đź”· Open Thread

Justin7 said:
I had no idea he was capable of that. Blew me away.
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Deval is capable of doing a lot of things on the national stage, which is where he actually wants to be, that you would not see him waste his energy on for the local press in Boston.

Also, FWIW, Romney didn't legalize gay marriage in MA, the courts did. Either way, sort of sly for Deval to imply that it was only possible after Romney left office.

Warren tonight. Wonder if a good speech will give her a boost vis-a-vis Brown, who tried to distance himself from the RNC.
 
The swing vote on the court was Justice Cowin, a Republican appointee.
 
I don't think CNN broadcasted Menino's speech. Did anyone see it??
 
I am on the fence in brown-warren. A moderate republican is a good thing to support, i think, even if there are more policy differences with him than i have with her.

Clinton, however, totally dismantled Romney. Every attack Romney has attempted, every incomplete policy proposal, Clinton went line by line and called him out. As a political junkie, it was impressive the way he could talk detailed policy in a way that still captivates people. For the non-political people that are largely paying little attention so far other than what is picked up from osmosis, they came out impressed and behind Obama. I don't think Romney has the likeability, political skill, and most importantly substantive policy to win many back. I think if these are the arguments still outlined when debates come around, Romney will get quickly exposed. Herman Cain and Santorum were not worthy sparing partners. Should be entertaining.
 
Have all elections been equally horrendous, or are they getting worse?

The Dem nominee should be Jill Stein and the Rep nominee should be Ron Paul. Now there's a race I'd like to see. Two people with legitimate concern for the public and without Goldman Sachs' dollars in their pocket.
 
BostonUrbEx said:
Have all elections been equally horrendous, or are they getting worse?
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No, they've been getting worse.

There's always been rhetoric, but the ease at which you can get your FUD on in the Internet Age is taking everything to a whole new level.

Think about it. What has the blogosphere and the 24-hour news cycle and social media and search engine optimization really given us? We're not getting a broader spectrum of opinions, we're not getting a wider range of coverage, we're not getting anything of any intellectual value.

A million different people are spinning a million different stories every which way but loose, and the modern American - no, the modern human being - never has to be confronted with or challenged by a spin they don't agree with.

We've been given all the tools to establish ourselves nice little echo chamber isolation boxes from the world, kept safe from the threat of actually having to evaluate our opinions by the never-fading cacophony of whatever sound bytes match our set-in opinions most.

And you know what? Pandora's box is already broken wide open. Things are only going to get worse from here.

I realized that I myself was guilty of this, and that's why I'm never going near politics again for the rest of my life.
 
^ You are a student. I don't understand how you could ever consider not engaging in politics. Your future and your kids' future are at stake. One guy will let your loan rates skyrocket, end Pell Grants, and kick you off your parents' healthcare and the other will support you in school, regulate interest rates, and ensure that you are insured until you're 26 (if need be).

For me, my upcoming marriage is at stake of being nullified and rights stripped with one guy and the other will stand up for our civil rights.

For my mother, it means more painful education cuts, which means even more supplies being bought for her classroom with the money from her own pocket, while we blindly increase defense spending beyond the requested levels. The other guy wants to invest in education and our nation's youth.

We all have some stake in this and we all have something to lose by electing a republican. You have to find what is meaningful to you and take a stand for it.

Edit: You are also a transit advocate. One guy wants to cut infrastructure spending dramatically and the other believes in investing in the nation's infrastructure.
 
datadyne007 said:
^ You are a student. I don't understand how you could ever consider not engaging in politics. Your future and your kids' future are at stake. One guy will let your loan rates skyrocket, end Pell Grants, and kick you off your parents' healthcare and the other will support you in school, regulate interest rates, and ensure that you are insured until you're 26 (if need be).

For me, my upcoming marriage is at stake of being nullified and rights stripped with one guy and the other will stand up for our civil rights.

For my mother, it means more painful education cuts, which means even more supplies being bought for her classroom with the money from her own pocket, while we blindly increase defense spending beyond the requested levels. The other guy wants to invest in education and our nation's youth.

We all have some stake in this and we all have something to lose by electing a republican. You have to find what is meaningful to you and take a stand for it.

Edit: You are also a transit advocate. One guy wants to cut infrastructure spending dramatically and the other believes in investing in the nation's infrastructure.
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We all have some stake in this, that's true. And yes, perhaps we all have something to lose by electing a republican.

We also all have something to lose if we elect a democrat. Something to lose if we elect a libertarian. A conservative, a liberal, a tea partier, an occupier. No matter who we elect, no matter how sweeping the changes are in the wake of this election, we will all have walked away from it having lost something. It might be something life-altering, or it might be something minor. You might make the 'Lesser Evil' argument - but nobody agrees with 100% of someone else's opinions.

I don't believe the world can be so clearly split along these dichotomies. Left and right, black and white, R and D, liberals and conservatives. It's always either us or them, this or that, never any compromise, never any progress. The only thing that we can be certain of, our only constant, is that the rhetoric gets louder, the poles drift farther apart, and people spend more time screaming at each other despite all of us knowing that deep down, we can't change that guy's mind, just as he can't change ours.

I'm rambling now. Let me try and bring things back to the original response I wanted to make - the system is broken. Politics are broken, and they've broken me. I don't profess to be all that smart or all that informed or all that persuasive. I didn't start writing this post to engage in a debate. I started writing this post because to me, walking away from politics is just the same as walking away from any other machine that's broken beyond the point of repair.

At the end of the day, all I can do is speak my mind. I don't have the power to enact the change that's needed, and every day that goes by, I become more and more convinced that nobody has that power, because the days where politics and government and businesses worked as they were supposed to are over, and they're never coming back. We're never going to have another JFK or Harry Truman or Theodore Roosevelt, because the truth that nobody wants to admit is that none of those Presidents would have survived the primary had they been running for office in 2012.

And that's why I've given up.

God, this is a depressing way to end my day before going to bed.
 
datadyne007 said:
^ You are a student. I don't understand how you could ever consider not engaging in politics. Your future and your kids' future are at stake. One guy will let your loan rates skyrocket, end Pell Grants, and kick you off your parents' healthcare and the other will support you in school, regulate interest rates, and ensure that you are insured until you're 26 (if need be).

For me, my upcoming marriage is at stake of being nullified and rights stripped with one guy and the other will stand up for our civil rights.

For my mother, it means more painful education cuts, which means even more supplies being bought for her classroom with the money from her own pocket, while we blindly increase defense spending beyond the requested levels. The other guy wants to invest in education and our nation's youth.

We all have some stake in this and we all have something to lose by electing a republican. You have to find what is meaningful to you and take a stand for it.

Edit: You are also a transit advocate. One guy wants to cut infrastructure spending dramatically and the other believes in investing in the nation's infrastructure.
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That's awesome that everything is so crystal clear for you. Me, I'm going to cast my vote for whichever d-bag pisses me off less over the course of the next two months.

giant-douche-and-turd-sandwich.jpg


Edit: in 2004 ^ Kerry was clearly the giant douche (versus W's turd sandwich) while this time around I'd say Romney gets that title. So good job Massachusetts on providing the national electorate with yet another douche that'll probably lose it for their party because they're so damn unlikeable. We're proving to have quite the knack for producing these types.
 
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You people lack so much historical perspective. Do you know how vicious the attack ads were in the late 18th century? This election looks like a love-in compared to the mud Jefferson and Adams slung at one another. To be cynical out of a misplaced nostalgia for a time before you were born is shooting yourself in the foot when there are actually substantive policy choices at stake.

Look, it's a phase. People of a certain age especially (but not exclusively - it afflicts people of all ages) like to be all suavely above it all. It can be easy if your life situation doesn't put you in the crosshairs of political choices, particularly when you're in college and debt obligations haven't come due, health costs are not something you have to worry about yet, the economy is an abstraction and you don't earn enough to pay taxes. This is why so many college students were attracted to Obama's equally bullshit "there are no red states or blue states but the United States" reconciliatory message that got him nowhere in dealing with Congressional Republicans in office. This is why so many are tuned out now that he has embraced the fighting stance needed to get shit done.

Oh well, I guess my vote will count for more with all you people too good for the voting booth staying home. You'd better hope I make the right choice.

BTW, Scott Brown is very effective at talking the talk of moderation in order to win in MA (just as Romney did), but it's a bad reason to vote for him. His voting record is far more indicative of what you're getting, and I would make sure to review that carefully if you haven't already.

Also, Jill Stein is actually the Green Party nominee for president this year, just in case anyone was seriously interested in voting for her.
 
^ Fantastic post, czsz.

czsz said:
Oh well, I guess my vote will count for more with all you people too good for the voting booth staying home. You'd better hope I make the right choice.
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This was my favorite line.
 
Commuting Boston Student said:
I realized that I myself was guilty of this, and that's why I'm never going near politics again for the rest of my life.
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The one sure-fire way to make politics more out of line from reality is to not vote. I am like most Mass-folks, slightly left of center- pushed there more on social issues. If the people in and around the middle don't vote, then politicians are just competing on who can develop a larger amount of crazies on each extreme.

It is wrong to think of voting as an implicit acknowledgement of you agreeing with someone on everything. That's not realistic for anyone, let alone a national politician who will be confronting literally hundreds of issues. It's who do you align with more, and trust to make decision on your behalf.

If you make a relatively informed opinion on issues that matter to you and vote for one or the other, that means politicians will compete over your vote. That's why everything is so tilted to protecting senior benefits, they vote! If every 18-25 year old voted, it would be the other way around. The quickest way to undermine democracy and the importance of voting is to not do it. Why this country has voting on a workday is stupid! I would even be for providing greater incentives to vote. The more the people in the middle that don't really care vote, the better and saner our political process will be.

The paradox is that the political process has become so toxic it turns people away, but the only way to fix it is to bring people back in.
[/rant/sorry]
 
choo said:
The one sure-fire way to make politics more out of line from reality is to not vote. I am like most Mass-folks, slightly left of center- pushed there more on social issues. If the people in and around the middle don't vote, then politicians are just competing on who can develop a larger amount of crazies on each extreme.

It is wrong to think of voting as an implicit acknowledgement of you agreeing with someone on everything. That's not realistic for anyone, let alone a national politician who will be confronting literally hundreds of issues. It's who do you align with more, and trust to make decision on your behalf.

If you make a relatively informed opinion on issues that matter to you and vote for one or the other, that means politicians will compete over your vote. That's why everything is so tilted to protecting senior benefits, they vote! If every 18-25 year old voted, it would be the other way around. The quickest way to undermine democracy and the importance of voting is to not do it. Why this country has voting on a workday is stupid! I would even be for providing greater incentives to vote. The more the people in the middle that don't really care vote, the better and saner our political process will be.

The paradox is that the political process has become so toxic it turns people away, but the only way to fix it is to bring people back in.
[/rant/sorry]
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Well said.
 
Damn, another fantastic post.

To quote Obama last night: YOU are the change.
 
Well, the vote or die brigade certainly showed up today...
 
^ It is kind of important.

The US is going to move in one of two very distinct directions over the next four years. You have a chance to help decide which one.* Why would you not take a few minutes out of your day to do that?

Yeah, ok, in all likely-hood Romney isn't going to win MA, so that vote may not amount to much, but the senatorial race could decide control of the senate.
 
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