is the perfect time for a project like this. It will be done after the current downturn, when people are willing to spend their new money.
 
The local Roche Brothers will not go out of business, because it is a successful, thriving local business that listens to customers and changes with the times. There is not a better supermarket chain in America. They have an elite brand that they do a great job with communicating and living every day.

The question is this: if a new supermarket opens, and the old one closes, then the old supermarket deserves to close because it is not as good as the new one.

You win. The better of the two supermarkets survives, and the worse one closes. Hurray for you and your town.

But you are right about one thing - every single proposal for these mixed-use concepts shows a Whole Foods and a Banana Republic, and other high-end stores and then the reality is a Shaw's and an Old Navy.
 
Chris,

Your perspective/opinion(s) as a [very] nearby resident to this project is welcome and, arguably, insightful.

I certainly do not consider Target and home depot high end either and go to great lengths to avoid such retailers myself.

Having lived in the Canton/Westwood/Dedham area for over three decades (and currently) my opinion is that even with Legacy Place going in up the highway a mile or two, there is enough of a relatively wealthy population base to support any well-run establishment that has a product people want.

Stores at Westwood Station and Legacy Place, and the South Shore Plaza and the Village Mall and Westwood Center and Dedham Square and along Route One will go out of business largely because they violate one or both of the two keys of free market . . . have a product people want and provide a sufficient level of service (as a side note, if one of these two is strong enough, it can make up for a sub par showing in the other). The consumers stand to most benefit from the increased competition. We, as consumers can buy our products from whomever we choose. If you are concerned about certain businesses going under, do not invest in them and continue to shop at the places you currently do once these new stores open.

As far as your concern of Rochie's going under because of this, I would not worry about it . . . they survived the opening of the star market and, to a lesser extent, the super stop and shop (both in Dedham, with star being about the same distance from Roche Bros as Westwood station). Furthermore, people shop Rochies not because of the prices, if you live in the area and shop there you know this. They patronize that store because the service is outstanding and the produce and meat departments are noticably superior to most other grocers.
 
The question is this: if a new supermarket opens, and the old one closes, then the old supermarket deserves to close because it is not as good as the new one.
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Ergo Wal-Mart is the best store in America.
 
statler said:
Ergo Wal-Mart is the best store in America.
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I dont see the problem in sacrificing quality for price, if it's what people want. Nobody goes into walmart thinking it's something else.

I personally hate preserving over-priced backwards local businesses over more convenient and cheaper chain options. It's a chain for a reason.

Meanwhile, many well-run local businesses manage to coexist with chains because they cater to a successful niche. In the same way that dominos and a local pizza place can exist in the same block, I see no problem with big box stores.


Actually, there is a problem, and that is the exterior architecture comes from the same strip-mall mold. That needs to be changed.
 
statler said:
Ergo Wal-Mart is the best store in America.
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Absolutely right. Wal-Mart sells everything, for a low price, conveniently located to where people live. No critic of Wal-Mart has ever argued that the store itself is a bad place to shop. Rather, they criticize the non-shopping aspects (lifestyle changes, fuel emissions, employee treatment, sprawl encouragement, etc.)

The critics are fighting a losing battle precisely because Wal-Mart is almost the perfect store, and will beat almost any store up against it.

Also, I'll take a Shaw's over a Whole Foods any day. Whole Foods' entire business plan functions on the customers assuming that food that is more expensive is automatically healthier and more environmentally friendly (I know this is simplistic, but I'm getting sick of the place).
 
While I agree that there seems to be too many of these type of projects (Westwood, Dedham, Sharon(?))popping up for all to thrive I think people will be pleasantly surprised with the grocery store planned for Westwood. Rumor is that Wegmans will be going there and people in MA will become converts to the retail/grocery experience that is Wegmans. It is the best grocery store experience in the US, they receive over 10,000 letters a year from people asking when they will come to their town. It started in upstate NY and has recently moved into MD, NJ, PA, and VA.....Westwood will be their first MA location. Whole Foods quality and selection without the markup and a cafe'/prepared foods section bigger than most supermarkets.
 
Isn't the Orange Line planning on expanding past Forest Hills to Westwood Station or Dedham? Even if the Orange Line extends to Dedham it would significantly lighten the load of the Commuter Rail from the Westwood/Dedham and maybe even the Norwood area.

http://futurembta.com/thefuturemaps/
 
Having lived near a flagship Wegmans in suburban Buffalo for two years, I can attest to their excellence. They pay a lot more attention to the look and presentation of their stores than normal, and their food selection runs the gamut--from super quantity to super quality. And as lame as it might sound, 1 AM unsober runs to Weggies just for the fun of it (and maybe to pick up some munchies) were a common occurrence back then. LOL...good times!
 
Wow, Wegman's sounds just like a Roche Brothers.

Quick funny side note about mom & pop vs. chains... a couple of guys got together to open a little pizza shop that would do things differently, offer whole wheat crusts, and all natural ingredients. And the shop did well, even in the face of the Domino's and Papa John's - and now there are 12 of these pizza shops (they're called Upper Crust) and they just opened another store on Tremont in the South End. The woman across the street from the new Upper Crust who cuts my hair actually said "the old South End is so dead, now here come the chain stores like Upper Crust"

Yes, the successful little, "mom & pop" shop succeeded, and now it's a "chain" and soon people will lament, instead of welcome, one to their neighborhoods.
 
pelhamhall said:
Wow, Wegman's sounds just like a Roche Brothers.

Quick funny side note about mom & pop vs. chains... a couple of guys got together to open a little pizza shop that would do things differently, offer whole wheat crusts, and all natural ingredients. And the shop did well, even in the face of the Domino's and Papa John's - and now there are 12 of these pizza shops (they're called Upper Crust) and they just opened another store on Tremont in the South End. The woman across the street from the new Upper Crust who cuts my hair actually said "the old South End is so dead, now here come the chain stores like Upper Crust"

Yes, the successful little, "mom & pop" shop succeeded, and now it's a "chain" and soon people will lament, instead of welcome, one to their neighborhoods.
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Thats an excellent example. At one point Mcdonalds was a mom and pop store, and now its the evil emptire.

At what point does one go from local store to chain? 10 stores? 15? 3?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mcus29 View Post
Isn't the Orange Line planning on expanding past Forest Hills to Westwood Station or Dedham? Even if the Orange Line extends to Dedham it would significantly lighten the load of the Commuter Rail from the Westwood/Dedham and maybe even the Norwood area.

http://futurembta.com/thefuturemaps/

LOL
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Seems like that response is a no to answering my question. Was it a stupid question? I obviously found the link in your signature. Or is that what was funny about it?
 
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jass said:
Thats an excellent example. At one point Mcdonalds was a mom and pop store, and now its the evil emptire.

At what point does one go from local store to chain? 10 stores? 15? 3?
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I think what people like about "mom and pop" stores is the uniqueness, individuality and perhaps the increase likelyhood of interacting with an owner/operator of the business who becomes part of the community. If a store, restaurant or bar is replicated, there is a level standardization that often occurs There is an increased likelyhood a disinterested manager or other employees will be running the business etc. The business then feels anynomous and disconnected from the neighborhood.

A business can have two or more locations and still feel unique and contribute to the fabric of the community. For example, JJ Foley is a bar with two locations one on the edge of the S. End and another on the edge of downtown crossing. When you go to either bar, its the same bartenders who are running each respective location, they know regular customers as well as nearby business owners and residents. To me if feels like two separate, unique and very local taverns that just happen to have the same name hanging on a sign out front.
 
mcus29 said:
Seems like that response is a no to answering my question. Was it a stupid question? I obviously found the link in your signature. Or is that what was funny about it?
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Mcus29,
I think vanshnookenraggen got a kick out of your internet research indicating potential mbta expansion because he created those maps himself as kind of a dream scenario of mbta expansion.
 
commuter guy said:
Mcus29,
I think vanshnookenraggen got a kick out of your internet research indicating potential mbta expansion because he created those maps himself as kind of a dream scenario of mbta expansion.
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Basically. Yeah, sorry to sound like a dick but it was too perfect.
 
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