Fan Pier Developments | Seaport

The Pappas area is very underutilized in terms of its industrial use - and that's a tremendous area, between D Street and Pappas Way (which I hope one day reverts back to being called Old Summer Street). Does anyone know if that area is height restricted for flight paths? Or if there are any real plans for the area? (Excluding pipe dreams like the canal district!)
 
Pelham - great post regarding development in the Seaport District.

Shepard - "To say this another way, I wonder if the Seaport's promise is actually its downfall."

I can agree that with massive projects, or region encompassing development, there are high expectations. That's one of the reasons why developers have such a hard time moving projects forward in the city. I think that the area is moving along at a pace that warrants solid planning but not so slow that nothing appears to be happening. I don't think we will end up with a bunch of "stumps" as we really have not yet (relative to height restrictions in the area). Head down to the WTC area around lunch time or after work and you'll be surprised at the activity. Fan Pier and FP3 aside, I have yet to hear much negative talk on lease percentages.

When was the last time you were down there, just our of curiosity?

My opinion. It is an awesome area that places you on the welcome mat of the city without actually being downtown. All the amenities within walking distance, the water, and again the new development. If I could afford to live there I would in a second. Real estate is a long term investment. Nobody is flipping houses anymore for a reason.
 
Nice post BYMH, and I agree there is good cause for optimism. I walk around there often and drive through fairly regularly in fact, and have been surprised by the amount of activity at times.

But I don't understand why you're content with an area of this size and potential being a "welcome mat of the city." (A welcome mat for whom, anyway? Conference goers? Cruise ship disembarkers? Southie residents driving into town from Summer Street?) "Welcome mat of the city" sounds like realtor-lingo for a area close to downtown that has no character, identity, or desirability on its own accord.

Again though, your point is well-taken that it's a good investment now because it won't stay a "welcome mat" forever. Problem is that the developers that are, in fact, investing there, aren't building it out as anything better.
 
We all want great NOW!

That is not how great cities get made. Great cities are a palimpsest, with old and new written over itself. The problem we are seeing in the SBW is that there is a blank page. The developers have the money to lay down the base coat and that is what folks are unhappy with. But a base coat does not make the picture.

Remember folks, things get interesting in the second or third generation of building on a particular site.

Should we be given better design ...yes! Will it happen? Well ... it will happen now if the developers see it as a value they can pass on to their investors, tenants, clients, or customers. It will happen later as a matter of course.

I think its fine to throw darts at design we are not partial to, but I have just about given up on the idea that you can MAKE a city wonderful. Cities grow into wonderful things over many generations of building cycles.

cca
 
cca said:
I think its fine to throw darts at design we are not partial to, but I have just about given up on the idea that you can MAKE a city wonderful. Cities grow into wonderful things over many generations of building cycles.
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Haussmann?


That aside I think you are right. But you need the right ingredients added to the stew over time. The ultrawide streets, the landscrapers and big blocks are a deadly base to start with (and difficult to correct over time). See Government Center as an example. We have been waiting over 50 years for that to evolve. A lot has changed but very little of it for the better. Meanwhile places like the North End and the South End have gone from being ghettos to being some of the nicest 'hoods in the city in the same time period.

We know what works. We know what makes great cities. These things can be found in almost every great city across the globe and there are what is missing from places like the Seaport and the West End.
 
This is a contemporary issue that cannot be dealt with without the governing bodies being cursed as being anti-developer or socialists. So ... we wait for geological time to occur when Kendall Square, and SBW to evolve beyond their dreadfulness.

Kendall Square by the way, has more street activity then it ever has and with it will draw retail ... and with with will draw the kind of richness we are all hoping for. It will take time though ... always time and a couple of rounds of additions and renovations to the superblock-set-back-blankness we have now.

cca

Ps. I am sure there are as many people who would say that Hausmann was the worst thing to happen to Paris than would claim him as a visionary urban designer. He was possibly the most heavy handed planner ever seen. Plus it took decades for Paris to be become wonderful Post-Hausmann.
 
cca said:
This is a contemporary issue that cannot be dealt with without the governing bodies being cursed as being anti-developer or socialists. So ... we wait for geological time to occur when Kendall Square, and SBW to evolve beyond their dreadfulness.
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Or instead of waiting, we could elect governing bodies that can deliver an urban New England version of this or this.

Again, why should we accept anything less? Especially when all we have is a vague hint of a possibility of a functioning neighborhood for my great-grandchildren?
 
southbostonconstruction.jpg
 
nice shot !this building can look good from certain angles,then again it will some day be mostly hidden!
 
Thanks and I agree. I think it won't be so bad when surrounded by other buildings of similar size. It just doesn't work well by itself.
 
Anyone who likes this building will love Kendall Square.
 
Reminds me of a few buildings down in Providence.
 
briv said:
Anyone who likes this building will love Kendall Square.
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as a lover of Kendall Sq. I take affront! in aggregate and detail Kendall Sq. has character, energy and an air of intense preoccupation -- even if many people don't like the effect, there is definitely a there there.

this thing is just a box surounded by cement fields and sort of near a brick fort. i'm not optimistic.
 
I think Dubai has proven that despite the best of the best for architecture; height is not very exciting without a vibrant street level and without adequate city design....

we see renderings of these dramatic glorious structures but once they are done and you can look at the real thing in broad daylight it's all sorta...meh imo
 
In a few thousand years, I bet Dubai will be to the future archaeologists and geologists what lost Aztec and Mayan cities are to today's researchers.
 
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