Thinking Of Expanding The Site: Questions

briv

briv

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Guys, Im thinking about expanding the site.

First, Im asking for input on how you, the members, would like to see the site expanded. What sort of site would you like to have? What would you like to see on a site that isnt or cannot be done in a forum based site? I love the wiki, and think its a beautiful thing. Collaboration would be integral in any expansion, I think. Does anyone have any ideas?

Second, Ive really been contemplating a switch from open source phpBB to a commercial software package. I think our current software serves us pretty well, a few serious setbacks, like the the heart-wrenching loss of a year+'s full of posts, aside. But, my major problem with this software is the fact that search engines simply do not spider the forum. So, for instance, if someone is searching for, say, the new Boston ICA building, a search engine will not return a link to the the board. phpBB has a serious problem with search engines, and though I hear there are certain "technical hacks" around this, they're beyond me. Ive tried many and none seem to work. A new phpBB version is due out in maybe 6 months or so, which I understand helps solve this problem, but frankly, Ive become fed up with it.

But I can wait if you can. I believe my main single most important goal administering the board (besides playing whak-a-mole with spammers) is to gain as many voices, aka participating members, as possible. As of now, phpBB isnt doing it.

Which leads to my third question: archBOSTON.com is a site free of advertising of any kind whatsoever and will be as long as I have any say, no matter what. However, if we move beyond open source software to a commercial package like VBulletin, I think I would need a bit of help with the costs. To this point, I have carried all costs involved with hosting and maintaining the site -- and Ive done so with much pleasure. As long as people are compelled to post about Boston's built environment, I will make sure this board, or some version of it, stays up, always. The costs to do so as of now really arent very much (Ive spent more for booze on a Saturday night in Boston--which is sorta saying a lot), especially compared to the great satisfaction I get from simply reading this board. Truth be told, this is the real reason I started archBOSTON: Just to read the posts, to keep them coming, to ensure a lasting forum unencumbered by advertisements, shoddy oversight, etc. But back to the point, commercial software, such as VBulletin for example, would set us back an additional 160 bucks initially and then another $40 a year. For that we'd get customer support, security against a catastrophic incidents like that of a few months back, as well as search engine indexing, which would, I believe, bring new members. With new members there would likely be an increase of bandwidth costs as well. To help pay for this I was thinking of incorporating a donation feature. Of course, all donations and expenses would be utterly transparent. ..and anything over the top would be returned or..I was thinking it could be set aside for some annual member's function (archBOSTON.com awards?) where alcohol and merry making would be involved -- that is, unless you re under 21, in which case you could eat Twinkies, sip soda and watch...just as long you kept quiet.

Please, give me your feedback.
 
I don't really have a preference as long as we still have a basic functional forum. However, I will say it took me a lot of effort to find this forum. I wasn't specifically looking for a forum on architecture in Boston. I was looking for information on all significant development projects around town at a time when they were all news to me (North Point, Waterfront, Boylston Square, etc). Searching around online, I kept stumbling on new projects I hadn't heard of- all this exciting development in Boston- until eventually, and I forget how, I stumbled on this forum, which of course has all the info I was looking for all in one convenient place. So I guess from that experience it would be nice to move to something easier to find via internet searches, so more people would find there way over here. $160 + $40/yr doesn't sound huge for generating traffic, if it really would make that big of a difference. Or maybe we could go on a google bombing mission or wage a campaign to tell everyone around who might be interested to link to us on their website, mention us in their news, etc. But that sounds like a lot of work, which I wouldn't be helping with.

I don't really use the wiki. I've looked through it, but there's just not enough going on there. Any info I want I can find in the forums. It's a nice idea, but I don't see it taking off. But that's just my opinion. Plus we can always just make equivalent pages on wikipedia, which also is more likely to generate traffic. Just looking at the Boston page, there's no section on "architecture in Boston". We should create that page and link to us (plus the other appropriate websites). Just a thought.
 
Donations are a good idea, the old forum ran pretty well off them.
 
First of all, thanks for everything you done here already, especially after the crash. A lot of admins would thrown up their hands and said "Fuck it!" So thanks for hanging in and bringing it back.

I think the commercial software is a must. I never realized this place wasn't indexed. That explains why it seems so slow compared to other forums. It will be great to get more traffic and more voices here. The only downside I can think of is that by indexing the site you will be sort of opening this forum up to the pubic, and despite the occasional flare-ups we tend to be a somewhat like-minded, congenial group. So along with other build- friendly folks who will hopefully be joining our ranks we will also be getting more cranks, trolls and punks. So despite your (well founded) reluctance to censor the group, it may become necessary just to keep order. We will probably see lots and lots of NIMBYs as they tend to be interested in the same projects we are but with different intentions. If they sign up in large enough numbers they may change the dynamic of the board. I guess you can cross that bridge when you get to it.
The only other problem I could see is catching the attention of the Globe and Herald and them squawking about us cribbing their work.
But on the whole I think it is a great idea and I doubt the money will be an issue.

As for what to do about the main site there are a few options.
You could do an 'open blog' sort of thing where members post rants and options about Boston's built environment. I don't know if you would get enough participation though. Hardly enough people post in the forums as it is and even places with large memberships like Cyburbia are begging people to write for their main page.

One thing that I think is a must is using the photo of the day on the main page. There are already enough photos on the forum to keep you going for months. I think that should be a centerpiece of the main page.

You could go the old school portal route and just provide links to different Boston built environment sites like The City Record, Vanshnookenraggen.com and The Boston Real Estate Blog. The only problem is that those are the only examples I can think of. There may be enough out there to make it work.

I don't know how much back-end work it would take to integrate the wiki with your site. If it means moving/reformatting everything, that would be a pretty big task. I like the idea of using the real wiki, but some of the editors over there can be real strict about format and content, even if they don't care about the subject, so we would have to deal with that.

Everything you have done so far have been A+ work, so I'm not too concerned about whatever direction you decide to take the site. Thanks again.
 
I'm very much happy with the way we are right now, and would have no problem waiting for the new version of phbb
 
Some of what I've written has already been covered. I'd like to see a front page which gives more information about the contents inside. The rotating picture of the day, front page blog posts, listing the hottest current topics--all of these would be a good selling tool for the site. And sure, put a link to the City Record on the front page by all means!

I would give users the opportunity to create blogs on the site. It is unclear to me how popular such a feature might be, given how easy it is to create a blog using Blogger or Typepad or whatever other platform comes to mind--if I can do it, anyone can--but it might be worth a shot if it doesn't come at the expense of people contributing to the message board threads. Universal Hub is a good example of site which has both blogs and message boards.

I would have a more prominent section for user created images to allow users to post photo albums independent of the threads--too many images just lay buried in the threads.

I would crackdown on the posting of copyrighted material in the fora themselves. As a content producer I always get a little touchy when I see entire newspaper articles reproduced in the threads.

I would think about some sort of partnership/cross promotion with Architecture Boston--creating an Architecture Boston forum for example, to discuss articles and issues raised in the magazine.

Get Google to crawl the threads by whatever means necessary. There is too much good information inside the forum that doesn't see the light of day--judging from the Google searches I get at the City Record there is a lot of demand for this type of material.
 
I don't mind poneying up some dough so that the site gets indexed even though i've become much more of a lurker and not a poster.

Considering how much time I actually spend on this forum, throwing down cash really isn't an issue.

I'm sure the quality of the board will increase exponentially. With this though, will come the necessity to police the hell out of it... which is a substantial time consumer for you briv.

Count me in though
 
Those sums of money should be easy to get from the long time posters.... I'll certainly contribute even though I don't live here any more. You can add a "sister city" SFO section... :)

I agree about moderation. So many otherwise enjoyable fora are turned into mindless politcal rant fests that this one is nice to visit.
 
I say we add a sport section into the forum. I know it's archboston meaning buildings but hey who knows. It may one day be turn into the forum for the whole city of Boston and New England.
 
I have nothing particularly new to add, but here's my two cents.

First, like has been said, we could use a more active front page, whereas the current one is more or less a launching pad to elsewhere. Putting the photo of the day, blogs, and the biggest current issues are a good start to it. About the blogs, I think it's a good option to have, but personally speaking I know I will be an infrequent contributer at best.. my thoughts are oftentimes tough to get down into a coherent form without spending 6 hours on a 6 paragraph post. And we should definitely get a dedicated photo section, be it on the front page or in the forum itself, because like CityRecord said, they end up scattered all over the place.

By all means we should get indexed and get on the Vbulletin software -- there are certain characteristics of this platform that irk the hell out of me -- and I'm all for donating. This, along with making us be known to the Architecture Boston folks will do wonders to getting this site more alive. To echo Quadratdackel, it took me 6 months after I moved here to find this place, and I started looking from almost the minute I arrived.

And about getting more people here, we will need heavy policing, and perhaps the dynamic of the board will change, but that's something I look forward to. Over at Wired New York, a site which I believe attracts a bit more of the general (non-architecturally minded) population than AB does, the NIMBYs have hardly infiltrated the site, and those that do get an earful if they show their true colors (there's nothing like a NIMBY smackdown by Ablarc!).

Also, I agree with what others have said on the wiki. As it currently stands, it's perfectly fine, and I know The Bostonian, among others, have put a lot of effort into it, but right now it feels like it's in an embryonic state of sorts. Some kind of maturation needs to happen, although I have no clue what that means, since I'm more or less illiterate when it comes to that kind of stuff.

DarkFenX's suggestion of a sports section is a good idea, but I think at this point it should perhaps share a sub forum with general news and politics, that being separate from the "general" sub forum. At least for the foreseeable future, I'd want to stay fairly true to the name of the forum and keep this site based around architecture/ development/ infrastructure/ transit ect.

Oh, one last note, it might be worth it to throw a link up, now or in the future, to Skyscraper Guy's page. I don't know what caused the move since I wasn't around then, but his place has really died down over the past year or two, and the old forum over there has lots of valuable information. I know when I stumbled upon it back in July of this year, I spent the next two or three days going back and reading everything, getting up on what had been going on in the city since the turn of the millenium. Before that for instance, I had no clue that the Hotel Commonwealth, a building I walk by quite often, was the cause of such commotion.

But that brings up a question -- did the old forum disappear? I can't seem to access it. To lose a years worth of material here and then 4 years over there is rather disheartening.
 
I don't think we want to scare or drive away NIMBYs. This site will be more interesting when it has a greater diversity of viewpoints.
 
No, the point of confronting a NIMBY isn't to scare them away, rather it's to educate them on the fact that they don't own the view they currently have out their windows, or that just because a building is more than 11 stories tall, it isn't inherently a bad thing. And when I use the word NIMBY, I use it in a derogatory manner, referring to those who have no interests other than their own.

People with a legitimate concern (let's call them "Community Activists" rather than "self absorbed whining NIMBYs"), such as those who are putting up a fight against the Suffolk dorm tower, have exactly that -- a legitimate concern, and should be welcomed here with open arms.

And even then, we all know Ablarc wouldn't smack someone down without a damn good reason to :D
 
DowntownDave said:
I agree about moderation. So many otherwise enjoyable fora are turned into mindless politcal rant fests that this one is nice to visit.
Click to expand...
I'm not sure if more traffic would necessarily be a hoarde of ruffians. Architecture might just be a topic people don't get so hot and bothered over in forums. But this is the only arch forum I look at. For those that are in other forums, how's the civility situation there?

I definately agree that this forum's civility is a central attraction. I wouldn't be here otherwise. Yes, we do have the occasional flame war, but usually random members jump in to calm things down, so maybe we could be self-moderating instead of having designated moderators.

A while back I was a moderator for the now-defunct Dean Issues Forum, which hosted a discussion of policy issues, mostly with people active in the Dean presidential campaign. In order to keep things civil, we actually required people post under their real names. The no anonymity thing has its disadvantages, but it certainly kept the flame level low and the quality of discussion high, which is a refreshing rarity in online political discussions.

Incidentally, when the guy running the DIF stopped hosting it (out of his pocket), we lost all the content we had up there. A lot of great writing was gone. I really wish I had some of that. So for this forum, if there's any way of periodically archiving the entire site, that would be great, because there's a lot of good content here that we'd rather not lose, which we know all too well after the site crash we had.
 
quadratdackel said:
DowntownDave said:
A while back I was a moderator for the now-defunct Dean Issues Forum, which hosted a discussion of policy issues, mostly with people active in the Dean presidential campaign.
Click to expand...


"Not only are we going to New Hampshire, Tom Harkin, we're going to South Carolina and Oklahoma and Arizona and North Dakota and New Mexico! We're going to California and Texas and New York! And we're going to South Dakota and Oregon and Washington and Michigan! And then we're going to Washington, D.C. to take back the White House, BBBYeeeeeaaaaaah!"
Click to expand...
 
^ I saw Dean when he spoke at Copley Square, and by then he was already on the crazed side. I think he just liked working the crowd like that. Made me feel awkward though. I saw him speak at a small gathering much earlier, and he was calm and intelligent- much better. Message to those running for office: composure is a good thing. Ditto to those posting to internet forums, but I think we already know that.
 
and message I learned from this last primary: Negative ads make you lose.
 
Nice to see the PayPal button up. Unfortunately I get an error message when I click on it. :(
 
I think I fixed the Paypal link. I tried to incorporate it into the board so that the amount collected and the donors would be listed, but it didnt work. Thats where those errors were coming from Statler. But I like the idea of the donors being listed and Im thinking about maybe just recording them in a sticky in one of the threads. So if anyone contributes, please send me an email or IM with your forum ID so I can put in the thread. Also, if you plan to donate, please keep the donation to just a few bucks, nothing crazy.

In the meantime, I'll be checking out different software packages for the redesign. Before I do anything I'll run it by the board of course.

Thanks guys.
 
What is up with paypal? Long time users have to sign up for a new account and they require far more information than they need to know.

If you have a PO Box I`ll send a check but them asking for your SS# and PIN etc...is crazy.
 
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