Green Line Extension to Medford & Union Sq

Re: Green Line to Medford to start in 2011

I'd be surprised if your comments about Winter Hill are true.

And for Union people trying to get to Porter--isn't the bus service sufficient to serve what must be a relatively small number of people traveling there for work or entertainment?

To get to Davis or Harvard via a Green Line extension to Porter, you'd be looking at a two seat ride which would not represent a big improvement over the direct bus trips that you can use today (and in the case of the Union to Harvard trip, walking would likely be almost as fast as a Green to Red trip via Porter).
 
Re: Green Line to Medford to start in 2011

Believe it or not, there are people who believe that transit only consists of the colored lines on subway maps, or will only use these more fixed-infrastructure links with proper stations and obvious routes, and when you begin to build those, you open up a whole new world of possibilities to them. Tourists and visitors, too - they tend to be confused by bus systems. I think there'd be demand on a Union-Porter route.

One side benefit might be the development of Porter as something much more substantial than a dressed up strip mall. Remember, transit can shape development as much as facilitate existing patterns. Porter could be a dense node absorbing high density residential and commercial uses, allowing Harvard and Davis to retain more individual character and flair.
 
Re: Green Line to Medford to start in 2011

"One side benefit might be the development of Porter as something much more substantial than a dressed up strip mall."

...you could even imagine porter with these lots filled in and the old white hen replaced - that would be a truly urban place

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Re: Green Line to Medford to start in 2011

I believe Lesley University owns those and has some plans to build there, but I don't know the current status. Anyone know what used to be there?
 
Re: Green Line to Medford to start in 2011

The thing about Porter is yes it does have a lot of stip mall to it, yet it is very active. Its urban activity in a dense suburban/kinda urban setting.
 
Re: Green Line to Medford to start in 2011

czsz said:
Tourists and visitors, too - they tend to be confused by bus systems. I think there'd be demand on a Union-Porter route.

One side benefit might be the development of Porter as something much more substantial than a dressed up strip mall. Remember, transit can shape development as much as facilitate existing patterns.
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Sorry to be a pain, but does the board view a Union to Porter Green Line link to be critical b/c it will

1) provide Union Sq tourists with an easier trip to Porter, or

2) b/c it will somehow facilitate a level of urban development that hosting a station on the Red Line (our highest-level of service rapid transit line), a commuter rail station, and one of the MBTA's highest ridership bus routes has not already facilitated?

Neither of these arguments sound like a reason to invest in this corridor over dozens of other higher ridership bus corridors in the Boston area. I think the interest in this connection is probably driven by an overrepresentation on this board of people living the Camb/Som area who are bummed out by ocassionally having to ride a bus to catch a show at Toad.
 
Re: Green Line to Medford to start in 2011

Answering only for myself (disclosure, I very rarely spend any time North or West of the river):
belmont square said:
Sorry to be a pain, but does the board view a Union to Porter Green Line link to be critical b/c it will

1) provide Union Sq tourists with an easier trip to Porter, or
Click to expand...
What tourists?
2) b/c it will somehow facilitate a level of urban development that hosting a station on the Red Line (our highest-level of service rapid transit line), a commuter rail station, and one of the MBTA's highest ridership bus routes has not already facilitated?
Click to expand...
Clearly there is more to making an urban village than simply throwing up a rapid transit station. If two rail lines don't turn it into the next Harvard Square, why would three?
Neither of these arguments sound like a reason to invest in this corridor over dozens of other higher ridership bus corridors in the Boston area. I think the interest in this connection is probably driven by an overrepresentation on this board of people living the Camb/Som area who are bummed out by ocassionally having to ride a bus to catch a show at Toad.
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Preach it! There are two extremely high density bus corridors in Boston that could very easily be turned into Orange Line extensions. An extension along the Needham Heights Row from Forest Hills to Roslindale Square would remove up to 9 bus lines from Washington St. A spur from Roxbury Crossing to Dudley Square would eliminate about 10 bus routes.

These could be done quite inexpensively, especially the Roslindale extension which would cost no more than a Union to Porter extension while serving significantly more riders. Dudley would require a subway under Malcom X Blvd., but a pretty short one, and far easier to build than the silver line 3/Essex St. subway.
 
Re: Green Line to Medford to start in 2011

I would think an orange line branch that splits from the main line south of NEMC and travels down Washington street to Dudley and then down blue hill ave replacing the Silver Line and Rt 28 would be enough of a Mega project to shut everybody up for the next 50 years.
 
Re: Green Line to Medford to start in 2011

When I lived in Union Square I looked longingly at the rail line to Porter. Have you tried the hike in January?

When I lived in Porter Square I looked longingly at the line that passed by Union Square and several intermediate activity nodes.

When I lived in Porter Square and worked in Belmont Center, I looked longingly at the same line.

I think the line should be light rail at least to Belmont --or at least frequent-headway DMU's.
 
Re: Green Line to Medford to start in 2011

But ablarc, you're illustrating their point. As a (now-ex) Cantabrigian, I admit my desire to see this line made rapid transit is pretty highly driven by a desire for easier access to Union. Rationally I know there are better places within the inner Boston metro to invest in rail.

Boston just has way too much former streetcar suburbia to put back together with the tools we have today :(
 
Re: Green Line to Medford to start in 2011

Operated with DMU's the inbound line could terminate at Union Square for a synchronized cross-platform transfer to the Green Line. Very small investment: rolling stock and platforms; no electrification.
 
Re: Green Line to Medford to start in 2011

ablarc said:
When I lived in Porter Square and worked in Belmont Center, I looked longingly at the same line.

I think the line should be light rail at least to Belmont --or at least frequent-headway DMU's.
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The two bus routes that serve Belmont Center rank 101st and 135th out of the MBTA's 191 bus routes for daily ridership. The Belmont commuter rail station ranks 114th out of 131 commuter rail stations for daily ridership. Do you really believe that a light rail/DMU link with Porter and Union is the missing link for sparking the transit market in Belmont? And if so, given the relatively low ridership on Belmont's bus routes, aren't there literally 100 better places to implement such an improvement?
 
Re: Green Line to Medford to start in 2011

but what if you bring it out to Waltham Center? The #70 bus is pretty busy and there are a ton of express bus routes that terminate in or pass through Waltham Center.
 
Re: Green Line to Medford to start in 2011

I'd say that these investments should not only be made with current demand in mind, but also with a transformational objective too.
 
Re: Green Line to Medford to start in 2011

But why invest to transform places that are already relatively vibrant (Union, Porter, Belmont Center, Walthem Central Sq) but demonstrate relatively little current demand for the existing transit services that link them, before investing in places that are less vibrant (Chelsea, Roxbury, Dorchester, Mattapan) and demonstrate much higher current demand for existing transit service?
 
Re: Green Line to Medford to start in 2011

^ An extremely good point.
 
Re: Green Line to Medford to start in 2011

< Back to front page Text size ? + Somerville
Brickbottom neighborhood squeezed by rail line
E-mail | Print | Comments (1) Posted by Kaileigh Higgins December 20, 2010 10:04 AM

MY Town section of Globe for Somerville

By Danielle Dreilinger, Globe correspondent


If you look at Somerville's Brickbottom neighborhood from above, you'll see a tangled spaghetti bowl of train tracks. It's only going to get more complicated with the Green Line extension: new tracks, a maintenance facility, and possibly more commuter rail traffic.

The state Department of Transportation hasn't made any new design information public in many months, but word has gotten out to advocates that existing congestion in the Brickbottom area will require some fancy design footwork.

"It's clear that the design is going to be rethought," said Wig Zamore, a member of the Somerville Transportation Equity Partnership who sits on advisory boards for the MBTA and the Urban Ring.

The area simply might not be wide enough to fit the Green Line tracks, the Community Path walk/bike route, and access for emergency vehicles. One new idea is a "double-decker" design that would run the Green Line tracks at different heights, similar to the Orange Line at State Street, Zamore said. Continuing design efforts await a new consultant, as have projects to mitigate the delay in the coming of the Green Line, which has been pushed back from its legally mandated opening date of Dec. 31, 2014. Vanasse Hangen Brustlin handled the initial Green Line designs and the environmental permit process.

The key concern at a Somerville aldermen's committee meeting Dec. 13 was the Community Path, Zamore said. The state has not promised to design and fund the Brickbottom part of the path, and residents are worried that it won't happen. That seems foolish to Zamore: Eastern Somerville would be the one missing link in a 20-mile walk/bike route to downtown.

That knot of tracks may get even more congested soon: The state is proposing to route additional Worcester-to-Boston commuter rail along the Grand Junction tracks that run through eastern Cambridge and Somerville on their way to North Station.

"It would increase the disruption markedly," Zamore said.
 
Re: Green Line to Medford to start in 2011

What is the point of this article? To snare Green Line plans? There's plenty of room for everything mentioned except maybe the bike path. The bike path can suck my trolley in the name of rapid transit. If there's room, there's room.
 
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