New Red and Orange Line Cars

bigeman312 said:
Thank you for the rundown. This is very informative.

This information raises the question: why haven’t headways improved? We allegedly are now able to run 11 trains on the Orange Line, instead of 10. We allegedly have the dispatchers to run 11 trains, instead of 10. Yet, we still have 11-13 minute headways, as we have since the slow zones were implemented last month. Why?
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The slow zones for the Orange Line go back to sometime when the shutdown had just or not too long ended that I know of. The line was supposed to be fixed & updated. Then this damn thing had spread to the other lines like a disease without any cure!! (n)
 
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bigeman312 said:
Thank you for the rundown. This is very informative.

This information raises the question: why haven’t headways improved? We allegedly are now able to run 11 trains on the Orange Line, instead of 10. We allegedly have the dispatchers to run 11 trains, instead of 10. Yet, we still have 11-13 minute headways, as we have since the slow zones were implemented last month. Why?
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Could it just be that with the current speed restrictions in place that headways are maxed out?
 
bakgwailo said:
Could it just be that with the current speed restrictions in place that headways are maxed out?
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I'm not up to doing a full analysis on this right now, but logically, if there is 10% more vehicle and dispatching capacity, then you can decrease the headways, regardless of how slowly the trains are moving between stations. Or is there something I don't understand about speed restrictions (ie some required gap between trains that has already been hit)?
 
HenryAlan said:
I'm not up to doing a full analysis on this right now, but logically, if there is 10% more vehicle and dispatching capacity, then you can decrease the headways, regardless of how slowly the trains are moving between stations. Or is there something I don't understand about speed restrictions (ie some required gap between trains that has already been hit)?
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This is where my thought process is, too. Yet there’s been no improvement on headways:

7A8B09C3-DFEA-4B33-B807-A956D26B063B.jpeg

(Apologies for any quality issues with the image, this is posted from an iPhone aboard a very slow Red Line train)
 
HenryAlan said:
I'm not up to doing a full analysis on this right now, but logically, if there is 10% more vehicle and dispatching capacity, then you can decrease the headways, regardless of how slowly the trains are moving between stations. Or is there something I don't understand about speed restrictions (ie some required gap between trains that has already been hit)?
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Yeah not sure there - other than speed + signaling block length would limit overall TPH/headways. I had thought, for instance, the Harvard curve on the Red limits the entire line to a max of about 3 minute headways (6 on the branches). That said perhaps it's more along the lines of the T trying to build a reserve of rolling stock to at least maintain current headways should any of the new cars (continue) to be break/malfunction requiring them to be out of service. Can think of a few instances recently of dead new trains on the OL.
 
I'm beginning to think that the new OL cars came off the production lines with glitches that kept the T yanking them out of service constantly for one thing to another. That the CRRC probably knew about these problems, yet did nothing fix them. o_O
 
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aycaramba said:
NETransit Roster now lists 84 new orange line cars, up from 78, and there were 11 new sets active this morning, so it seems there has been progress. Would be nice if red line could move up from the 10 cars!
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That's great news!! At least we're getting some more new Oranges!!! :)
 
aycaramba said:
NETransit Roster now lists 84 new orange line cars, up from 78, and there were 11 new sets active this morning, so it seems there has been progress. Would be nice if red line could move up from the 10 cars!
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I saw a test train this morning. Dunno if that counts in the 11 or not.
 
Kinopio said:
I saw a test train this morning. Dunno if that counts in the 11 or not.
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It likely does as the Orange Line has still been experiencing 11 minute non-Sunday (14-minute Sunday) headways. Compare this to the first half of March when there were 10-minute headways even though fewer Orange Line cars had been accepted into service.
 
bigeman312 said:
It likely does as the Orange Line has still been experiencing 11 minute non-Sunday (14-minute Sunday) headways. Compare this to the first half of March when there were 10-minute headways even though fewer Orange Line cars had been accepted into service.
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Now since more new cars have been introduced on the line, I would think that some more of the old Hawkers would be put out to pasture. The Red Line should see more new cars soon, hopefully. :)
 
themissinglink said:
www.bostonherald.com

Chinese contractor submitted unfinished Orange Line cars to MBTA

Problems have continued to plague the production of new Orange and Red Line trains, the latest of which involved the Chinese contractor submitting unfinished cars to the MBTA for final inspection a…
www.bostonherald.com www.bostonherald.com
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So THAT'S why the new cars kept on being yanked from service!! Crappy inspections!! I suspected that something was horribly wrong when the T was having so many blasted problems with the new cars in service!! Along with the fact that it's taking so damn long to complete deliveries of the new vehicles. No wonder things kept on being so screwed up!!!! o_O
 
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Highly doubt that the Orange Line can get to 11 or 12 trainsets unless they operate all cars at once without leaving spares.

The Orange Line is currently running 11.5 - 12 minute headways.
1686755170463.png


There are 10 trainsets in service. this should result in a headway of 9.9 minutes, not 11.6 minutes. This means the slow zones are stretching the headway by 1.7 minutes. (The table below is calculated from pre-slowdown-slowzone-shutdown schedules)
1686755244169.png


If the MBTA fixed ALL the Orange Line slowzones, headways will decrease by 1.7 minutes, to 9.9 mins from 11.6 mins. This is for a 10 trainset schedule.

There are 86 Orange Line cars active. Maximum peak restriction is 78 cars. This means the MBTA could run 78 cars at maximum limit leaving 8 cars left over, a full spare trainset plus 2 more cars.

The T should really just go all out on the Orange Line's slowzones and fix 'em all, then the maximum peak headway achiveable is 7.9 minutes, if they can get 78 of the 86 cars into active service.
 
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Delvin4519 said:
Highly doubt that the Orange Line can get to 11 or 12 trainsets unless they operate all cars at once without leaving spares.

The Orange Line is currently running 11.5 - 12 minute headways.
View attachment 39099

There are 10 trainsets in service. this should result in a headway of 9.9 minutes, not 11.6 minutes. This means the slow zones are stretching the headway by 1.7 minutes. (The table below is calculated from pre-slowdown-slowzone-shutdown schedules)
View attachment 39100

If the MBTA fixed ALL the Orange Line slowzones, headways will decrease by 1.7 minutes, to 9.9 mins from 11.6 mins. This is for a 10 trainset schedule.

There are 86 Orange Line cars active. Maximum peak restriction is 78 cars. This means the MBTA could run 78 cars at maximum limit leaving 8 cars left over, a full spare trainset plus 2 more cars.

The T should really just go all out on the Orange Line's slowzones and fix 'em all, then the maximum peak headway achiveable is 7.9 minutes, if they can get 78 of the 86 cars into active service.
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Still, there is just no excuse whatsoever, as to why the final inspections weren't going right!! I think that the former Baker administration had a lot to do with it. Baker was always babying the T, claiming that they were doing a good job. In the meantime, they were just screwing things up left & right, to the point where the new cars kept on being taken out of service for one thing or the other!! Then at the same time, the T knew that they were having so many problems that they should've stepped in & told CRRC long time ago that enough was enough!! Get the new cars inspected thoroughly, or we won't accept them. Now they are stuck with crappy equipment. The whole idea was to replace the old Hawkers with better railcars. Now because of them not standing their ground, commuters have to put up with delays, broken equipment, slow zones & any other "snowballs" thrown at them! It's just ridiculous! Why the first day back on the job after the shutdown last summer, a new train was having a problem because a door wouldn't stay closed. It had to be removed from service to fix it!! Now, the problems have spread over to the Red Line's new cars like a disease without any cure!! :eek:
 
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Jahvon09 said:
I think that the former Baker administration had a lot to do with it.
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Yes, that's could be a problem...

Jahvon09 said:
Baker was always babying the T....
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...The way you're wording this sounds Baker's mistake is he was too nice to the T. If you want to speculate that's the reason, fine, but I have to express the reason why Baker kept saying the MBTA is doing a good job is because he wanted keep anger the the MBTA and by extension Baker. The MBTA Board is a committee that the governor appoints. They are one who did the approvals and they are not really the MBTA.

I'm not going on full blaming Baker as I don't make such claims without gathering enough evidence to back it even though a lot here would agree. Also to be honest, I think the reality is even more complicated between by the whole mix of different factors. In a way, it's easier to point out actions that would make someone not partially a fault than go through all the actors contribution who some may not intended that way at all.

But I'm not going to roll with that Baker's fault is just babying while the MBTA was freely running lose like the way you rant.
 
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