Potential Soccer Stadium | Portland peninsula

Dr. StrangeHat

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I wonder if a new track could be built on the Back Cove site where the construction is going on now. If the objection to siting the soccer stadium there was not wanting substantial construction over the tanks, well, I don't think you'd need all that much for a track and the practice soccer field could survive in the infield; they certainly don't fill Fitzpatrick even for the Southwesterns or the States (I may be dating myself with that reference to the Southwesterns :) ).
I don't think it will fit there, either. You need a space that is roughly 575' x 260'.
 

PWMFlyer

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They should use the old "racetrack"" at Deering. If know one knows, its the vast amount of land behind the school.
 

Dr. StrangeHat

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They should use the old "racetrack"" at Deering. If know one knows, its the vast amount of land behind the school.
But I think they run into the same issue I mention on the prior page with Payson Park or Dougherty Field in that you lose other recreational uses (in this case, the baseball field behind Deering). I don't think the track should be moved with a net loss of recreational uses. There are only so many fields and spaces available as it is across the area.

For example, In Westbrook we're struggling with scheduling soccer between all the youth and school programs due to a lack of usable fields. It doesn't help that the high school athletic director refuses to let the youth soccer program use the high school fields, and the field behind the middle school was effectively built in a wetland and becomes completely unusable after it rains. And now the City is proposing to replace the outdoor swimming pool down by the river with a new outdoor pool at the community center, which would result in the loss of one of the soccer fields at the community center. I would argue that the soccer field gets more usage over the course of the entire year with spring and summer leagues, in additional to the traditional fall soccer season, than a pool that will operate for three months out of the year, but the City doesn't see that negative trade-off.
 

GIL

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I wonder if a new track could be built on the Back Cove site where the construction is going on now. If the objection to siting the soccer stadium there was not wanting substantial construction over the tanks, well, I don't think you'd need all that much for a track and the practice soccer field could survive in the infield; they certainly don't fill Fitzpatrick even for the Southwesterns or the States (I may be dating myself with that reference to the Southwesterns :) ).
Look back at Post #42 in this thread to read the biggest challenges for the Back Cove site, and then this article in the Herald:
 

Seanflynn78

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UMaine would benefit from playing an annual "home away from home" game at Fitzy each year. I believe the soccer season ends in either August or September.

Once the track is removed this stadium will be the best outdoor stadium in the state. I agree, put the track near at the previous mentioned Back Cove location. Looks like the new design allows future expansion of the stadium if the option becomes necessary. Possible to add another 5k/ second deck. Can't wait to see how well attendance figures are when the soccer team gets going.
 

markhb

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Look back at Post #42 in this thread to read the biggest challenges for the Back Cove site, and then this article in the Herald:
Oh I understand that. My point was that a track-specific field, with room in the middle for the field events and the community soccer fields (aka open lawn) would require very little in the way of stands just due to the low attendance, so they wouldn't be in the way of maintenance. But I also recognize that the track would have to be laid out so that emergency access to the tanks could be had within the infield (not disrupt the pricey track itself).

Edit:
I don't think there's enough room to build a track around Deering's Memorial Stadium.
I checked, and there isn't. You'd be moving Ludlow Street and impeding on Baxter Pines, which is presumably part of the landbank.
 

NR2Portland

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Looking at Providence’s stadium in the works, why wouldn’t Portland go with the waterfront stadium as well? The former fields where the eyesore water project is going on right now would be a gem of a location. Add a large walkway connected to the boulevard with retail and sports bars/restaurants, a parking garage connected to the stadium, and you’re golden. I think the city is really missing an opportunity with the back bay location unless I’m missing something that restricts them from building it there. I love fitzy for what it is, changing it would be a long painful process. Back Bay and Portland deserve a community like this.
 

TC_zoid

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Fitzpatrick has the most room. I would develop it into a combination track/soccer stadium with traditional seats and social bar-like areas at the top and ends. Increase the capacity to 20,000. For a full-sized soccer field, sections of the track could be replaced with turf. Not a big deal. Let them play football at Deering's nice field--football is decreasing in popularity. This way, track could be focused on during the spring, and soccer for the summer and fall (and concerts too). I would also influence USM to "beef up" their track and soccer programs to play here. The school is a short walk away. USM Portland will be where its students want to go when the new dorms and student center opens. The Providence stadium gets it right with the social areas designed on the upper level. I've been going to lots of sports venues in the past year for work, and the big takeaway I get is that most or many fans are concerned or focused with how they enjoy the food and drink options along with the social aspect of it than the actual action itself. They sit or stand in comfy lounges (more revenue for the stadiums) and watch the games on large TV screens, and on occasion will look out the actual openings to see the games or concert. It's certainly the opposite idea of the old Fenway, that's for sure. But it's now our de facto reality. It's why Portland's Cross Arena makeover has become somewhat of a failure. Have you seen the event lineup this year? Pathetic. Embarrassing. The old days were night and day different than now, with the old Mariners teams and top tier music acts appearing. People have changed. A stadium designed on this new idea to experience sports and concerts at the Fitzpatrick location would be a hit. Soccer, track, and concerts all in one place. Build it right and they will come. I've seen that firsthand in over a dozen stadiums and venues.
 

Dr. StrangeHat

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Looking at Providence’s stadium in the works, why wouldn’t Portland go with the waterfront stadium as well? The former fields where the eyesore water project is going on right now would be a gem of a location. Add a large walkway connected to the boulevard with retail and sports bars/restaurants, a parking garage connected to the stadium, and you’re golden. I think the city is really missing an opportunity with the back bay location unless I’m missing something that restricts them from building it there. I love fitzy for what it is, changing it would be a long painful process. Back Bay and Portland deserve a community like this.
As much as I agree on it being a great location, I honestly don't think it fits there. For arguments sake, here is the rough footprint of Fitzpatrick placed over this spot (using the same aspect ratio). You would have to fill in the red hashed section of Back Cove to fit it, and there would be no room for anything else, like the bars, restaurants and parking garage you propose. AND, the stands would be partially over the new stormwater storage tanks. If those tanks ever need to be accessed to be repaired or maintained, you'd have to remove a section of the stands. You could never build a permanent structure over those tanks.

1674672500481.png
 

TC_zoid

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Parking garage? Where? Parking is a real concern. Fitzpatrick area is best because Hadlock seems to function when 7,000 show up for a game. Events would not be scheduled concurrent with Seadog games. The train/bus station could operate shuttles, and maybe even the massive new Maine Med garage would allow for some. I don't think they are filling up all 2,500 spots, are they? Even better, the USM parking garages (new one will be done) which is probably a combined 2,250 spaces? Can you imagine the Hannaford parking lot with a game occurring with 7,000 fans across from it? Portland needs to plan better. Why settle for less when you can have more? It would solve the concert small-capacity problem too (a new Fitzpatrick).
 

markhb

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Hadlock has: the city lots along Fitzpatrick, its own disabled-access lot (the one used during non-game times for the gift shop), plus a deal to use the Maine Med garage on Forest St. (not the big one) and a bunch of small local lots making bank charging for parking. Plus, of course, on-street if you can find it.
 

BosMaineiac

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As much as I agree on it being a great location, I honestly don't think it fits there. For arguments sake, here is the rough footprint of Fitzpatrick placed over this spot (using the same aspect ratio). You would have to fill in the red hashed section of Back Cove to fit it, and there would be no room for anything else, like the bars, restaurants and parking garage you propose. AND, the stands would be partially over the new stormwater storage tanks. If those tanks ever need to be accessed to be repaired or maintained, you'd have to remove a section of the stands. You could never build a permanent structure over those tanks.

View attachment 33450
The city put the kibosh on this location for the reasons you mentioned about the storm water tanks. I doubt they even put provisions in place for a foundation to support a structure, especially one of that size.


Also, this water project is very important to help prevent the frequent flooding in Bayside, which opens that area up for much needed development.
 

DanielPWM19

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I'm still not sure why the EXPO or the Troubh Ice Area can't be demolished to add more space to the area. The EXPO itself is built on top of an old pauper's grave. Those remains were moved to a section in the Western Cemetery and under the walkways there. The Maine Celtics (FKA Red Claws) could use a better stadium to perform at. Heck, why not the Civic Center?
 

Portlander

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Out of the 30 NBA G League venues, the Expo ranks # 26 in seating capacity (3100) ahead of only the Delaware Blue Hens, Greensboro Swarm, Motor City Cruise, Santa Cruz Warriors and the South Bay (CA) Lakers. The General manager of the Maine Celtics told me a few years ago that the Cross Arena (7000 basketball) is to large and there is no way the team could fill it which would limit the fan experience when compared to the intimate feel and up close vibe at the Expo.
 

Dr. StrangeHat

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I'm still not sure why the EXPO or the Troubh Ice Area can't be demolished to add more space to the area. The EXPO itself is built on top of an old pauper's grave. Those remains were moved to a section in the Western Cemetery and under the walkways there. The Maine Celtics (FKA Red Claws) could use a better stadium to perform at. Heck, why not the Civic Center?
Ice time is already at a premium around here. We need three or four more rinks to keep up with demand and provide reasonable ice times for kids just learning the game, not fewer rinks. I'm OK with tearing down Troubh, as long as there is a replacement elsewhere in the city (ideally something like the Norway Savings Arena in Auburn, which has two sheets of ice).
 

DanielPWM19

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Out of the 30 NBA G League venues, the Expo ranks # 26 in seating capacity (3100) ahead of only the Delaware Blue Hens, Greensboro Swarm, Motor City Cruise, Santa Cruz Warriors and the South Bay (CA) Lakers. The General manager of the Maine Celtics told me a few years ago that the Cross Arena (7000 basketball) is to large and there is no way the team could fill it which would limit the fan experience when compared to the intimate feel and up close vibe at the Expo.
Gotcha, I just know some of the Celtics Players who hate the Expo facility and find it embarrassing. ::shrugs::

New Ice arenas can be built, I'm just asking why these two locations haven't been put in a long-term consideration for demolition and replacement. The more space we can provide for Hadlock and the potential Soccer Stadium the better. Things can be planned strategically. Not that Portland is great at strategic planning in any capacity.
 

Dr. StrangeHat

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Getting a little off topic, but a basketball-specific arena for the Maine Celtics, accompanied by an adjoining multi-use development, would fit nicely at the location of the Noyes Self Storage building in Bayside:

1674743623377.png


Alas, people would absolutely lose their minds if you proposed tearing down the Expo. People lost their minds at the thought of tearing down the B&M factory, and that has a lot less personal attachment to many around here compared to the Expo.
 

Seanflynn78

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The problem with building rinks is that they almost always run at a loss- very rarely a profit. Too bad Southern Maine Univ. does not build it's own rink. I think Fitzy's capacity will grow by maybe 2k when it is renovated. I wish Portland could get the Revolution to move up here since the Kraft's can't seem to find a new home for them. The Kraft's want the Rev's to be inside the I-495 corridor. Fitzpatrick might end up being the biggest outdoor stadium in the state once the renovation is complete. I'm sorry but I think the actual capacity for Alfond stadium is around 8500 with standing room bringing it up to 10k.
 

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