Boston Landing | New Balance Complex | Brighton

Re: New Brighton Landing | New Balance Complex | Brighton

JumboBuc said:
Robert Campbell loves it: New Balance gets an outstanding new building
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I know Jim Davis has pushed the idea of urbanism here, and the city has the Brighton/Guest Street Planning Study ( http://www.bostonredevelopmentauthority.org/getattachment/dc935a9c-f754-492c-a07b-baa22f912037 ), but there is a long way to go. Boston Volvo's massive lot is not urbanism. The sea of parking for Stop & Shop and neighbors is not urbanism. Boston Volvo can theoretically be bought out and move, but Stop and Shop is a big problem. How will that shopping center be integrated into an urban neighborhood?
 
Re: New Brighton Landing | New Balance Complex | Brighton

dwash59 said:
I know Jim Davis has pushed the idea of urbanism here, and the city has the Brighton/Guest Street Planning Study ( http://www.bostonredevelopmentauthority.org/getattachment/dc935a9c-f754-492c-a07b-baa22f912037 ), but there is a long way to go. Boston Volvo's massive lot is not urbanism. The sea of parking for Stop & Shop and neighbors is not urbanism. Boston Volvo can theoretically be bought out and move, but Stop and Shop is a big problem. How will that shopping center be integrated into an urban neighborhood?
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Dwash -- The real urbanism is not some abstract ideal promoted in architecture and city planning seminars -- its a real environment filled with the occasional Great Buildings a whole lot of ok buildings that are comfortable for the residents and utilitarian and also the occasional Stop and Shop parking lot or gas station

The other thing about real urbanism is that you can't just lay it down on a virgin or brown field and say the magic words -- it evolves over time as the people who are invested in its success make changes and investments

If Davis is successful in 50 years we will see the New Boston Landing or whatever it gets called colloquially become a place where people want to live, work, buy and play and invest

PS: occasionally that super market parking lot is a valuable commodity for some community event or to temporarily store a big pile of snow

PPS -- believe it or not the Pru which seems so much a fixture in Boston began as a big bunch of railroad tracks some 60 years ago -- and it is still evolving
 
Re: New Brighton Landing | New Balance Complex | Brighton

A Stop and Shop with a parking lot is not urban a Stop and Shop or other market in a building that includes other uses and doesn't have a parking lot and has either no parking or limited underground (even underground parking isn't ideal although it is sometimes needed in transitioning areas) parking is urban. Storing a big pile of snow= bad use of urban space there are other places that would be better like a parking lot not in the urban core. As far as a community event why not hold it in a park I'm pretty sure there are several in the area that sounds nicer to me personally.

Railroad tracks are a different situation but nice try. Plus a rail yard can sometimes be built over or moved to less valuable real estate.
 
Re: New Brighton Landing | New Balance Complex | Brighton

citylover94 said:
A Stop and Shop with a parking lot is not urban a Stop and Shop or other market in a building that includes other uses and doesn't have a parking lot and has either no parking or limited underground (even underground parking isn't ideal although it is sometimes needed in transitioning areas) parking is urban. Storing a big pile of snow= bad use of urban space there are other places that would be better like a parking lot not in the urban core. As far as a community event why not hold it in a park I'm pretty sure there are several in the area that sounds nicer to me personally.

Railroad tracks are a different situation but nice try. Plus a rail yard can sometimes be built over or moved to less valuable real estate.
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City -- get you nose out of a book and take a look around you

Cambridge is by all manner a classic urban setting yet it has a number of features which the "Urbanistic Model" doesn't permit:
  • single family houses with driveways -- some of which command Macro prices
  • stores with parking lots behind them including in the midst of Central Square
  • parking lots on major thoroughfares
  • single story retail

either you don't understand what a real city is or your experience is limited to a few dozens of blocks in Manhattan

Urban like many other terms is truly in the eye of the beholder -- what passes for mega density in the US is merely typical in a number of the Asian megacities

PS: I didn't say to build a new stop and shop with a mammoth parking lot -- just that having one already in a developing neighborhood didn't make that neighborhood anti-urban. There is a reason that the big parking lots appeared -- other non or less functional buildings were replaced by something which the neighborhood needed more -- as driven not by some central planners but by the economics of the time
 
Re: New Brighton Landing | New Balance Complex | Brighton

dwash59 said:
I know Jim Davis has pushed the idea of urbanism here, and the city has the Brighton/Guest Street Planning Study ( http://www.bostonredevelopmentauthority.org/getattachment/dc935a9c-f754-492c-a07b-baa22f912037 ), but there is a long way to go. Boston Volvo's massive lot is not urbanism. The sea of parking for Stop & Shop and neighbors is not urbanism. Boston Volvo can theoretically be bought out and move, but Stop and Shop is a big problem. How will that shopping center be integrated into an urban neighborhood?
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To address his original question, I present this corner in Portland (down the street from me when I lived there). It has both an urban Volvo dealership and an urban supermarket. The parking is on the roof of the supermarket.

https://www.google.com/maps/place/P...0x54950b0b7da97427:0x1c36b9e6f6d18591!6m1!1e1
 
Re: New Brighton Landing | New Balance Complex | Brighton

whighlander said:
City -- get you nose out of a book and take a look around you

Cambridge is by all manner a classic urban setting yet it has a number of features which the "Urbanistic Model" doesn't permit:
  • single family houses with driveways -- some of which command Macro prices
  • stores with parking lots behind them including in the midst of Central Square
  • parking lots on major thoroughfares
  • single story retail

either you don't understand what a real city is or your experience is limited to a few dozens of blocks in Manhattan

Urban like many other terms is truly in the eye of the beholder -- what passes for mega density in the US is merely typical in a number of the Asian megacities

PS: I didn't say to build a new stop and shop with a mammoth parking lot -- just that having one already in a developing neighborhood didn't make that neighborhood anti-urban. There is a reason that the big parking lots appeared -- other non or less functional buildings were replaced by something which the neighborhood needed more -- as driven not by some central planners but by the economics of the time
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But none of the things you mentioned actually make Cambridge more urban or reinforce the urban fabric in fact they undermine it. I am not saying it isn't urban it definitely is but one story retail is not very urban and neither are parking lots or the other things you mentioned (although having scattered single family homes in a mostly multi family area can work well). Having them doesn't mean a place definitely isn't urban or can't be but they do tend to have a negative effect on urbanism.

I don't just base what I say off of what I have read much of it is from personal experience and observation. Parking lots are not the best use of the space most of the reason they exist now is due to disinvestment that at the time might have made sense but definitely doesn't anymore. Either way if parking is needed it would be better to have it in a garage that is underground to best support urban development forms. It just isn't urban to have a parking lot nor are parking lots nice to spend time in or near as a pedestrian. If you have enough parking and 1 story retail you get a strip mall so the presence or absence of that does absolutely effect how urban a place is.

How things are arranged does also have a impact as you mentioned most parking in Cambridge is behind the buildings not right in front of the building so I do realize that has a huge impact on how urban a place is/feels.
 
Re: New Brighton Landing | New Balance Complex | Brighton

whighlander said:
City -- get you nose out of a book and take a look around you

Cambridge is by all manner a classic urban setting yet it has a number of features which the "Urbanistic Model" doesn't permit:
  • single family houses with driveways -- some of which command Macro prices
  • stores with parking lots behind them including in the midst of Central Square
  • parking lots on major thoroughfares
  • single story retail

either you don't understand what a real city is or your experience is limited to a few dozens of blocks in Manhattan

Urban like many other terms is truly in the eye of the beholder -- what passes for mega density in the US is merely typical in a number of the Asian megacities

PS: I didn't say to build a new stop and shop with a mammoth parking lot -- just that having one already in a developing neighborhood didn't make that neighborhood anti-urban. There is a reason that the big parking lots appeared -- other non or less functional buildings were replaced by something which the neighborhood needed more -- as driven not by some central planners but by the economics of the time
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Here are google street view of a pedestrian getting to New Balance's new headquarters currently:

From the east (or the north as you would come over the Everett Street Bridge to get to the other side of the turnpike):

https://www.google.com/maps/@42.355...4!1spZ7ec8eRPpcMGsd0AuEd0Q!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

From the south:

https://www.google.com/maps/@42.355...4!1siNtI-VBODKF7HYFk9LQGYg!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

Keep talking vapid bullshit about how Central Square's parking lots are at all like these.

Both the city and New Balance have said they want to connect the street grid from Guest Street to connect to Braintree Street. An alternative is to go through Warrior Sports to Everett. To get either of those places, you have to get cooperation from either Stop & Shop or Boston Volvo.

See the discussion of the Guest Street Extension in the original PDA:

http://www.bostonredevelopmentauthority.org/getattachment/942531ca-ee79-4d4a-bb41-4ae953a37041

New Balance has stated on multiple occasions that efforts to negotiate with these two parties have not gone well. Contrast to nearby property owners that have allowed NB to include them in amendments to the PDA as they plan to sell to NB:

http://www.bostonredevelopmentauthority.org/getattachment/bb9ef072-ff64-444e-a6f0-3bd628913304

NB and the city have a vision for an urban environment that connects their headquarters to the residential neighborhoods to the East and South. (North and West, this development is hedged in by the Mass Pike, which makes creating an urban environment difficult. Contrast to claims that this is like Prudential, when it is not at all as Prudential buried everything. Nothing about the current buildings are compatible with decking the Pike in this neighborhood.)

Getting cooperation from at least one of these two properties seems necessary to integrate the headquarters fully into the community. Maybe time is the only answer, but New Balance wants a campus with urban connections now. The current connections look a lot like walking through the suburbs to get to an office park.
 
Re: New Brighton Landing | New Balance Complex | Brighton

dwash59 said:
Getting cooperation from at least one of these two properties seems necessary to integrate the headquarters fully into the community. Maybe time is the only answer, but New Balance wants a campus with urban connections now. The current connections look a lot like walking through the suburbs to get to an office park.
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Not really. All that's needed is for the property owner to develop an urban-style supermarket there. Look at the Star in Packard's Corner or Chestnut Hill, Wegman's in Newton, Whole Foods in Cambridgeport, etc.

What's so incongruous about that Stop and Shop is how blantantly suburban in appearance and massing it is. That's a fixable problem for any owner that wants a bigger, nicer, higher-rent property with parking either on the roof or under the building and an opportunity for additional marketable square footage. Lots of them seem to be doing it themselves lately.
 
Re: New Brighton Landing | New Balance Complex | Brighton

today
 
Re: New Brighton Landing | New Balance Complex | Brighton

On a recent drive by on the Pike (last Thursday I believe), I noticed some activity in and around the rail tracks but I couldn't tell what was going on. Looked like something other than routine track maintenance but hard to tell at 55 mph (ok, 70 mph). Can anyone confirm if work on the station has finally begun?
 
Re: New Brighton Landing | New Balance Complex | Brighton

Reports from railroad.net indicate that track relocation for the platform has begun.
 
Re: New Brighton Landing | New Balance Complex | Brighton

dwash59 said:
Here are google street view of a pedestrian getting to New Balance's new headquarters currently:


Keep talking ....about how Central Square's parking lots are at all like these.


...Getting cooperation from at least one of these two properties seems necessary to integrate the headquarters fully into the community. Maybe time is the only answer, but New Balance wants a campus with urban connections now. The current connections look a lot like walking through the suburbs to get to an office park.
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dwash -- have you ever seen a movie or watched video -- its all an illusion of motion composed of a sequence of images -- each a near instantaneous "snapshot" of the scene as the scene evolves

Cities are like movies -- if you come back to the same spot once a year for some and once a week for others you will typically see significant change [unless the area is a museum]

Thus someone standing in the parking lot @ the SW corner of Seaport Blvd and Wharf Road looking toward the harbor:
  • 30 years ago [circa 1985] would only see the Commonwealth Pier
  • 25 years ago [circa 1990] World Trade Center rebuild of Commonwealth Pier
  • 20 years ago [circa 1995] Courthouse under construction
  • 15 years ago [circa 2000] Courthouse and Seaport Hotel opened WTE opens
  • 10 years ago [circa 2005] ICA under construction WTE and WTW open, Park Lane Residences I, WT Silver Line T opens
  • 5 years ago [circa 2010] ICA open Park Lane II Residences, One Marina Park Dr., and Renaissance Hotel open
  • 2 years ago [circa 2013] 11 Fan Pier Blvd., 50 Northern Ave.
  • last year [circa 2014] District Hall
  • today [circa summer 2015] major construction site

When do you want to stop the film and check on the urbanity of the site?

The relevant point is that its all about evolution -- to be more urban you build on a vacant lot which later becomes the site of a parking lot or strip mall and which later becomes a high rise -- to be less urban you be Detroit and you tear the buildings down and plant grass
 
Re: New Brighton Landing | New Balance Complex | Brighton

[IMG]http://www.appfans.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/lovethisep.jpg[/IMG] said:
dwash -- have you ever seen a movie or watched video -- its all an illusion of motion composed of a sequence of images -- each a near instantaneous "snapshot" of the scene as the scene evolves

Cities are like movies -- if you come back to the same spot once a year for some and once a week for others you will typically see significant change [unless the area is a museum]

Thus someone standing in the parking lot @ the SW corner of Seaport Blvd and Wharf Road looking toward the harbor:
  • 30 years ago [circa 1985] would only see the Commonwealth Pier
  • 25 years ago [circa 1990] World Trade Center rebuild of Commonwealth Pier
  • 20 years ago [circa 1995] Courthouse under construction
  • 15 years ago [circa 2000] Courthouse and Seaport Hotel opened WTE opens
  • 10 years ago [circa 2005] ICA under construction WTE and WTW open, Park Lane Residences I, WT Silver Line T opens
  • 5 years ago [circa 2010] ICA open Park Lane II Residences, One Marina Park Dr., and Renaissance Hotel open
  • 2 years ago [circa 2013] 11 Fan Pier Blvd., 50 Northern Ave.
  • last year [circa 2014] District Hall
  • today [circa summer 2015] major construction site

When do you want to stop the film and check on the urbanity of the site?

The relevant point is that its all about evolution -- to be more urban you build on a vacant lot which later becomes the site of a parking lot or strip mall and which later becomes a high rise -- to be less urban you be Detroit and you tear the buildings down and plant grass
Click to expand...

You seem to be hopelessly confused on your theories of evolution vs. stages in the average life cycle of an insect. That's called "moulting". Moulting is execution of a pre-programmed growth strategy. Real estate owners don't just sit absent-mindedly on their property in complete awe and befuddlement that natural selection and pure chance chose to evolve it into a slime mould instead of a super-intelligent race of flying half-unicorn/half-velociraptor with night vision. They are generally out to make a profit and/or recoup a loss, which requires some sort of business plan and attempt at execution therein.


Which reminds me...when exactly was the "strip mall" interregnum for Kendall Sq.? That moult where it had the Marty's Liquors superstore next to the Job Lot next to the used Chevy/Geo emporium on the Broadway Automile must've passed in (*snap*) the blink of an eye.
 
Re: New Brighton Landing | New Balance Complex | Brighton

Are they removing two sets of tracks and then widening the space between the two tracks on the left for the platform to go in the middle?
 
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