Commuter Rail to New Hampshire?

Stlin said:
So a quick question - I know there's an active proposal/ project to turn the "Hampton Branch" into the NH Seacoast Greenway, from Portsmouth to the MA border. Is the railroad charter still active?
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Yes, it's properly and legally landbanked. I'm not sure, though, if NHDOT has closed the sale on it with CSX for the Hampton-Portsmouth stretch (NHDOT has long owned State Line-Hampton). They supposedly agreed upon a price back when it was still Pan Am-owned, but I don't know if the Legislature has actually voted in the purchase funds yet.

It wouldn't be a contiguous trail, though, because of the nuke plant. There'd be at least a 1.5 mile gap, maybe more.
 
Something I've just been think about since the Capitol Corridor project is one of the issues that seems to be coming up a good amount in the upcoming elections, how far should it go. An extension of the Lowell Line probably makes sense, but how far is too far? Nashua? Manchester? Concord?
 
TheRatmeister said:
Something I've just been think about since the Capitol Corridor project is one of the issues that seems to be coming up a good amount in the upcoming elections, how far should it go. An extension of the Lowell Line probably makes sense, but how far is too far? Nashua? Manchester? Concord?
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Transit Matters put out a report last year, Modernizing the Lowell Line, which included looking at that extension. They put the extension to Manchester, but they didn't really consider Concord, which is a little frustrating. I mean, Concord is a lot smaller, and so that might be a perfectly reasonable cut off point, but I do wish TM would show their work on some these things a bit more.

Despite my nitpicking (and some other criticisms starting here), the report is well worth a read

NHDOT has done a few more thorough studies. I think Manchester would be the end point of the any initial expansion, but they priced out an extension to Concord, too, at least in the 2014 study if you want to see the details
www.dot.nh.gov

Capitol Corridor

The proposed service will use approximately 10 miles of MBTA railway from Lowell, MA to Nashua, NH, and 20 miles of MBTA trackage rights on Pan Am Railways (Pan Am) Northern Branch northward into Manchester. The project is currently in the development phase. Key steps to be completed in this...
www.dot.nh.gov www.dot.nh.gov

I don't follow NH politics much. Is this really becoming a campaign issue? That's great! Or... could turn out bad. Either way, exciting
 
ritchiew said:
Transit Matters put out a report last year, Modernizing the Lowell Line, which included looking at that extension. They put the extension to Manchester, but they didn't really consider Concord, which is a little frustrating. I mean, Concord is a lot smaller, and so that might be a perfectly reasonable cut off point, but I do wish TM would show their work on some these things a bit more.

Despite my nitpicking (and some other criticisms starting here), the report is well worth a read

NHDOT has done a few more thorough studies. I think Manchester would be the end point of the any initial expansion, but they priced out an extension to Concord, too, at least in the 2014 study if you want to see the details
www.dot.nh.gov

Capitol Corridor

The proposed service will use approximately 10 miles of MBTA railway from Lowell, MA to Nashua, NH, and 20 miles of MBTA trackage rights on Pan Am Railways (Pan Am) Northern Branch northward into Manchester. The project is currently in the development phase. Key steps to be completed in this...
www.dot.nh.gov www.dot.nh.gov

I don't follow NH politics much. Is this really becoming a campaign issue? That's great! Or... could turn out bad. Either way, exciting
Click to expand...
My understanding is that since the leading Dem candidate, Joyce Craig, is the current mayor of Manchester (And originally from there), she's naturally quite keen on bringing CR to Manchester, and I'd expect more top-down pressure if she wins.
 
ritchiew said:
Transit Matters put out a report last year, Modernizing the Lowell Line, which included looking at that extension. They put the extension to Manchester, but they didn't really consider Concord, which is a little frustrating. I mean, Concord is a lot smaller, and so that might be a perfectly reasonable cut off point, but I do wish TM would show their work on some these things a bit more.

Despite my nitpicking (and some other criticisms starting here), the report is well worth a read

NHDOT has done a few more thorough studies. I think Manchester would be the end point of the any initial expansion, but they priced out an extension to Concord, too, at least in the 2014 study if you want to see the details
www.dot.nh.gov

Capitol Corridor

The proposed service will use approximately 10 miles of MBTA railway from Lowell, MA to Nashua, NH, and 20 miles of MBTA trackage rights on Pan Am Railways (Pan Am) Northern Branch northward into Manchester. The project is currently in the development phase. Key steps to be completed in this...
www.dot.nh.gov www.dot.nh.gov

I don't follow NH politics much. Is this really becoming a campaign issue? That's great! Or... could turn out bad. Either way, exciting
Click to expand...
The Concord study split the services, with 30 trains originating/terminating at Nashua and only 8 continuing on to Manchester + Concord. With the Concord runs running express in MA stopping only at Anderson-Woburn and Lowell then turning local in NH in order to speed up their run times (about 1:45). Left Manchester a bit short on service with the limited schedules, so the Manchester full-serve terminating option probably works better. There's probably still a market for the Concord super-expresses, though. But that would lean a bit heavier on NHDOT subsidy since so many stops in MA would be skipped. That's definitely something they need to sort out for themselves.
 
The report on Modernizing the Lowell Line linked above by ritchiew is informative and an easy read. It seems like there is a good deal of work on the Massachusetts side, raising platforms and so forth, that would be worth doing even without a buy-in from New Hampshire. The employment density seems to justify extending the line up to Willow Springs as a start. Is there a willingness for Massachusetts to take on a limited project or is the proposal all or nothing?
 
NHMaples said:
The report on Modernizing the Lowell Line linked above by ritchiew is informative and an easy read. It seems like there is a good deal of work on the Massachusetts side, raising platforms and so forth, that would be worth doing even without a buy-in from New Hampshire. The employment density seems to justify extending the line up to Willow Springs as a start. Is there a willingness for Massachusetts to take on a limited project or is the proposal all or nothing?
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The problem is that the Lowell Line lacks a layover yard. They have nowhere to stuff consists for headway corrections or crew changes except for long layovers on the Lowell platform, and start-of-day/end-of-day + shift changes require a deadheading move back to Boston Engine Terminal in Somerville. Lowell has the highest quantity of deadheading 'waste miles' by far of any line on the Commuter Rail, and it's only somewhat manageable because the line is only 25 miles long (shorter than all except Fairmount, Needham, and Stoughton). So they can't reliably extend the line without fitting in a layover yard. And all of the feasible sites for a layover are in New Hampshire, not Massachusetts, because of the way the NH Mainline stays bolted to the banks of the Merrimack (and wetlands therein) literally the whole way to the state line after leaving Downtown Lowell. If layovers and lack of MA land for them weren't the constraint, the line probably would've already been extended to State Line/Pheasant Lane Mall long ago.
 
F-Line to Dudley said:
The problem is that the Lowell Line lacks a layover yard. They have nowhere to stuff consists for headway corrections or crew changes except for long layovers on the Lowell platform, and start-of-day/end-of-day + shift changes require a deadheading move back to Boston Engine Terminal in Somerville. Lowell has the highest quantity of deadheading 'waste miles' by far of any line on the Commuter Rail, and it's only somewhat manageable because the line is only 25 miles long (shorter than all except Fairmount, Needham, and Stoughton). So they can't reliably extend the line without fitting in a layover yard. And all of the feasible sites for a layover are in New Hampshire, not Massachusetts, because of the way the NH Mainline stays bolted to the banks of the Merrimack (and wetlands therein) literally the whole way to the state line after leaving Downtown Lowell. If layovers and lack of MA land for them weren't the constraint, the line probably would've already been extended to State Line/Pheasant Lane Mall long ago.
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There is 8.5 miles of single track between Stony Brook and Nashua. A Nashua only run could be relatively cheap, as track upgrades and some bridge rebuild would be needed, but that 30 min service would not unduly tax the capacity. Signal upgrades will probably cost more. Three simple single platforms should even be within NHs budget. Manchester is a heavier lift
 
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