New England Revolution Stadium | 173 Alford Street | Boston-Everett

Ruairi said:
Eh, saw a bit of that MOU online.
This jumped out

"Parking (and I find this hard to believe). Quoted verbatim for accuracy:Limit their on-site vehicular parking spaces (not including loading docks and similar areas) to 75. A separate agreement between Wynn and the Proponent shall be entered into to disallow overflow stadium parking at either the Encore Boston Harbor or Wynn’s East of Broadway garages. In doing so, Proponent commits to funding a study and subsequent implementation of improved pedestrian infrastructure from the Sullivan Square MBTA Station to the Project Site to ensure protected and efficient access, subject to any relevant local and State approvals and availability of funds."

A 25k stadium with 75 parking spots and no access to the Casino lots? That wouldn't even hit the disabled spots required.
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How many on-site vehicular parking spaces are there at 37,000+ seat Fenway Park? I don't know that the MOA's that crazy to have such tight parking restrictions for the proposed stadium and encouragement for studying/implementing Sullivan Square Station access improvements.
Relative to other high volume landmarks in Boston and arenas/stadiums in other cities, the site really isn't that far from rapid transit access. We're looking at a 12-15-minute walk from Sullivan Square under today's circumstances. Boston Convention & Expo Center is the same distance from South Station; D.C. United's Audi Field is the same distance from Navy Yard & Waterfront Stations. We're building out a walk- and bike-friendly city and region as we speak--the MOA's language and expectations codifies this and should be maintained. There should be no compromise here: more parks, less parking lots.

I'm so sick of beautiful places and vibrant community design being relegated to an opportunity cost summary.
 
dshoost88 said:
How many on-site vehicular parking spaces are there at 37,000+ seat Fenway Park? I don't know that the MOA's that crazy to have such tight parking restrictions for the proposed stadium and encouragement for studying/implementing Sullivan Square Station access improvements.
Relative to other high volume landmarks in Boston and arenas/stadiums in other cities, the site really isn't that far from rapid transit access. We're looking at a 12-15-minute walk from Sullivan Square under today's circumstances. Boston Convention & Expo Center is the same distance from South Station; D.C. United's Audi Field is the same distance from Navy Yard & Waterfront Stations. We're building out a walk- and bike-friendly city and region as we speak--the MOA's language and expectations codifies this and should be maintained. There should be no compromise here: more parks, less parking lots.

I'm so sick of beautiful places and vibrant community design being relegated to an opportunity cost summary.
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I strongly think that they should put this on some land that's next to the Casino. That way, anyone who wants to attend events held there, they can access them though walkways or whatever. Have it next to the Casino & make it a grand spot for sports entertainment & gambling!!! :)
 
dshoost88 said:
How many on-site vehicular parking spaces are there at 37,000+ seat Fenway Park? I don't know that the MOA's that crazy to have such tight parking restrictions for the proposed stadium and encouragement for studying/implementing Sullivan Square Station access improvements.
Relative to other high volume landmarks in Boston and arenas/stadiums in other cities, the site really isn't that far from rapid transit access. We're looking at a 12-15-minute walk from Sullivan Square under today's circumstances. Boston Convention & Expo Center is the same distance from South Station; D.C. United's Audi Field is the same distance from Navy Yard & Waterfront Stations. We're building out a walk- and bike-friendly city and region as we speak--the MOA's language and expectations codifies this and should be maintained. There should be no compromise here: more parks, less parking lots.

I'm so sick of beautiful places and vibrant community design being relegated to an opportunity cost summary.
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This is a brutal 20 minute hike (for an able-bodied person) through unbreathable air across dozens of lanes of urban expressway and then across a bridge with 3 foot wide sidewalks.
 
dshoost88 said:
How many on-site vehicular parking spaces are there at 37,000+ seat Fenway Park? I don't know that the MOA's that crazy to have such tight parking restrictions for the proposed stadium and encouragement for studying/implementing Sullivan Square Station access improvements.
Relative to other high volume landmarks in Boston and arenas/stadiums in other cities, the site really isn't that far from rapid transit access. We're looking at a 12-15-minute walk from Sullivan Square under today's circumstances. Boston Convention & Expo Center is the same distance from South Station; D.C. United's Audi Field is the same distance from Navy Yard & Waterfront Stations. We're building out a walk- and bike-friendly city and region as we speak--the MOA's language and expectations codifies this and should be maintained. There should be no compromise here: more parks, less parking lots.

I'm so sick of beautiful places and vibrant community design being relegated to an opportunity cost summary.
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I'm with you on the sentiment, but I'm a little dubious that a 12-15 minute walk from Sullivan across a windy, exposed river along a highway-style road is a transit connection comparable to Fenway Park.

That said, I'd rather see no parking from the start and see how it goes. They can always get permission to use the casino garages later.

Also, as RandomWalk noted, the MOA doesn't specify that Kraft couldn't build structured parking on another property. Just not this one.
 
dshoost88 said:
How many on-site vehicular parking spaces are there at 37,000+ seat Fenway Park? I don't know that the MOA's that crazy to have such tight parking restrictions for the proposed stadium and encouragement for studying/implementing Sullivan Square Station access improvements.
Relative to other high volume landmarks in Boston and arenas/stadiums in other cities, the site really isn't that far from rapid transit access. We're looking at a 12-15-minute walk from Sullivan Square under today's circumstances. Boston Convention & Expo Center is the same distance from South Station; D.C. United's Audi Field is the same distance from Navy Yard & Waterfront Stations. We're building out a walk- and bike-friendly city and region as we speak--the MOA's language and expectations codifies this and should be maintained. There should be no compromise here: more parks, less parking lots.

I'm so sick of beautiful places and vibrant community design being relegated to an opportunity cost summary.
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Don't get me wrong, I live in East Somerville and love soccer. I'll happily throw my kid up on the bike and head over (tho the thought of riding around that rutherford rotary is always terrifying). I love the idea of a parking free stadium.
I just think that in this case, the Revs have spent almost 30 years building up a suburban fan base. There's no other way than to drive to foxboro on game nights. I think the notion that you can go from driving only to public transit only is a bit mad. Also watch places like the Costco car park get over run? What do we expect the fans from the southern suburbs (presumably most revs fans) to do? Take the commuter rail to south station, the red line to DTX then the orange to sullivan? then a 15 minute hike over the mystic? It'd take ages to get to a game and the whole system is nowhere near reliable to make kick off or catch the last CR train home.

There'll definitely be parking, and there should be. We never had this conversation when the Casino (or its extension) was proposed.
It does all seem a bit like posturing.
 
Yea you make good points. If we had nsrl + regional rail there would be a much stronger argument because our suburban network would be up to par and riders could transfer to orange at north station, but fans coming from the far flung suburbs dont really have the greatest transit options as it stands. Its like congestion pricing, if you first put the alternatives into place then you have a leg to stand on with trying to push ppl towards taking alternate means, but if you just add congestion pricing and dont do any of that other stuff its just a tax on the poor who have no choice but to drive.

We should absolutely be encouraging fans to take transit to get to these games, but in order to make it a viable option we need to be investing in the transit for them to take. I think it should be a reasonable expectation that we could build a garage today, along with making road/bus/ped bridge connections to transit, and in the future as we expand the network we could demolish the garage and redevelop the lot. In practice it could mean we just end up with the garage and no transit, but we need to be serious that were not just going back to the charlie baker status quo on transit and dickin off for 30 years, but I honestly feel like ppl understand that is not a viable strategy anymore.
 
BREAKING: Boston Mayor Michelle Wu openly supports a Revs stadium in Everett and is willing to help the Kraft Group in any which way possible.

Just kidding. Michell Wu basically said that the stadium is a non-starter.

Michelle Wu pulls a Menino.

Basically, for those who ran into the paywall, I’ll summarize. NIMBY Boston Mayor doing NIMBY Boston things. She said that the foot traffic would be coming in from Charlestown. Is there something inside the 128 Corridor that makes these people sick with NIMBYism? The water?

Also, they could agree on the terms of the deal for Migrant Aid. So, no stadium until 2062. Probably.
 
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M.Morgan11 said:
How does Mayor Wu have any say over this project, isn't it entirely in Everett?
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As I said, her spokesperson said that the “foot traffic would be coming entirely from Charlestown.”

In fairness, I expected this to happen. However, I still feel that this project will go through. It might not take until 2062 when the ocean reaches Foxborough? No. However, I don’t see this thing being built within the next 10-20 years.

What I would say, to anyone who is like me (a disappointed idealist), I would give this time. There are going to be groups who will throw a tantrum for a bit. However, I do feel that common sense will prevail in this argument. As someone already mentioned, this is all saber rattling until Kraft gets what he wants. Which he will. It won’t happen overnight and this will get ugly. But it will happen.
 
Maybe it will motivate them to make a better pedestrian experience in Suliven, or they could get the bridge to assembly built and bypass Charlestown entirely. also I for the longest time thought Suliven Square was part of Summerville till I started working there.
 
M.Morgan11 said:
Maybe it will motivate them to make a better pedestrian experience in Suliven, or they could get the bridge to assembly built and bypass Charlestown entirely. also I for the longest time thought Suliven Square was part of Summerville till I started working there.
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I think it will. In fact, I think that the MBTA has included Commuter Rail and Silver Line Stop(s) at SS.

Focus40
 
The pedestrian experience could be completely transformed. Beacham street in Sullivan Sq could be developed into a pedestrian urban mixed use street that brings people from the Sullivan T station to a new pedestrian bridge over the Mystic using the former bridge supports for the pre 1970s orange line to Everett. Then the harborwalk would split to the casino and go under the Alford Street bridge to a new park and ferry dock on the water in front of the new stadium. No need to cross Rutherford Ave or cram into 4' wide sidewalks on the Alford Street bridge.

The MOU between the REVs and Everett notes the new Harborwalk would extend under the Alford Street bridge, so this may already be contemplated.

The new pedestrian bridge would be similar to the new I-195 bridge in Providence.
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kingofsheeba said:
BREAKING: Boston Mayor Michelle Wu openly supports a Revs stadium in Everett and is willing to help the Kraft Group in any which way possible.

Just kidding. Michell Wu basically said that the stadium is a non-starter.

Michelle Wu pulls a Menino.

Basically, for those who ran into the paywall, I’ll summarize. NIMBY Boston Mayor doing NIMBY Boston things. She said that the foot traffic would be coming in from Charlestown. Is there something inside the 128 Corridor that makes these people sick with NIMBYism? The water?

Also, they could agree on the terms of the deal for Migrant Aid. So, no stadium until 2062. Probably.
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In that article, Wu doesn't say the stadium is a non-starter. She doesn't even say she's against it. It says she has concerns and was disappointed Boston wasn't included in discussions, which seems totally fine. Boston is a stakeholder in this project, for lots of reasons, so it's bad that Boston was excluded from these secret negotiations.

One simple reason this affects Boston is it literally borders Boston.* There is a sliver of Boston on the Everett side of the Mystic (see below). When fans walk out of this potential stadium and step onto Alford Street, that's a Boston street. If there are police outside the stadium directing traffic or doing crowd control, those would be Boston Police. If lanes need to be closed to protect pedestrians, that's on Boston. Whatever busses will be running, that's on Boston streets. And if there needs to be major pedestrian upgrades on the Alford bridge, that's all Boston. It's possible that Everett gets the stadium (and new tax revenue), but Boston is stuck handling all the transportation logistics of 25,000 people leaving a game at the same time. So yeah, Boston's mayor ought to have concerns. Mayor Wu would be failing if she didn't.

Look, in this thread I've brought up some concerns about this project, so to be clear, I really do want this to happen. This would be awesome. It could have some unique downsides, but I'm hopeful they're all solvable or can be mitigated. But I can't tell that anyone in charge is looking at those downsides seriously, and that's worrying. So if Wu steps in with her concerns, good for her. Someone needs to.

(The thick red line here shows Boston's border, and the part of Boston on the Everett side that a whole stadium would empty directly onto)
1700224909127.png


*Edit: I was wrong, because it's more than a border. The stadium property is partially in Boston. Thanks @stellarfun . I should have looked more closely at my own map
 
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The agreement between the city of Everett and the Kraft organization states in the very first sentence in the very first paragraph (of the recitals on page one) that the property is situated "partly in the city of Everett and partly in the city of Boston."

And nothing more is said with the respect to the city of Boston, other than improvements to playing fields in Charlestown.

The mayor of Boston has every right to go ballistic.
 
stellarfun said:
The agreement between the city of Everett and the Kraft organization states in the very first sentence in the very first paragraph (of the recitals on page one) that the property is situated "partly in the city of Everett and partly in the city of Boston."

And nothing more is said with the respect to the city of Boston, other than improvements to playing fields in Charlestown.

The mayor of Boston has every right to go ballistic.
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Yup. In fact, the Alford Street address for the site thumbs its nose right in her face... there is no Alford Street in Everett, it becomes Broadway at the border.

The idea that a benefits agreement with Boston would not be required would be insane. Kraft surely has planned to negotiate one the whole time.

FWIW, I believe the Encore as a weird property line to avoid Boston as a host community, though they did negotiate a neighbor community agreement. Background on Boston's thrust into Everett here: https://www.necn.com/news/business/_necn__wynns_everett__or_is_it_boston___casino_necn/65235/

tl;dr: Even in 1649, when this border was drawn, it was about screwing Everett (then Malden) out of money. They should petition the General Court to redraw the boundary at the Mystic.
 
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kingofsheeba said:
BREAKING: Boston Mayor Michelle Wu openly supports a Revs stadium in Everett and is willing to help the Kraft Group in any which way possible.

Just kidding. Michell Wu basically said that the stadium is a non-starter.

Michelle Wu pulls a Menino.

Basically, for those who ran into the paywall, I’ll summarize. NIMBY Boston Mayor doing NIMBY Boston things. She said that the foot traffic would be coming in from Charlestown. Is there something inside the 128 Corridor that makes these people sick with NIMBYism? The water?

Also, they could agree on the terms of the deal for Migrant Aid. So, no stadium until 2062. Probably.
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Not sure I agree with that take on what the article says. The Mayor is right to point out that it will have a large impact on Boston, and the perhaps veiled but clearly there message is that more community benefits need to be offered for Charlestown. That's a reasonable take. As for the legislative impasse, maybe, but it can still be passed this year, it's just easier for one legislative hack to gum up the works.
 
king_vibe said:
This is a brutal 20 minute hike (for an able-bodied person) through unbreathable air across dozens of lanes of urban expressway and then across a bridge with 3 foot wide sidewalks.
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Agreed . . . which is why this is a golden opportunity to leverage the stadium to get (1) a pedestrian bridge connecting Assembly to the casino/stadium (which would be a significantly shorter walk than from Sullivan), and (2) electrification of the Newbury/Rockport line and an infill station that serves this area. Then redevelop the massive strip mall area behind the casino into a mixed-use TOD. If the state plays its cards right, this could end up being a transit win.
 
M.Morgan11 said:
How does Mayor Wu have any say over this project, isn't it entirely in Everett?
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We really need regional planning for exactly this reason. The casino development has had major impacts on traffic in Sullivan Square and the redesign of Rutherford Avenue. Projects that profoundly impact neighboring cities/towns need to be assessed for those impacts and need to mitigate them.

If this stadium is built without parking that seems great. But there is already a lot of parking associated with the casino and a new stadium seems to be begging for more purpose built parking structures, even if they aren't allowed on this parcel (as other's have pointed out).
 
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