Electronic Tolls (& Avoidance)

[Arlington]

For e-tolling to be fair, plate pass has to work.
For plate pass to work, plates must be readable (not covered or effaced)

Do “clear” covers make plates unreadable? Should driving effaced/covered have the same consequences as driving with no plate?

I would say so.

Do we (NH MA ME) have the same problem that Gersh Kuntzman points out in NYC? (Officials/police beating tolls by effacing their plates with tape, leaves, acid, peeling and covers?)

 

[fattony]

I can imagine a system to catch people, though given this state’s appetite for traffic enforcement (absolutely none), it would never happen.

Post a cruiser downstream from a camera. If an obstructed plate is detected, text a photo of the car to the cop to pull them over and ticket them.

There is no need for the offender to have actually violated any other law on camera nor is this needed at every camera. We can make having an obstructed plate a moving violation and just enough random enforcement to be a deterrent.

 

[Equilibria]

I can imagine a system to catch people, though given this state’s appetite for traffic enforcement (absolutely none), it would never happen.

Post a cruiser downstream from a camera. If an obstructed plate is detected, text a photo of the car to the cop to pull them over and ticket them.

There is no need for the offender to have actually violated any other law on camera nor is this needed at every camera. We can make having an obstructed plate a moving violation and just enough random enforcement to be a deterrent.

As with so many things: are the people-hours to implement this worth the $2 (and often much less) you're losing with each offense? Probably not...

Same logic as using proof-of-payment on the T - the savings from not having to maintain the fare gates covers the losses from the cheaters.

 

[theSil]

As with so many things: are the people-hours to implement this worth the $2 (and often much less) you're losing with each offense? Probably not...

When someone defaces their license plate and is able to continuously get away with it, I personally believe they're also more likely to engage in other reckless behavior on the road. Hopefully more enforcement, greater deterrent of other dangerous behavior. This is especially the case here in New York, because unlike in Massachusetts (), automated enforcement in New York also includes red light and speeding cameras.

Separate thought: I'm not sure if the state maintains a record of what make and model is associated with a given license plate number, but if they do, automated enforcement of obstructed plates also seems trivial. In most cases, the full license plate number could probably be determined with the combination of partial license plate number + car make and model.

 

[fattony]

As with so many things: are the people-hours to implement this worth the $2 (and often much less) you're losing with each offense? Probably not...

Same logic as using proof-of-payment on the T - the savings from not having to maintain the fare gates covers the losses from the cheaters.

Every day I see 75% or more of riders board the GLX without validating at the fare machine. I'm one of the suckers who actually pays. If you don't enforce something at all, evasion becomes rampant and the losses become significant.

You are right that toll evasion may not be significant enough at this time to justify any sort of intervention, but if evasion is both easy and clearly unenforced it will eventually become widespread.

 

[stick n move]

When someone defaces their license plate and is able to continuously get away with it, I personally believe they're also more likely to engage in other reckless behavior on the road. Hopefully more enforcement, greater deterrent of other dangerous behavior. This is especially the case here in New York, because unlike in Massachusetts (), automated enforcement in New York also includes red light and speeding cameras.

Separate thought: I'm not sure if the state maintains a record of what make and model is associated with a given license plate number, but if they do, automated enforcement of obstructed plates also seems trivial. In most cases, the full license plate number could probably be determined with the combination of partial license plate number + car make and model.

Nyc is also from what I hear essentially at crisis levels with the amount of temp tags floating around and being used, and also inevitably being used to commit crimes with impunity, thankfully this hasnt really reached Boston from what Ive seen, that would add a whole other dynamic to the situation.

 

[F-Line to Dudley]

Nyc is also from what I hear essentially at crisis levels with the amount of temp tags floating around and being used, and also inevitably being used to commit crimes with impunity, thankfully this hasnt really reached Boston from what Ive seen, that would add a whole other dynamic to the situation.

NYPD pretty much refuses to enforce plate offenses, in large part because off-duty NY cops are a demographically large partaker in such violations. The Blue Wall at work.

There's a sizeable segment of NYC Transit Twitter devoted to exposing the enforcement issue.

 

[reno]

I have always found it strange that a lot of states issue temporary plates, which are typically a paper plate that has temp, some numbers and the state on it. It seems they would easily be counterfeited these days. In Mass. I have never known for them to exist, you get a permanent plate when you pay for and register the car. Seems unbelievable but Massachusetts seems to be more on the ball with this.

 

[F-Line to Dudley]

I have always found it strange that a lot of states issue temporary plates, which are typically a paper plate that has temp, some numbers and the state on it. It seems they would easily be counterfeited these days. In Mass. I have never known for them to exist, you get a permanent plate when you pay for and register the car. Seems unbelievable but Massachusetts seems to be more on the ball with this.

Texas has basically devolved into a national factory for fraudulent paper temp plates.

 

[stick n move]

I watched a news story about a temp tag mill operation where a guy had rented a warehouse that never had anybody come or go but because there was a physical location, a sign with the business name, and 1 single lady at a desk it met the minimum requirements to issue temp tags.

Needless to say they dug in to the numbers and they had given out like 100,000 temp tags because they had set up a pay per plate system. They were selling temp tags to people all across the country who then were using them for god knows what. The craziest part was the hosts had asked the police/city if theres anything they can do about this blatant pay per plate operation and they said no because they meet all of the minimum requirements lol.

 

[Stlin]

Unless I'm very mistaken, Mass did just introduce paper plates as of April 2023? Granted, it's only for out of state residents so it's basically a sales tax grab, but the RMV does now have paper plates.