I-90 Interchange Improvement Project & West Station | Allston

[Teban54]

Yeah. The whole point of this is so Harvard can build Seaport 2.0 there.

And this is why I have doubts over the claims upthread about how the bus terminal is overbuilt and has no reason to exist.

Yes, judging by today's standards, the 64 is the only logical route to be amended to West Station (and it doesn't even terminate there). But with further development in the area, it's hard to project just how much demand for transit there will be, and whether bus routes are needed to create new connections (especially those that can't be served by the Worcester Line and Urban Ring).

As late as 2014, there were still posts on this board arguing against additional transit facilities in Seaport ("walking from South Station is enough" blah blah blah). Yet today, pretty much everyone agrees it's underserved. And having a bus terminal there would have been handy, especially in view of the downtown transit corridor.

Same for Longwood Medical Area. The BNRD jampacks several routes there, some of which like T22 and T28 would have really benefited from proper bus facilities.

 

[Equilibria]

The city doesn't own the land being redeveloped, Harvard does.

But it's MassDOT that's laying the streets.

 

[Koopzilla24]

But it's MassDOT that's laying the streets.

To clarify, Harvard may own the land but it’s a MassDOT project to reconfigure I-90 and streets themselves as public roads are the states’s responsibility. My understanding was Harvard wanted housing there to attract more staff to live next to the campus and the new developments under construction across the road.

 

[bakgwailo]

But it's MassDOT that's laying the streets.

Yeah, MassDOT is moving the highway and making the street grid, but Harvard owns the land and will determine what gets built - neither of which is the city. I was replying to the person who said the city should dictate what was going to be built here which isn't possible.

 

[Tallguy]

Yeah, MassDOT is moving the highway and making the street grid, but Harvard owns the land and will determine what gets built - neither of which is the city. I was replying to the person who said the city should dictate what was going to be built here which isn't possible.

Ever heard of zoning variances?

 

[bakgwailo]

Ever heard of zoning variances?

I was replying to:

... multi-family mixed-use community centered around a park that’s city subsidized to keep rent comparable to the surrounding Allston-Brighton. As long as they don’t do an Assembly or University Park and call it “Transit Oriented Development”

Zoning isn't going to do that, and Harvard already has proposals and will almost certainly get their way on what they want to build. I guess the city could creating entirely new zoning that banned Assembly or University Park “Transit Oriented Development” and allowed only mixed used subsidized residential and a park - at which point Harvard will laugh and just land bank it for the next 100 years until they get what they want.

 

[F-Line to Dudley]

And this is why I have doubts over the claims upthread about how the bus terminal is overbuilt and has no reason to exist.

Yes, judging by today's standards, the 64 is the only logical route to be amended to West Station (and it doesn't even terminate there). But with further development in the area, it's hard to project just how much demand for transit there will be, and whether bus routes are needed to create new connections (especially those that can't be served by the Worcester Line and Urban Ring).

As late as 2014, there were still posts on this board arguing against additional transit facilities in Seaport ("walking from South Station is enough" blah blah blah). Yet today, pretty much everyone agrees it's underserved. And having a bus terminal there would have been handy, especially in view of the downtown transit corridor.

Same for Longwood Medical Area. The BNRD jampacks several routes there, some of which like T22 and T28 would have really benefited from proper bus facilities.

What streets are these mysterious bus routes supposed to be using? Under the proposed grid West is a P.I.T.A. to loop to from Cambridge St., and BU doesn't want any more spanning streets (so it's also incredibly unlikely to run a campus shuttle). Those access demerits DRASTICALLY cut down the possible routes you could crayon. No...the gigantic busways are put there in the hopes that they can entice intercity coach buses on the Pike to pit-stop there a mere 3 miles from South Station terminal, which is utterly absurd when Allston has excellent transit access to South Station. What's left...Harvard campus shuttles? You don't need a large number of layover spaces to run a jitney or two.

It's overbuilt to absurdity. If they can show their work on where exactly the bus demand is going to come from, some sort of busway is reasonable. But the overbuilt mess in the current plans? Nah...needs to be downsized by a lot.

 

[Equilibria]

What streets are these mysterious bus routes supposed to be using? Under the proposed grid West is a P.I.T.A. to loop to from Cambridge St., and BU doesn't want any more spanning streets (so it's also incredibly unlikely to run a campus shuttle). Those access demerits DRASTICALLY cut down the possible routes you could crayon. No...the gigantic busways are put there in the hopes that they can entice intercity coach buses on the Pike to pit-stop there a mere 3 miles from South Station terminal, which is utterly absurd when Allston has excellent transit access to South Station. What's left...Harvard campus shuttles? You don't need a large number of layover spaces to run a jitney or two.

It's overbuilt to absurdity. If they can show their work on where exactly the bus demand is going to come from, some sort of busway is reasonable. But the overbuilt mess in the current plans? Nah...needs to be downsized by a lot.

If this is what it takes to deck the Pike and build the bridge, then they can build the Port Authority for all I care.

 

[Koopzilla24]

I was replying to:



Zoning isn't going to do that, and Harvard already has proposals and will almost certainly get their way on what they want to build. I guess the city could creating entirely new zoning that banned Assembly or University Park “Transit Oriented Development” and allowed only mixed used subsidized residential and a park - at which point Harvard will laugh and just land bank it for the next 100 years until they get what they want.

Harvard has stated their commitment to affordable housing in the Allston development while also stating their intent to expand the currently expanding Enterprise Research Campus. The PR box could be ticked by making said affordable housing exclusively available to Harvard grad students, faculty, and staff, which they’ve done before.
Optimistically thinking, this could result in Harvard pushing for Grand Junction light rail to connect the new campus facilities from West Station directly to Kendall Sq. and MIT. The MBTA’s official announcement of the Readville Maintenance facility will render the Grand Junction mostly unused.

 

[stick n move]

Under Harvard’s Influence, MassDOT Approves $86 Million Contract to Rehab Allston Highway Viaduct

“Last week, the MassDOT Board of Directors approved a massive $86 million, 4-year contract to repair an aging highway viaduct along the Charles River in Allston, even though major details of the contract’s scope of work remain in flux, and the agency also has plans to tear down the same viaduct within the next decade.”

“At last week’s MassDOT board meeting, longtime members of the Allston Multimodal Project’s task force – which has been meeting since the spring of 2014 – and several MassDOT board members questioned the wisdom of spending so much time and money on a highway that the agency plans to tear down in the near future.”

“However, behind the scenes, MassDOT has been working with two powerful institutions to make last-minute changes to the “preservation” project’s scope of work so that it might better set the stage for the larger multimodal project.”

https://mass.streetsblog.org/2023/0...on-contract-to-rehab-allston-highway-viaduct/

 

[Blackbird]

What a mess

 

[lainpimicaja]

This is one of the biggest projects MassDOT's planned and have been talking about this for practically a decade now. What's wrong with MassDOT?

Is there a finance plan for the I-90 Allston project?

THERE'S BEEN A lot of talk over the last five years about how to design the I-90 Allston project, but very little discussion about how to pay for it. The

commonwealthmagazine.org

 

[JeffDowntown]

This is one of the biggest projects MassDOT's planned and have been talking about this for practically a decade now. What's wrong with MassDOT?

Is there a finance plan for the I-90 Allston project?

THERE'S BEEN A lot of talk over the last five years about how to design the I-90 Allston project, but very little discussion about how to pay for it. The

commonwealthmagazine.org

To be fair about this, it is really hard to have a financing plan before you have an actual project plan, because you don't know what you are financing. [Commonwealth Mag like to snark a lot]

This may be a MassDOT project, but there are probably a dozen other major stakeholders involved who have made the planning process really difficult. And if you don't appease those stakeholders, they can tie you up in court for years such that nothing gets done. MassDOT cannot just ram through what they might want to do like a dictator, they have to work through a very messy, slow public process.

 

[Charlie_mta]

To be fair about this, it is really hard to have a financing plan before you have an actual project plan, because you don't know what you are financing. [Commonwealth Mag like to snark a lot]

This may be a MassDOT project, but there are probably a dozen other major stakeholders involved who have made the planning process really difficult. And if you don't appease those stakeholders, they can tie you up in court for years such that nothing gets done. MassDOT cannot just ram through what they might want to do like a dictator, they have to work through a very messy, slow public process.

At least Massdot and the others finally decided on an at-grade option instead of a new viaduct. That alone is a minor miracle. I have a feeling that the project will get built in due time.

 

[stick n move]

At least Massdot and the others finally decided on an at-grade option instead of a new viaduct. That alone is a minor miracle. I have a feeling that the project will get built in due time.

Agreed, its actually a freaking miracle that after all of the excuses of why the blatently obvious-best choice could not be chosen they eventually completely reversed course and did the right thing. Holy shit did we dodge a bullet there.

 

[Blackbird]

At least Massdot and the others finally decided on an at-grade option instead of a new viaduct. That alone is a minor miracle. I have a feeling that the project will get built in due time.

They won’t need a new viaduct for decades if they do a good enough job repairing it now.

 

[Charlie_mta]

They won’t need a new viaduct for decades if they do a good enough job repairing it now.

Technically they wouldn't need to, but hopefully the "sunk-cost" phantasm won't delude the responsible agencies from initiating the at-grade project and removing the repaired viaduct.

 

[Badusername]

Technically they wouldn't need to, but hopefully the "sunk-cost" phantasm won't delude the responsible agencies from initiating the at-grade project and removing the repaired viaduct.

Yes, the opportunity cost of the development not taking place is much greater than the sunk cost of the repairs. However, it is disappointing MassDOT has a trend of prolonging the planning phase which makes repairs necessary. This is exactly what is happening with McGrath Highway now. Millions spent on repairing viaducts which will be demolished within the decade. It’s entirely avoidable if major projects were planned to complete at the end of the useful life of the infrastructure.

 

[Charlie_mta]

This is exactly what is happening with McGrath Highway now.

It's a shame that MassDOT hasn't applied to USDOT's Reconnecting Communities Pilot Program to tear down the McGrath Hwy overpass. I think that project would be a prime candidate.

 

[JeffDowntown]

Yes, the opportunity cost of the development not taking place is much greater than the sunk cost of the repairs. However, it is disappointing MassDOT has a trend of prolonging the planning phase which makes repairs necessary. This is exactly what is happening with McGrath Highway now. Millions spent on repairing viaducts which will be demolished within the decade. It’s entirely avoidable if major projects were planned to complete at the end of the useful life of the infrastructure.

Eight years of a Pioneer Institute influenced governor who did not believe in real infrastructure improvements. Everything requiring investments is slow walked as a paper circus.