Waterside Place 1A | 505 Congress Street | Seaport
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KentXie
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Re: Waterside Place
I personally don't mind having a mall here but I think it is counter productive because it will be vying for customers with Faneuil Hall which is a 10 minute walk away and DTX further down. They have to make it something unique.
I personally don't mind having a mall here but I think it is counter productive because it will be vying for customers with Faneuil Hall which is a 10 minute walk away and DTX further down. They have to make it something unique.
lexicon506
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Re: Waterside Place
Waterfront project is scaled back
Facing weak economy, developer plans more apartments, fewer stores
By Casey Ross, Globe Staff | August 28, 2009
Developer John E. Drew, facing stiff economic headwinds, is scaling back plans for a massive urban shopping center on the South Boston Waterfront and will shift to building more residences, which are seen as easier to finance.
Drew said yesterday that the revisions will help him proceed with construction of $600 million Waterside Place, which was originally planned to include a 640,000-square-foot retail center, a 19-story condominium building, and a 300-room hotel. He said plans for the retail building are still being discussed, but will probably include mostly apartments, with a smaller number of stores.
?The large retail mall concept is not workable in this environment,?? said Drew, president of Drew Co. ?And it?s not just a question of the moment, but it?s something that?s going to stay this way for a while. We?ve got to think about the development in a different way.??
His project, on 10.3 acres known as the core block, between Summer and Congress streets, received city approval in June 2007 but has been delayed by a legal dispute between financial partners over cost increases and the sharp downturn in the economy.
The legal issues were resolved last fall, when Drew and Vornado Realty Trust bought out the interests of Maxx Private Investments, an entity that includes Kraft Group LLC, led by New England Patriots owner Robert Kraft and Edward A. Fish.
But the broader economic woes have persisted, and large retailers, especially, are loath to open new stores during a period of shaky consumer demand.
Drew has been working to revise the plan with officials at the Massachusetts Port Authority, which designated him to redevelop the property in 2004.
The land stretches over the Massachusetts Turnpike and MBTA property; most of it is owned by Massport.
A top official with the authority said he supports the shift toward more residences because of the difficulty of opening vibrant new retail stores during the recession.
?Trying to build something that?s not consistent with the current to mid-term economic environment is a fruitless exercise,?? said Lowell Richards, chief development officer for Massport. ?I don?t think the project will be dramatically different, but there will be a significant change in emphasis.??
Drew said he still intends to build some stores, including a supermarket and a pharmacy, which are needed to serve residents in the growing neighborhood. But he said the stores will be spread throughout the development, instead of being concentrated in a three-story shopping center.
Drew also said he will probably reduce the size of the 19-story condominium building and convert the units to apartments.
A 300-room hotel and a large parking garage are still included in the development plan.
Any changes would need to be approved by the Boston Redevelopment Authority. The authority?s director, John Palmieri, said he has not had any discussions with Drew about the revisions.
?This is a substantial project that generally met with a lot of support in its current form,?? Palmieri said. ?So now for Mr. Drew to consider a significant change requires that he present to us an amended proposal. We?ll need to get the community to weigh in.??
Drew said he is still working on the proposal and intends to present a revised version in the fall.
His neighbors on the South Boston Waterfront said they are eager to see development move forward, but only if it fits with larger plans for the area.
?We?re obviously interested in what happens on the site,?? said James Rooney, executive director of the Massachusetts Convention Center Authority, whose largest facility is across the street from Drew?s project site.
?The development of the waterfront is a key component for us,?? he said. ?We need more hotels, retail stores, and restaurants. It?s OK that it?s not happening as quickly as we?d like, but those things are going to be critical to our success in the long term.??
Casey Ross can be reached at cross@globe.com.
Ask and you shall receive!!Justin7 said:
Waterfront project is scaled back
Facing weak economy, developer plans more apartments, fewer stores
By Casey Ross, Globe Staff | August 28, 2009
Developer John E. Drew, facing stiff economic headwinds, is scaling back plans for a massive urban shopping center on the South Boston Waterfront and will shift to building more residences, which are seen as easier to finance.
Drew said yesterday that the revisions will help him proceed with construction of $600 million Waterside Place, which was originally planned to include a 640,000-square-foot retail center, a 19-story condominium building, and a 300-room hotel. He said plans for the retail building are still being discussed, but will probably include mostly apartments, with a smaller number of stores.
?The large retail mall concept is not workable in this environment,?? said Drew, president of Drew Co. ?And it?s not just a question of the moment, but it?s something that?s going to stay this way for a while. We?ve got to think about the development in a different way.??
His project, on 10.3 acres known as the core block, between Summer and Congress streets, received city approval in June 2007 but has been delayed by a legal dispute between financial partners over cost increases and the sharp downturn in the economy.
The legal issues were resolved last fall, when Drew and Vornado Realty Trust bought out the interests of Maxx Private Investments, an entity that includes Kraft Group LLC, led by New England Patriots owner Robert Kraft and Edward A. Fish.
But the broader economic woes have persisted, and large retailers, especially, are loath to open new stores during a period of shaky consumer demand.
Drew has been working to revise the plan with officials at the Massachusetts Port Authority, which designated him to redevelop the property in 2004.
The land stretches over the Massachusetts Turnpike and MBTA property; most of it is owned by Massport.
A top official with the authority said he supports the shift toward more residences because of the difficulty of opening vibrant new retail stores during the recession.
?Trying to build something that?s not consistent with the current to mid-term economic environment is a fruitless exercise,?? said Lowell Richards, chief development officer for Massport. ?I don?t think the project will be dramatically different, but there will be a significant change in emphasis.??
Drew said he still intends to build some stores, including a supermarket and a pharmacy, which are needed to serve residents in the growing neighborhood. But he said the stores will be spread throughout the development, instead of being concentrated in a three-story shopping center.
Drew also said he will probably reduce the size of the 19-story condominium building and convert the units to apartments.
A 300-room hotel and a large parking garage are still included in the development plan.
Any changes would need to be approved by the Boston Redevelopment Authority. The authority?s director, John Palmieri, said he has not had any discussions with Drew about the revisions.
?This is a substantial project that generally met with a lot of support in its current form,?? Palmieri said. ?So now for Mr. Drew to consider a significant change requires that he present to us an amended proposal. We?ll need to get the community to weigh in.??
Drew said he is still working on the proposal and intends to present a revised version in the fall.
His neighbors on the South Boston Waterfront said they are eager to see development move forward, but only if it fits with larger plans for the area.
?We?re obviously interested in what happens on the site,?? said James Rooney, executive director of the Massachusetts Convention Center Authority, whose largest facility is across the street from Drew?s project site.
?The development of the waterfront is a key component for us,?? he said. ?We need more hotels, retail stores, and restaurants. It?s OK that it?s not happening as quickly as we?d like, but those things are going to be critical to our success in the long term.??
Casey Ross can be reached at cross@globe.com.
AmericanFolkLegend
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Re: Waterside Place
THat hurts the BCEC. From what I understand they were really pushing for a retail center within walking distance. Hopefully makes for a more liveable, vibrant SBW though.
THat hurts the BCEC. From what I understand they were really pushing for a retail center within walking distance. Hopefully makes for a more liveable, vibrant SBW though.
Re: Waterside Place
This is a smart move....hopefully the residential units are semi-affordable
Large scale retail development at this point would be a self-annihilation
That sector is going to be stagnant for a long long time....
This is a smart move....hopefully the residential units are semi-affordable
Large scale retail development at this point would be a self-annihilation
That sector is going to be stagnant for a long long time....
Padre Mike
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Re: Waterside Place
Great news. This offers the opportunity for a more vibrant street-life in the district and keeps people from losing themselves in a hermetically-sealed world apart from the rest of the city. We don't need another Copley Place. Hopefully rents in new buildings will be reasonable enough for a variety of independent retailers and restaurants to be peppered throughout the district.
Great news. This offers the opportunity for a more vibrant street-life in the district and keeps people from losing themselves in a hermetically-sealed world apart from the rest of the city. We don't need another Copley Place. Hopefully rents in new buildings will be reasonable enough for a variety of independent retailers and restaurants to be peppered throughout the district.
Ron Newman
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Re: Waterside Place
I don't mind seeing a supermarket here, but the North End and Beacon Hill folks will not be happy if one opens here before it does in the Bulfinch Triangle.
(isn't this over near the Convention Center and World Trade Center? That's not a 10-minute walk from Faneuil Hall, not even a 10-minute jog.)
I don't mind seeing a supermarket here, but the North End and Beacon Hill folks will not be happy if one opens here before it does in the Bulfinch Triangle.
(isn't this over near the Convention Center and World Trade Center? That's not a 10-minute walk from Faneuil Hall, not even a 10-minute jog.)
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Re: Waterside Place
Seriously creepy. Does Vornado have a spy here?
Great news, though. The thought of a mall here made me die a little, but a grocery store will be much needed. The more residential the better.
Seriously creepy. Does Vornado have a spy here?
Great news, though. The thought of a mall here made me die a little, but a grocery store will be much needed. The more residential the better.
KentXie
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Re: Waterside Place
The SBW should still be an entertainment district. I wouldn't mind if they put a few clubs and maybe, dare I say it, a small red light district. But I doubt it will happen. If you want to put some night life in Boston, make it here and bring in some clubs.
The SBW should still be an entertainment district. I wouldn't mind if they put a few clubs and maybe, dare I say it, a small red light district. But I doubt it will happen. If you want to put some night life in Boston, make it here and bring in some clubs.
JohnAKeith
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Re: Waterside Place
Mr Drew says he'd be building mostly apartments. The condos, I think, would run in the $800 - $1,000 per square foot range. Even at a much-lower price, $600 per square foot only gets you a 600-square foot one-bedroom home for $600,000. I wouldn't expect any new construction in the city to be any lower than that unfortunately.
Mr Drew says he'd be building mostly apartments. The condos, I think, would run in the $800 - $1,000 per square foot range. Even at a much-lower price, $600 per square foot only gets you a 600-square foot one-bedroom home for $600,000. I wouldn't expect any new construction in the city to be any lower than that unfortunately.
AmericanFolkLegend
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Re: Waterside Place
John, I'm not following your math. $600 psf gets you a 600 SF home for $360K.
John, I'm not following your math. $600 psf gets you a 600 SF home for $360K.
JohnAKeith
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Re: Waterside Place
Oh, right.
I dunno. Things will be expensive, there.
Oh, right.
I dunno. Things will be expensive, there.
Re: Waterside Place
That's not bad for an apartment this close to downtown, assuming the area stops sucking.
That's not bad for an apartment this close to downtown, assuming the area stops sucking.
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Re: Waterside Place
That's not enough to justify the rents they dream of charging.
That's not enough to justify the rents they dream of charging.
JohnAKeith
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Re: Waterside Place
I was off on my math. While there may be a couple units in the $400,000's, my expectation is that it would be similar to the other new construction, although perhaps a sliver less. Not Clarendon or 45 Province prices ($1,000 per square foot) but over half a million for a one-bed. Just a guess.
I was off on my math. While there may be a couple units in the $400,000's, my expectation is that it would be similar to the other new construction, although perhaps a sliver less. Not Clarendon or 45 Province prices ($1,000 per square foot) but over half a million for a one-bed. Just a guess.
Re: Waterside Place
I would never pay that much unless there was a real transit option to the SBW....of course my priorities are different than most, so perhaps that's not out of the question.
The leather district runs about $450-$650 psf (depending on the product), and in my opinion is a superior location for loft syle living, but I guess I can appreciate that many would consider it a bit sketchy, and would prefer to live in a newly manufactured neighborhood. Suburbia for the city.....with planting strips?
I would never pay that much unless there was a real transit option to the SBW....of course my priorities are different than most, so perhaps that's not out of the question.
The leather district runs about $450-$650 psf (depending on the product), and in my opinion is a superior location for loft syle living, but I guess I can appreciate that many would consider it a bit sketchy, and would prefer to live in a newly manufactured neighborhood. Suburbia for the city.....with planting strips?