DOT Parcels | 25-28 Kneeland Street | Chinatown

atlantaden said:
Yes, I read the Globe article. Here’s another article from Peebles, awarded the Viola parcel in January of 2015, and still, not a shovel full of dirt overturned. Thus my little faith in Peebles getting either project off the ground! Hope I’m proved wrong.

Viola Back Bay - The Peebles Corporation

peeblescorp.com peeblescorp.com
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I'd hope so too. I wasn't contesting your skepticism as I'm skeptical of the Viola happening as well, I was simply noting that there was a mention of it since there's been such little news or updates on the Viola.
 
shmessy said:
(underlined in the quote - mine)

....or maybe, just maybe, they do a good job? Unless you can point to poor performance, is there a need to sound that dog whistle?
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They haven't been doing a good job so far with the Viola project. In fact they haven't been doing a job with it at all. I believe that by this time construction was supposed to be well underway if not nearing completion. I used to follow the Viola thread with bated breath, but things just kept on NOT happening so I lost all interest on the project and don't even recall the details of the project anymore. My idea of "doing a good job" is what Samuels is doing at Parcel 12, not what Peebles isn't doing at Parcel 13. And I can't point to poor performance until there's some actual performance to point to.

Actually, I suppose I should be glad Peebles is doing such a poor job with Viola because I think the last thing that location needs is a monolithic red wall that looks even more overwhelming than the State Transportation Building.

By the way, shmessy, the next time you reply to one of my posts it may help you to know that I'm gay, I'm a minority, and I'm an immigrant, and adjust your theory of mind as to what motivates me accordingly.
 
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xec said:
Actually, I suppose I should be glad Peebles is doing such a poor job with Viola because I think the last thing that location needs is a monolithic red wall that looks even more overwhelming than the State Transportation Building.
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The last thing that location needs is the status quo, a gap in Back Bay's urban environment caused by the Mass Pike.

Regardless of whether it ends up being the Viola or not, Parcel 13 desperately needs to be developed.
 
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xec said:
They haven't been doing a good job so far with the Viola project. In fact they haven't been doing a job with it at all. I believe that by this time construction was supposed to be well underway if not nearing completion. I used to follow the Viola thread with bated breath, but things just kept on NOT happening so I lost all interest on the project and don't even recall the details of the project anymore. My idea of "doing a good job" is what Samuels is doing at Parcel 12, not what Peebles isn't doing at Parcel 13. And I can't point to poor performance until there's some actual performance to point to.

Actually, I suppose I should be glad Peebles is doing such a poor job with Viola because I think the last thing that location needs is a monolithic red wall that looks even more overwhelming than the State Transportation Building.

By the way, shmessy, the next time you reply to one of my posts it may help you to know that I'm gay, I'm a minority, and I'm an immigrant, and adjust your theory of mind as to what motivates me accordingly.
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Too bad you decided to criticize something that you "lost all interest on the project and don't even recall the details of the project anymore".

I don't care one whit about your background - - enough about categorization obsessions. Guess what? Being a gay, minority immigrant does not make you somehow immune from dogwhistling. It was a dogwhistle and you know it. It was the only reason you originally gave regarding a project that you now write you lost all interest in and forget the details about. Beautiful.

At least my previous post brought you to actually address a possible objective reason this time around. And THAT it is fair to discuss. I would put forth that The Viola has a far more complicated challenge in that it is not only over the Pike but ALSO over an underground T station - - much of the delay is in coordinating with the T regardijng that engineering.

The Viola is nowhere near the same as Samuels and Rosenthals Pike projects. Viola has to deal with Pike decking AND the MBTA redo of the underground Hynes T station which is directly below it (Parcel 12 is only partially over the station). Let's go to the T itself to see some of the details and timelines on THAT:

Hynes Station Accessibility Improvements | Projects | MBTA

Official website of the MBTA -- schedules, maps, and fare information for Greater Boston's public transportation system, including subway, commuter rail, bus routes, and boat lines.
www.mbta.com www.mbta.com


Hynes Station serves the B, C, and D branches of the Green Line. We’re renovating the station to improve accessibility, safety, and rider experience.
These improvements will be partially funded ($30.5M) by the Parcel 13 project—and done in coordination with the Parcel 12 project—as part of a contract for a future mixed-use development over the I-90 Turnpike and Hynes Station.
Design contract awarded: Spring 2020
Projected completion: Fall 2025
Budget: $45.7 million (design and construction)
Status: Conceptual design
As part of the Green Line Transformation, (GLT), this project meets the following goals:
  • Accessibility: Raised platforms and new elevators
  • Customer experience: Modernization of the station and improved wayfinding and lighting
Also, check Page 14 from this to really open your eyes:
bpda.app.box.com

2020-02-11_Presentation_Parcel 13.pdf | Powered by Box

bpda.app.box.com bpda.app.box.com

.
 
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xec said:
They haven't been doing a good job so far with the Viola project. In fact they haven't been doing a job with it at all. I believe that by this time construction was supposed to be well underway if not nearing completion. I used to follow the Viola thread with bated breath, but things just kept on NOT happening so I lost all interest on the project and don't even recall the details of the project anymore. My idea of "doing a good job" is what Samuels is doing at Parcel 12, not what Peebles isn't doing at Parcel 13. And I can't point to poor performance until there's some actual performance to point to.

Actually, I suppose I should be glad Peebles is doing such a poor job with Viola because I think the last thing that location needs is a monolithic red wall that looks even more overwhelming than the State Transportation Building.

By the way, shmessy, the next time you reply to one of my posts it may help you to know that I'm gay, I'm a minority, and I'm an immigrant, and adjust your theory of mind as to what motivates me accordingly.
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I ignored him like a day after I joined AB, and it's made this site so much more enjoyable. I recommend it.
 
Peebles also distracted perhaps by a mega-project in NYC, which has come to a screeching halt, as the state pulled the RFP.

Adjaye-towers.jpg


https://www.archpaper.com/2022/02/a...firmation-tower-in-doubt-after-rfp-is-pulled/
 
stellarfun said:
Peebles also distracted perhaps by a mega-project in NYC, which has come to a screeching halt, as the state pulled the RFP.

Adjaye-towers.jpg


https://www.archpaper.com/2022/02/a...firmation-tower-in-doubt-after-rfp-is-pulled/
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Whoa - - I would never live in that building - - let alone near it. No matter how many engineers swear on its safety.

Aside from that, reading the article, it seems the delta there is the policy change/requirements from the Cuomo Administration to the Hochul Administration.
 
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shmessy said:
Whoa - - I would never live in that building - - let alone near it. No matter how many engineers swear on its safety.
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That was my thought too. My rational side has full faith in the engineers and architects and knows it's probably 100% safe, my instinctive and irrational side says "stay the eff away".
 
I couldn't possibly handle looking at a building like this without being convinced it was falling toward me at that very moment. I don't even like looking at the render.
 
HenryAlan said:
I couldn't possibly handle looking at a building like this without being convinced it was falling toward me at that very moment. I don't even like looking at the render.
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The craziest part is that the base is large enough that they could just flip it over. So why propose it like THIS when it doesn't have to be? I wouldn't feel safe around it either.
 
DZH22 said:
The craziest part is that the base is large enough that they could just flip it over. So why propose it like THIS when it doesn't have to be? I wouldn't feel safe around it either.
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First and foremost, it's a crap design and I wouldn't want to be near it either. Just because you can do something with a design doesn't mean you should.

Your first sentence makes sense pragmatically of course, but here it is specifically (perhaps solely) due to that big base footprint in the first place that they would ever be able to implement this design as shown. A huge base and foundation occupying the full footprint (and counter-acting the moment from the top) is what allows the ass-backwards design to work. If they only had a tiny footprint to work with, they likely could never do this.
It's just like this type of two-legged chair (image):
256CC-L80_FZ.jpg
 
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bigpicture7 said:
First and foremost, it's a crap design and I wouldn't want to be near it either. Just because you can do something with a design doesn't mean you should.

But your first sentence is off track, no disrespect. It is specifically due to that big base footprint in the first place that would ever allow them to be able to implement this design as shown. A huge base and foundation occupying the full footprint (and counter-acting the moment from the top) is what allows the ass-backwards design to work in the first place. If they only had a tiny footprint to work with, they likely could never do this.
It's just like this type of two-legged chair (image):
256CC-L80_FZ.jpg
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But that chair doesn't make me queasy
 
I think we should stick to the merits of the proposal, but I will point out, regarding the discussion of dog whistles, that anybody can use one, it's not remotely connected to your own personal background.
 
DZH22 said:
The craziest part is that the base is large enough that they could just flip it over. So why propose it like THIS when it doesn't have to be? I wouldn't feel safe around it either.
Click to expand...

My question is "Are there really people who would rent/buy any space above the 5th or 6th story in that building?" I can't imagine puttting down money for that.

Also, this is a scenario where I could actually understand/appreciate NIMBYism.
 
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bigpicture7 said:
Your first sentence makes sense pragmatically of course, but here it is specifically (perhaps solely) due to that big base footprint in the first place that they would ever be able to implement this design as shown.
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Yeah but my point is that they have the room at the base where they could flip it over, and then produce a design that isn't stupid/scary looking. It might actually look really good inverted. Just because the large base allows them to handle all those cantilevers, it doesn't mean they should.

shmessy said:
My question is "Are there really people who would rent/buy any space above the 5th or 6th story in that building?"
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I wouldn't want any floor of this building. If I have fears that it could come crashing down, then having a 1500' building fall on my head is only marginally better than falling the 1500' to my death. Either way the end result would be the same. It's just on the bottom floors I'd likely die instantly before my confusion turned to fear, while on the top I'd have a few extra seconds to think about it. Basically, if I'd be afraid to be on the upper floors, then the same logic should apply to any floor.
 
For the record, the NY project was cantilevered like that because of a preexisting MTA vent building and some other rail easments, but it doesn't excuse the deliberately top heavy design of the cantilever. There are far better ways to do it.
171487050.K2HMNnLq.e2.JPG
 
xec said:
They haven't been doing a good job so far with the Viola project. In fact they haven't been doing a job with it at all.
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So not to state the obvious but both the hotel and high end residential market were sucking wind even before the pandemic and a lot of new inventory has come on the market in both sectors in the last few years. I can’t blame them for sitting on the sidelines while things sort themselves out.
 
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