[ARCHIVED] Harbor Garage Redevelopment | 70 East India Row | Waterfront | Downtown

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Re: The Boston Arch (Aquarium parking garage)

He'd certainly lose the opportunity to build an urban project in an urban context. The urban environment needs to be manufactured on the South Boston waterfront; it's essentially across the street from the garage site.

He'd also lose 400'-500' of height.
 
Re: The Boston Arch (Aquarium parking garage)

Maybe the city could buy the property off Chiofaro and build subsidized housing for the poor. It will continue the BRA success.
 
Re: The Boston Arch (Aquarium parking garage)

greenwayguy1982 said:
It's worth pointing out that the "shadow study" submitted by Chiofaro only looks at two months out of the year (March/September, during which months the sun is at a similar angle so they're basically the same). What about the other 10 months out of the year? An inconvenient truth?

Also anyone check out the 5-story floating garage/barge he is proposing to occupy the entire area between Harbor Towers and the Aquarium for 4 years? That ought to liven up the waterfront....
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Probably because during the months between March and September (aka April to August) the angle of the sun will cause the building to cast little to no shadows on the parks during times people actually use it. Also, during the months between September and March (aka October to February), not many people use the park as much because it becomes too cold and foliage has not yet bloom, meaning the shadow will not affect how the plants grow. It's not an inconvenient truth, shadow just doesn't affect the Greenway during those months.
 
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Re: The Boston Arch (Aquarium parking garage)

Do other cities have this bullshit shadow ordinance?
 
Re: The Boston Arch (Aquarium parking garage)

Marley said:
Do other cities have this bullshit shadow ordinance?
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sfgate.com
Redrawing San Francisco's skyline could come down to sunlight and shadows.

The proposal that city planners recently unveiled to allow seven new skyscrapers near a rebuilt Transbay Terminal, including one that would crown a changed skyline, appears to have at least one problem - a 1984 voter-approved initiative that protects sunlight for city-owned parks and open space.

Proposition K, the "Sunlight Ordinance," blocks construction of any building over 40 feet that casts an adverse shadow on Recreation and Park Department property unless the Planning Commission decides the shadow is insignificant.
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Re: The Boston Arch (Aquarium parking garage)

Arborway said:
The Greenway looks downright pathetic in that first photo. If you ever doubted it was a median strip in a traffic sewer... well... just click that link.

Can we have another cross street please?
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The photo is 2007 vintage, so the Greenway is brand new.
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For a technical overview of shadow analysis, as done by New York City, see:
http://www.nyc.gov/html/dcp/pdf/greenpointwill/gw_feis_ch_06.pdf

The above assessment covers the imposition of future height limits.

If anybody is knowledgeable about NYC and its shadow bylaws, which also seem to affect new shadows on historic structures, would Ron D. have trouble with his SCL building because of the shadows it will cast on the Tiffany windows in the church opposite if this were a NYC project instead of Boston?
 
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Re: The Boston Arch (Aquarium parking garage)

Marley said:
Do other cities have this bullshit shadow ordinance?
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New York City, does, doesn't it? Not necessarily for shadows but to have open sky above. Every so many X vertical feet the building has to step in Y feet from the street wall line or something?
 
Re: The Boston Arch (Aquarium parking garage)

"Susan Elsbree, a BRA spokeswoman, said the document fails to respond to the questions raised by the city. ?It?s better saved for one of his press conferences because it does not respond to the scoping determination and offers fictional solutions, such as an 800-car floating garage in Boston Harbor, instead of thorough, thoughtful analysis,? she said in a statement."

I guess the BRA has no intention of working with Chiofaro. It's becoming so obvious. I actually think a floating barge is a brilliant idea to solve the parking problem.

Somebody might want to tell Susan Elsbree that the BRA should help create jobs instead of criticizing the development, especially for how many family's are out of work. Her words are priceless with the sarcarism towards Chiofaro. It's like she has a stake in this guy's failure.

These people are losers. Help create a better Boston, only if your friends and family of the Mayor.
It might be time for me to move like Fidelity.
 
Re: The Boston Arch (Aquarium parking garage)

I don't get it - if Chiofaro is so bent on developing his project, why doesn't he just do the studies that the BRA requested of him, just like they request of every other developer in the city who wants to do a big project? Take the BRA's argument away from them, beat them at their own game and just do the analysis and move on...Chiofaro is subject to the same rules as everybody else but he refuses to play by them. The BRA hasn't said "NO," they've asked Don to do studies of environmental impacts, and if he would just spend the time doing these studies, he could advance through the Article 80 process just like every other developer. If anyone's interested, the scoping document that asks for the studies is on the BRA website....nowhere in that document does it say "NO" to his project like Don would have everyone believe. Read it for yourself.
 
Re: The Boston Arch (Aquarium parking garage)

So I am curious if Greenwayguy1982 is going to be the this threads version of Ned Flaherty?
 
Re: The Boston Arch (Aquarium parking garage)

Greenway guy - Just an honest question:

Do you curently like the greenway as is, or do think it needs to be revamped a bit? Clearly your for a good park, like the rest of us, but I'm just wondering how you curently view it?
 
Re: The Boston Arch (Aquarium parking garage)

greenwayguy1982 said:
I don't get it - if Chiofaro is so bent on developing his project, why doesn't he just do the studies that the BRA requested of him, just like they request of every other developer in the city who wants to do a big project? Take the BRA's argument away from them, beat them at their own game and just do the analysis and move on...Chiofaro is subject to the same rules as everybody else but he refuses to play by them. The BRA hasn't said "NO," they've asked Don to do studies of environmental impacts, and if he would just spend the time doing these studies, he could advance through the Article 80 process just like every other developer. If anyone's interested, the scoping document that asks for the studies is on the BRA website....nowhere in that document does it say "NO" to his project like Don would have everyone believe. Read it for yourself.
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The BRA are about to cap the site at 200ft because of winds, shadows, and people?s views on the Greenway. The BRA is not working with Chiofaro to help create jobs, or help envision a better Greenway. They are working against him. The Mayor also claimed that Chiofaro had a better chance of 80 degree day in January to build a project of this magnitude. Reminder: That the Mayor makes these comments without ever meeting the developer and going over his project. How can the Mayor make a claim like this? Sounds like the Mayor is not looking out for the best interests of the taxpayers.

The only thing I'm reading into, is misguided politics by a bunch of corrupt fools. Now you know why our nation is heading for the toliet.
 
Re: The Boston Arch (Aquarium parking garage)

I think greenwayguy has a point regarding Chiofaro getting the studies done... but it is also not news the BRA is acting ridiculous. We are definitely stuck with this garage for some time.

The point has been raised before, but Chiofaro should just demolish the garage, F the Harbor Tower residents, and leave a Filenesesque hole in the ground, and let it fill with water. If the city wants to bring more people to the waterfront, maybe a community pool will accomplish just that.
 
Re: The Boston Arch (Aquarium parking garage)

Cojapo said:
So I am curious if Greenwayguy1982 is going to be the this threads version of Ned Flaherty?
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Greenwayguy isn't pompously making irrelevant points. I think it's a very legitimate point that Chiofaro should have to go through the same process as everyone else. Trouble is, Don has burned enough bridges with the mayor that he knows he'll need a groundswell of union/public support to navigate the BRA / ZBA.
 
Re: The Boston Arch (Aquarium parking garage)

AmericanFolkLegend said:
Greenwayguy isn't pompously making irrelevant points. I think it's a very legitimate point that Chiofaro should have to go through the same process as everyone else. Trouble is, Don has burned enough bridges with the mayor that he knows he'll need a groundswell of union/public support to navigate the BRA / ZBA.
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What did Chiofaro ever do to burn bridges with the Mayor or the BRA?
 
Re: The Boston Arch (Aquarium parking garage)

Yeah, Greenwayguy (is "GG" cool?) has a good point. Chiofaro should absolutely go through the study and review process, etc. Problem is, we all have doubts that regardless of what processes Chiofaro takes his time and money to go through, the BRA won't approve this project anyways.
 
Re: The Boston Arch (Aquarium parking garage)

The problem is exactly the same as Columbus Center. Chiofaro will most likely not make it through the process. Chiofaro most likely knows this, which is probably why he is avoiding it.
We know the process is fair because everyone has to go through the same steps.

The question no one is asking and no one asked during the CC debacle is, "Does the process lead to a better city?"

So far, I'm seeing no evidence that it does.
 
Re: The Boston Arch (Aquarium parking garage)

kennedy said:
Yeah, Greenwayguy (is "GG" cool?) has a good point. Chiofaro should absolutely go through the study and review process, etc. Problem is, we all have doubts that regardless of what processes Chiofaro takes his time and money to go through, the BRA won't approve this project anyways.
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If the BRA is already saying no height over 200ft in this area. What is the sense of going through the process?
 
Re: The Boston Arch (Aquarium parking garage)

Maybe put this tower in place of Trans National Place/115 Winthrop Square, and turn the Harbor Garage into a pile of rubble. Or, maybe Chiofaro could work an agreement for an exchange of land and put this tower in DTX in place of the Filenes project.
 
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