Avalon Exeter | 77 Exeter Street | Back Bay

Re: New Tower(s) Planned For Prudential Center

While I agree the T is far from perfect, compared to a lot of other cities' subway/metro transit systems, it's one of the better ones.

The main reason the T is used by so many people is that parking in the city is at a premium. It's a lot easier to go some where on the T knowing that you don't have to worry about finding a parking space, and/or paying $25+ to park in a garage.
 
Re: New Tower(s) Planned For Prudential Center

I don't know if Ned is arguing that urban growth can necessarily be free of environmental impacts - but rather that if there is a specific, identifiable impact that is more significant than would be expected of a similar project located somewhere else, why not either a) question the reasonableness of a project in this location, b) mitigate the impact.
......
Ned argues that the existing air on Dartmouth St., Clarendon St. Berkeley St., etc., the whole area of the Back Bay near the Pike and the railroad tracks, is toxic.

He further argues that developers of new buildings in this area build at their peril, for as residents or tenants of these new buildings become aware of the toxic air, lawsuits will follow.

Similar assertion applies for the proposed development(s) near Kenmore Square.

And if one extrapolates this concern, season ticket holders at Fenway Park attend games at a serious risk to their health. Maybe Mr. Henry can start a gas mask concession to increase team revenue.
 
Re: New Tower(s) Planned For Prudential Center

reductio ad absurdum noted.
I would like Ned to answer my question though.
 
Re: New Tower(s) Planned For Prudential Center

. . . if there is a specific, identifiable impact that is more significant than would be expected of a similar project located somewhere else, why not either a) question the reasonableness of a project in this location, b) mitigate the impact?

Agreed._ Occupants of buildings directly over the railway/roadway transportation corridor do suffer health impacts that occupants elsewhere do not suffer._ For this reason, I have long argued that the public health risks should be quantified, and that either the harm should be mitigated or else the proposed buildings should be relocated._ Last November, the Massachusetts Secretary of Environment ordered the owners of the proposed Fenway Center air rights to quantify the risks and mitigate the harm at that site._ At the Prudential site, less progress has been made in this regard, because the Secretary urged ? but didn?t require ? the owners to work with the public and resolve the health risks.

. . . would these units and shops look better in Hopkinton, where they would remove land better suited for other uses?
No one has determined whether the Prudential Center complex is best located in Boston, Hopkinton, or elsewhere, because doing that requires consideration of every factor, including the public health risks._ But so far, the city refuses to recognize such risks anywhere, and the state urges ? but does not require ? mitigation of the risks at Prudential.

. . . Do you think, in a city with an acute land shortage, that the amount of development afforded by turn pike air rights could simply go to another urban location where it would have fewer environmental impacts, but the same environmental benefits?
No, it couldn?t._ The 44 acres theoretically available at air rights sites could not simply go to other urban locations, because there aren?t that many undeveloped acres left in Boston._ But the mere fact that there?s no more vacant land left doesn?t justify building at the toxic sites without mitigation.

. . . And do you/would you aid the city in locating a suitable area for that development in the planning process as a constructive compliment to demonstrating the harm of it over the turnpike?

First of all, ?over the turnpike? is an inadequate description of these sites, because the interstate railway/roadway transportation corridor contains up to 7 rail lanes in addition to the 10 turnpike lanes.

Secondly, aiding the city in locating alternate sites is unnecessary._ No such aid is needed, because the city and its developers already maintain an inventory of all available sites._ The city and its developers know that there are public health risks over the corridor, but they will continue building there until external forces cause them to either relocate, or else build with mitigation.
 
Re: New Tower(s) Planned For Prudential Center

Thanks Ned -
In regards to the city having an inventory of developable sites, yes, nearly every major city does. Would you aid the city a planning process where you helped identify the appropriate density for such sites in an advance planning workshop or similar?
In regards to the Hopkinton statement, please do not ignore the wider theoretical argument that anecdote is meant to convey - of course nobody knows exactly where or how a hypothetical number of units will be 'relocated' as you say should they not be placed here or there - please consider decades of empirical evidence with which you are surely familiar.
Thank you.
 
Re: New Tower(s) Planned For Prudential Center

There's a front page story in todays Boston Courant stateing that the apt tower will start construction possibly by years end.My scanner is broken ,so if someone wants to scan and post that would be appreciated!
 
Re: New Tower(s) Planned For Prudential Center

Is this on Boylston Street in front of the food court, or somewhere else?
 
Re: New Tower(s) Planned For Prudential Center

thats 888 Boylston st this is the Avalonbay tower
 
Re: New Tower(s) Planned For Prudential Center

From the RealEstateNow section of the Globe:

New rental tower planned for Pru
Posted by Scott Van Voorhis July 23, 2010 11:00 AM

Here?s another sign that rental living is making a comeback in downtown Boston.

Condo developers did most of the building over the past few years, putting up the Mandarin Oriental with its $12 million penthouses and the now bankrupt W Hotel and condo tower.

Now builders of deluxe apartment towers are taking center stage downtown.

AvalonBay Communities is reviving plans, shelved during the downturn, to build a new 28-story apartment tower at the Prudential Center campus, the Boston Courant reports. (In the interest of disclosure, I wrote the story.)

The new, 311-foot high-rise will take shape on Exeter Street, right by Lord & Taylor.

One of the largest developers and owners of rental housing in the country, AvalonBay plans to begin construction either late this year or early next.

But the neighbors are not all that happy, with some already complaining about blocked views and a tower that would be one of the tallest on the Back Bay skyline.

At the least, it's a sign the rental market is clearly on the mend.

I don't understand where this is going. Is it on top of L&T? Or directly south of it on the existing plaza, facing Exeter mid-block? If the latter, I can't seem to visualize how a tower would fit on that footprint.

Map: http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&sou...851,-71.079928&spn=0.001998,0.004812&t=k&z=18
 
Re: New Tower(s) Planned For Prudential Center

311' would block views and be one of the tallest on the skyline?
 
Re: New Tower(s) Planned For Prudential Center

From the RealEstateNow section of the Globe:



I don't understand where this is going. Is it on top of L&T? Or directly south of it on the existing plaza, facing Exeter mid-block? If the latter, I can't seem to visualize how a tower would fit on that footprint.

Map: http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&sou...851,-71.079928&spn=0.001998,0.004812&t=k&z=18

If it's got an Exeter address, it's behind the Lenox Hotel, across the street from the side of the newer half of the BPL.
 
Re: New Tower(s) Planned For Prudential Center

If it's got an Exeter address, it's behind the Lenox Hotel, across the street from the side of the newer half of the BPL.

Correction -- probably not directly across from the BPL, but in the general vicinity.
 
Re: New Tower(s) Planned For Prudential Center

Thanks!

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This could be a rather fugly tower depending on the materials, but at least it's different from the other Avalon towers in that it faces the street and isn't red brick. I like the covered staircase in the last picture.
 
Re: New Tower(s) Planned For Prudential Center

I dig the covered staircase, too. The building as a whole is decent enough, seems to fit well with the area, and a helluva lot better than what's there now.
 
Re: New Tower(s) Planned For Prudential Center

You're right about the materials. This looks like buff-colored terra cotta, precast, Alucobond and glass.

I like the vaguely-deco setbacks. The proportions look okay. 45 Province's little brother.
 
Re: New Tower(s) Planned For Prudential Center

Since nimbys have their knee-jerk reactions I irrevitably have mine. How can that argument (be one of the tallest in the skyline) even be logical? Even by New England sense of scale (which is small) simply looking a hundred feet to the right and left one would have to say, "no there are plenty of buildings in this downtown neighborhood that are taller" I honestly hope not one story sucumbs to idiocracy and furthermore I have no idea how we ever "snuck" the Pru and Hancock in there in the first place. Was Boston really that much more progressive 40 years ago? I once again stress comunity imput for the most part sucks. And just about every great neighborhood was created before we gave local idiots a say.
 
Re: New Tower(s) Planned For Prudential Center

Was Boston really that much more progressive 40 years ago?

Nope, they were just that much more desperate. Remember, they were still in 'dying city' mode back then.
 
Re: New Tower(s) Planned For Prudential Center

Was Boston really that much more progressive 40 years ago?

I don't know about progessive, but desperate, sure. Boston was in an economic downturn, and Hynes wanted the Pru there pretty badly.
 
Re: New Tower(s) Planned For Prudential Center

You're right about the materials. This looks like buff-colored terra cotta, precast, Alucobond and glass.

The design isn't that bad (isn't that great wither) but you just know they will go cheap on the materials and this will look like crap.
 

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