Silver Line at 21: Do people like it now?

[Java King]

Do you have access to those engineering drawings?

Maybe "engineering drawings" was a bit too strong. I probably should have said "Detailed Drawings"
They are in the PDF that I attached. Refer to Page #9.

 

[Charlie_mta]

It seems like almost any project the MBTA tackles inevitably gets delayed, so I can only imagine how long a major project they are "gradually" pursuing would take to complete, but confidently not within any of our lifetimes. I'd prefer there just be a firm commitment to completing it within a set period, say within 5 years, with the expectation that it would actually take 10-15.

GLX to Medford only took 75 years.

 

[bigpicture7]

GLX to Medford only took 75 years.

Actually GLX to Medford is precisely the reference model for what this would need to NOT be. The hype machine was revved up and running for decade(s), giving the speculative vultures plenty of time to circle.

The fact that the T sucks doesn't mean we have to assume it "must always suck." There's no point to these what-would-be-a-good-way-to-do-things exercises if a default incoming assumption needs to be that the "T must permanently suck forever" as a non-negotiable input to such exercises. If you think about it, that assumption negates any sort of useful/interesting thought exercise to begin with.

In fact, @Smuttynose is basically proving my point with their complaint (which I agree is valid retrospectively). Precisely because the way the T always operates is: politicians announce BIG PLANs, hold a BIG photo-op ground breaking, then eff up the project and delay the BIG PLANs by a decade, and then finally get things somewhat on track and hold another BIG photo-op....that transit improvements are enabled to be opportunistic gentrification-fests in the first place.

If we are making analogies, the better one would be to the T's "Transformation" programs (Green Line Transformation, Organge Line Transformation, etc). They have been running in the background for several years now. Most of the general public has forgotten about them. Their press releases are as boring as watching paint dry (they usually include photos of wire bundles). In reality (if these projects actually work, which is a separate question) they will result in dramatic headway and net trip time improvements that could transform outlying transit stops from sucky-commute to hidden-gem commute locations. And those living in and moving to those locations will enjoy the benefits of improved transit connectivity without (as much) cost of living/cost of ownership bloat. Can we expand this model from line improvement to line extension or line mode shift model? -- that's the key question, and I actually think we can, or at least that it's worth a shot in trying.

 

[Arborway]

I'm trying to imagine city and state officials riding the SL1 from the airport when it opened. It's by far the most rattily, loud, indigent bus routes I've taken in the city. The little intermission at Silverline Way where the driver has to exit the bus and manually switch the gear at the back feels especially 3rd world. Then the wildly overbuilt seaport tunnel which is (of course) falling apart and has a road surface worse than the Ted Williams somehow.

Was is always this bad?

All I can be sure of is that the pavement was visibly crumbling, uneven as hell, and permanently waterlogged in 2007.

It felt like an ancient piece of infrastructure less than three years after it opened.

If you told me it was paved by a shop class with a few hundred bags of Quikrete, I'd believe you.

 

[as02143]

Given that even the PMT imagined that there would be few net new riders for LRT to Nubian, i.e. the LRT would draw from other buses or the OL, it seems like that's not a particularly efficient investment without some additional land use changes for more density and activity along Washington St.

I think people also forgot that while the SL was an MBTA Route all of the dedicated bus facilities had to be agreed to by the City. The City, its electeds, and really the residents of the then-gentrifying South End are why those bus lanes were designed as overflow parking lanes shared with buses and bikes.

That being said, Boston has seemed to have a major change of heart over the last five years.

The reserved bus lanes need to be moved from the edges of the street (where people illegally park) to the center of the road, similar to the new Columbus Ave Bus Lanes:

These lanes on Columbus Avenue are proof that the City can think better and bigger with the roadway.

What does seem appropriate for planning in the short term is a levelling up of the Silver Line on Washington Street similar to what Charlie_mta says above. If i remember well, the cost was around $10mn for 0.75 miles of Columbus Ave., Or $13-14mn per mile.

Assuming costs haven't changed that dramatically, yet, the SL Washington through the South End and near Tufts is approximately 1.8 miles. That would be around $30 million for a high class center bus way.

I do fear that the worst congestion for buses is actually from Tufts to South Station or Downtown Crossing. I have a friend that lives in the South End and works just at State Street. They usually transfer at Tufts because it's more reliable to connect with the Orange Line despite the connection distance and wait times.

 

[Teban54]

Given that even the PMT imagined that there would be few net new riders for LRT to Nubian, i.e. the LRT would draw from other buses or the OL, it seems like that's not a particularly efficient investment without some additional land use changes for more density and activity along Washington St.

The PMT said there would be few net new riders from a completed Silver Line Phase III with a downtown bus tunnel. Not a fully surface route with tons of congestion from Tufts inbound.

F-Line showed earlier that the PMT ridership estimate was about 2x of SL4/5's current ridership.

 

[JeffDowntown]

If we are making analogies, the better one would be to the T's "Transformation" programs (Green Line Transformation, Organge Line Transformation, etc). They have been running in the background for several years now. Most of the general public has forgotten about them. Their press releases are as boring as watching paint dry (they usually include photos of wire bundles). In reality (if these projects actually work, which is a separate question) they will result in dramatic headway and net trip time improvements that could transform outlying transit stops from sucky-commute to hidden-gem commute locations. And those living in and moving to those locations will enjoy the benefits of improved transit connectivity without (as much) cost of living/cost of ownership bloat. Can we expand this model from line improvement to line extension or line mode shift model? -- that's the key question, and I actually think we can, or at least that it's worth a shot in trying.

Of course none of the T magical "transformation" programs mean squat if the stations are collapsing and the track is in total disarray. (And let's not even get started on our bargain basement CRRC rail cars.)

Basics matter if you are running a complex system like transit. And the T sucks at basics.

 

[bigpicture7]

Of course none of the T magical "transformation" programs mean squat if the stations are collapsing and the track is in total disarray. (And let's not even get started on our bargain basement CRRC rail cars.)

Basics matter if you are running a complex system like transit. And the T sucks at basics.

Fully agree. My post was solely aimed at how to communicate and manage system enhancement/expansion. To your point, It must be concurrently true that the T handles these ongoing "basics" in parallel, but I don't think the need to do so invalidates my suggestions about communicating/managing enhancement and expansion.

 

[JeffDowntown]

Fully agree. My post was solely aimed at how to communicate and manage system enhancement/expansion. To your point, It must be concurrently true that the T handles these ongoing "basics" in parallel, but I don't think the need to do so invalidates my suggestions about communicating/managing enhancement and expansion.

I agree with the value of the communication.

But that communication only works if the basics are being covered. Otherwise it sounds like the T is smearing lipstick on a pig (which they are).