Elevated Rail: Boston and Beyond

Also it is very unlikely that Boston is ever going to get anything looking like those Orange Line stations ever again. It would be nice if they made a replica of one of those stations and put it over one of the highway on/off-ramp parcels on the Greenway to house a restaurant or something.

Thompson Square station was supposed to be saved (perhaps as a restaurant), but unfortunately burned soon after the rest of the El was removed in Charlestown.
 
With all the hub bub around the soccer stadium and transit, build some elevated train lines to Everett as others have mentioned in this thread.
As lovely as this would be, I think elevated train lines would probably have more pushback than at-grade or subway lines.
 
As lovely as this would be, I think elevated train lines would probably have more pushback than at-grade or subway lines.
Normally yes, but as long as it dives under at or before Sweetser circle there really isn't anyone to object. It's a polluted hellscape at the moment so there are no residents whose views will be impeded.
 
Normally yes, but as long as it dives under at or before Sweetser circle there really isn't anyone to object. It's a polluted hellscape at the moment so there are no residents whose views will be impeded.
Encore is a pretty big money interest that might object to an EL.
 
Encore is a pretty big money interest that might object to an EL.
Perhaps, but frankly I would be surprised if that was the case. I don't think any part of the building actually looks out onto Alford St, and it would be at least 350 ft away from the building itself.

Also, the more people you get in the door the more money a casino makes, and this would certainly make it a lot easier to get in the door.
 
Perhaps, but frankly I would be surprised if that was the case. I don't think any part of the building actually looks out onto Alford St, and it would be at least 350 ft away from the building itself.

Also, the more people you get in the door the more money a casino makes, and this would certainly make it a lot easier to get in the door.
Why would we be following the street grid for anything rail when the Eastern Route is right there? I mean...it's one thing if you want to divert off-ROW after Sweetser into Downtown Everett. Crayon away at those dreams for what they're worth. But for actually getting across the river and as far as Sweetser...Urban Ring ROW along the Eastern no questions asked. It's cheaper, less obtrusive, MUCH more intensively-studied to save on paperwork, physically easier to integrate a station into Encore, and serves more catchment by being able to span a station entrance to a TOD'ified Gateway Center. 1000 ft. walk from there to the new stadium is plenty close for rapid transit stop spacing.

The reason Encore would object to an El is this ^above^ "Why?" question. An El flat-out isn't needed to get to their doorstep.
 
An El flat-out isn't needed to get to their doorstep.
But if you care about more than just Encore, this is an area likely to be redeveloped into something, stadium or no stadium, then the Eastern Route kinda sucks. Getting to any development east of Alford St would require either going around, through, or under Encore. The first is a rather long walk, at least half a mile just to get to Alford St, the second seems much more objectionable than just building an elevated, and the third would be a huge drag on any cost savings. Yes for Gateway Center it's better placed, but I don't think that's where we're more likely to see new development, and it's ultimately a smaller area than the space east of Alford St.
physically easier to integrate a station into Encore
But is it though? Yes the El would need some kind of skybridge for a direct connection, but the Eastern Route isn't amazing either, that side of the resort is meeting rooms, delivery bays, and the kitchens of a few restaurants. Would it be easier than a skybridge? Probably at least somewhat, but by how much?

It's cheaper
By how much though? I'm willing to bet it's not tons. The existing bridge is only for two tracks, so there will need to be a new bridge across the Mystic regardless, and getting to Alford St doesn't really require a longer bridge. So it comes down to how much 3500ft of concrete elevated costs, compared to 3500ft of laying new tracks and slightly widening the existing ROW, plus removing the level crossing between Gateway Center and Encore.

I think the theme here is that yes in some respects the Eastern Route would be easier, but it's definitely not without challenges and it's not a clear and straightforward winner. What I would consider he most important criteria though, proximity to any stadium development and surroundings, is a clear loss for the Eastern Route. It needs to make up for that in cost-savings, and I'm not sure that they're enough to fully overcome that major downside.
 
Last edited:
All valid, especially considering Encore bought all those parcels east of Alford/Broadway with the intent of developing an "entertainment district" over time.

The one thing in the Eastern Route's favor is the ease of getting tracks there once you leave Sullivan Square. With the Northern Expressway viaduct looming over everything, that more or less forces you to cross that plane below-grade.

To take what's often the most popular form of Urban Ring station at Sullivan -- convert the freight sidings next to the OL platforms to Urban Ring tracks -- it might be doable if you assume smaller, automated rolling stock like Vancouver Skytrain, Montreal REM, which allow you tighter turning radii and steeper max grades than the ones @Teban54 has catalogued for the Red and Orange Lines.

Using a 5% grade (the lower end of the max range on the Skytrain), you can get the top of your tracks 32.5 feet up in the air from the trackbed elevation as it passes underneath the Mystic Ave bridge.

Without knowing the depth of a Skytrain viaduct off the top of my head (they look pretty substantial, like 10-15 feet?) , I'd wonder if that's enough to keep from giving folks riding on Haverhill Line bi-levels a haircut, let alone leaving space for catenary. Remember that all those tracks start rising the minute you get out from under the Mystic Ave. bridge, too, so you're not gaining nearly as much headroom as that 32.5-foot figure suggests.

Curves would be doable using that smaller rolling stock, though:

Untitled drawing(2).png
 
Last edited:
Curves would be doable using that smaller rolling stock, though:
You don't need smaller rolling stock to do curves like that. It's a radius of around 1000-1500ft, around double the curve radius between Savin Hill and Fields Corner.
Using a 5% grade (the lower end of the max range on the Skytrain), you can get the top of your tracks 32.5 feet up in the air from the trackbed elevation as it passes underneath the Mystic Ave bridge.
It makes way more sense to go under the CR tracks in my opinion. From crossing under the Newburyport/Rockport line tracks, you could rise 60ft before crossing the Mystic. I can't find the actual height of the Mystic River MBTA bridge but just eyeballing it in comparison to the Tobin, it seems like that should be fine.

Or you could built a short tunnel under the Sullivan Sq parking lots, surfacing above Rutherford Ave and then following the route of the Charlestown Elevated.
 
The tunnel option seems more reasonable. Especially since current BTD policy has turned against preserving the underpass through Sullivan Square. The underpass footprint would give you a natural way to get back above ground.
 
All valid, especially considering Encore bought all those parcels east of Alford/Broadway with the intent of developing an "entertainment district" over time.

The one thing in the Eastern Route's favor is the ease of getting tracks there once you leave Sullivan Square. With the Northern Expressway viaduct looming over everything, that more or less forces you to cross that plane below-grade.

To take what's often the most popular form of Urban Ring station at Sullivan -- convert the freight sidings next to the OL platforms to Urban Ring tracks -- it might be doable if you assume smaller, automated rolling stock like Vancouver Skytrain, Montreal REM, which allow you tighter turning radii and steeper max grades than the ones @Teban54 has catalogued for the Red and Orange Lines.

Using a 5% grade (the lower end of the max range on the Skytrain), you can get the top of your tracks 32.5 feet up in the air from the trackbed elevation as it passes underneath the Mystic Ave bridge.

Without knowing the depth of a Skytrain viaduct off the top of my head (they look pretty substantial, like 10-15 feet?) , I'd wonder if that's enough to keep from giving folks riding on Haverhill Line bi-levels a haircut, let alone leaving space for catenary. Remember that all those tracks start rising the minute you get out from under the Mystic Ave. bridge, too, so you're not gaining nearly as much headroom as that 32.5-foot figure suggests.

Curves would be doable using that smaller rolling stock, though:

View attachment 57816
I would love that route for an elevated GL branch to Everett or LRV urban ring to Chelsea. It would serve the Revs stadium and that whole area east of Alford St really well.
 

Back
Top