[ARCHIVED] Harbor Garage Redevelopment | 70 East India Row | Waterfront | Downtown

Status
Not open for further replies.
Re: The Boston Arch (Aquarium parking garage)

stellarfun said:
Applying the same logic you do to Fallon, Chiofaro is finished if he can't find a tenant for a building that he has yet to build.

Chiofaro's problem is that the number of corporate HQ of big Boston-based companies who are looking for trophy space now or in the future is ZERO. There is a certain developer, as friendly with the mayor as Don is not, who concedes he can't find anyone willing to lease in the trophy space building -- much smaller than the Harbor Garage project
Click to expand...


Agree with the same logic with Fallon. Possibly a Jet Blue would have a better feel for Fan Pier area than Chiofaro's Aquarium Project.

The reality to both projects right now is Fallon is stuck 115Million and the costs to the 1st building of the Fan Pier. Fan Pier has no foot traffic at all.

I think Chiofaro's development IMHO will attract a law firm or sometype of investment banking firm if built. Remember the Aquarium area has more foot traffic than Faniuel Hall with endless possibilities of the Greenway transforming into something of beauty. But this reality is still a far off.

tobyjug said:
As amusing as this controversy is, I can't get too worked up. It's cheaper to buy buildings than it is to build them. How will any developer get financing to build something at 650 feet, never mind 500 , 400, 250, pick any number you like.
Click to expand...

Toby, I think somebody said it on this board Chiofaro will build when he finds a major tenant. I agree buying buildings these days are cheaper for most investors but location is key for real estate. It seems the developer is building momentum with the press which is giving him free advertisment to attract a major tenant if the plan gets approved.
 
Re: The Boston Arch (Aquarium parking garage)

itchy said:
IP's nothing to scoff at -- between One International Place and Two International Place, he built the tallest buildings in the city in the 1980s and 1990s, respectively.
Click to expand...


I know everybody has different taste. But when I think of Boston I think of IP and Rowes Wharf. I never think of the Prudential.

I think IP looks great in the Boston skyline.
 
Re: The Boston Arch (Aquarium parking garage)

Calling the new rendering of his proposed waterfront development a "message to City Hall," Don Chiofaro asked the dazzled reporters at his 8AM press conference to "view these four amazing towers like fingers on an outstretched hand." Although the towers are angled towards City Hall, Chiofaro also reminded reporters that these towers will be highly visible from the airport and the water - "reminding the pioneers who land on our shores in search of opportunity what the values of this city truly stand for."

278591689_d1cbfbc1bd.jpg
Click to expand...

:)
 
Re: The Boston Arch (Aquarium parking garage)

I suggest knocking down the Harbor Towers and putting the originally proposed tower in their place.

Then, knock down the garage and put up a Wendys. I hear their fish sandwiches are good.
 
Re: The Boston Arch (Aquarium parking garage)

TheRifleman said:
Toby, I think somebody said it on this board Chiofaro will build when he finds a major tenant. I agree buying buildings these days are cheaper for most investors but location is key for real estate. It seems the developer is building momentum with the press which is giving him free advertisment to attract a major tenant if the plan gets approved.
Click to expand...

That's certainly a creative harpoon! Why not. The prey is scarce, and what else is there to do these days.
 
Re: The Boston Arch (Aquarium parking garage)

Pol: Why snub Chiofaro plan?
Says city needs towers? added taxes
By Thomas Grillo
Tuesday, April 13, 2010


As the Hub faces closing libraries, a Boston city councilor wants to know why the Menino administration is blocking construction of a pair of waterfront towers that could deliver millions in real estate taxes.

?Why is the city turning its nose up at all this potential tax revenue?? asked John Tobin of West Roxbury. ?I will call the Boston Redevelopment Authority director before the council and ask him what is preventing the city from moving this project forward.?

The city could avoid closing library branches if the BRA moved swiftly to approve the Chiofaro Co.?s plans to replace the Harbor Garage with a $1 billion project adjacent to the New England Aquarium, Tobin said.

Under the proposal, which has met strong opposition from Mayor Thomas M. Menino - who called the project a ?stairway to heaven? - the seven-story parking garage would be replaced with a 40-story office tower and a 59-story condominium and hotel skyscraper that would generate $18 million in annual real estate taxes.

But Menino dismissed Tobin?s idea. ?This is not just about money, it?s about planning a city,? Menino told the Herald. ?We have to balance what we?re doing. What about the people who abut the property? What do they want? Ask the environmentalists. Those are all things to take into consideration when doing development. We are not into harebrained ideas.?

But Tobin, who said he recently had lunch with Donald Chiofaro, the company?s president, said all he is asking for are answers to questions.

John Palmieri, the BRA director, said he called Chiofaro last week to make it clear to him that the ball is in their court. ?Last July, we identified things they needed to respond to, and we are waiting for them,? he said. ?We want to do development, but the right kind of development and we take this responsibility very seriously.?

In March, BRA officials unveiled new height guidelines for the Rose Fitzgerald Kennedy Greenway that would limit the height to modest-size buildings near the waterfront and skyscrapers in the Financial District. For the Chiofaro property, height is capped at 200 feet or about 20 stories.

But at that height, Chiofaro has said, the project does not make economic sense.


Link
 
Re: The Boston Arch (Aquarium parking garage)

I guess the greater good to Menino to not having shadows is more important than keep libraries open.

How about looking which cause more good? A few dozen people who will lose their views or the thousands that will be negatively affect by the loss of 4 libraries. Great city planning there. He should play SimCity.
 
Re: The Boston Arch (Aquarium parking garage)

This is not just about money, it?s about planning a city,
Click to expand...

Fine. You're planning a city. Chiofaro's original proposal works pretty damn well if you're a planning a city.

We have to balance what we?re doing. What about the people who abut the property? What do they want? Ask the environmentalists. Those are all things to take into consideration when doing development. We are not into harebrained ideas.
Click to expand...

&#%@&!

If enough people are paying attention, this could be the beginning of a losing battle for Menino. People should start calling him out after reading things like this.
 
Re: The Boston Arch (Aquarium parking garage)

Guys, John Tobin is a person we should all get a hold of. He is a legit person to help our cause. B/c in the context of budget cuts to not only libraries, but also programs for at-risk youth, the BRA has no logic in this case. Easily more Boston residents would benefit from the extra tax money than would be negatively affected (and the negative effects are pretty questionable to begin with). The BRA would loose a public battle on this one. I'm going to try to find his email, write to him and try to encourage him to get more city politicians on his side.
 
Re: The Boston Arch (Aquarium parking garage)

We have to balance what we?re doing. What about the people who abut the property? What do they want? Ask the environmentalists. Those are all things to take into consideration when doing development. We are not into harebrained ideas.
Click to expand...

any environmentalist with an IQ over 60 would support this tower. Shadows DO NOT equal the environment.
 
Re: The Boston Arch (Aquarium parking garage)

This Tobin seems to actually know what the city's interests are.

He wasn't quoted extensively in that article, but given what he did say, he doesn't appear to be instinctively anti-business (unless that business kowtows to him), he doesn't demonize land owners and developers who don't sign up for his agenda, he doesn't necessarily shun investment from people he has personal grudges against, and he appears interested in maximizing the city's tax revenues.

In other words, he doesn't actively thwart the city's interests in the name of "the people."

Think he could run successfully for mayor?
 
Re: The Boston Arch (Aquarium parking garage)

The City of Boston is the 2nd largest employer in Boston. That in itself almost guarantees the incumbent reelection.
 
Re: The Boston Arch (Aquarium parking garage)

ant8904 said:
I guess the greater good to Menino to not having shadows is more important than keep libraries open.
Click to expand...

No shadow or library problems in the Dark Ages. Lots of open space, though.
 
Re: The Boston Arch (Aquarium parking garage)

Lurker said:
The City of Boston is the 2nd largest employer in Boston. That in itself almost guarantees the incumbent reelection.
Click to expand...

Who is the first? Looks like we are heading for a depression people.

God help us with these incumbents.
 
Re: The Boston Arch (Aquarium parking garage)

Get the damn college kids to vote. How many of them could possibly support Menino? Damn Harvard and MIT for being in Cambridge, I bet every one of them would vote against Mumbles. Menino will definitely not be back in office next time around, so long as someone has the balls to really fight against him, not be radical, and rally the grow but disjointed majority that wouldn't support Hizzonah if they knew how he screwed the city.
 
Re: The Boston Arch (Aquarium parking garage)

tobyjug said:
No shadow or library problems in the Dark Ages. Lots of open space, though.
Click to expand...

Menino's new slogan for Boston could be "Open Space with a Speed Limit".
 
Re: The Boston Arch (Aquarium parking garage)

kennedy said:
Get the damn college kids to vote. How many of them could possibly support Menino? Damn Harvard and MIT for being in Cambridge, I bet every one of them would vote against Mumbles. Menino will definitely not be back in office next time around, so long as someone has the balls to really fight against him, not be radical, and rally the grow but disjointed majority that wouldn't support Hizzonah if they knew how he screwed the city.
Click to expand...

I don't know if college kids would help from the point of view of improving governance. A large part of governance is keeping one's house in order. The Greek notion that formed much of our conception about keeping our houses in order was oikonomos, the man in charge of household affairs. Since in Ancient Greece a man's role in household affairs was basically the household's finances (Homer wasn't too handy with the dishwasher), that word remains in modern languages as "economics" (or whatever variant of the English-language version other languages have).

The point being, I don't know if saying, "Let the college kids vote Plato's Republic into being" is a great solution.

College students are largely, though not entirely, people who are basically transient and do not necessarily have any vested, long-term interest in the city; who are not paying any taxes -- and thus have no skin in the game or disincentive against, e.g., lavish benefits being granted to, oh, students; ... and who are drunk half the time (speaking from personal experience).

Call me Habermas, but the best governance comes when you have a large middle class with an interest in good schools, solid-and-predictable-but-not-bank-breaking services, and some basic sense of the city's household affairs -- meaning they're affluent enough to pay income taxes but aren't too rich to not be sensitive to the city's economic situation (i.e., they're middle class). I don't have the stats and I'm sure someone will have some bone to pick with this, but Boston's population is largely rich, poor or student. I don't know how well that's ever going to bode for governance ... especially when, as Lurker says, the deepest interest for many of them is in preserving, but expanding, the political status quo.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Back
Top