Copley Place Expansion and Tower | Back Bay

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Re: Copley Place plan calls for condo tower

Our pal at the Herald has weighed in. He. of course, uses the "s-word" in the first sentence.

The Boston Herald said:
47-story condo-retail tower proposed at Copley Square

By Scott Van Voorhis

A 47-story luxury condo and retail tower would soar over Copley Square under plans unveiled today by Simon Properties, which owns the upscale Copley Place Mall.

Simon wants to significantly expand the mall?s Neiman Marcus store, and also add new shops, restaurants and 300 condos priced at $1 million and up, according to a proposal filed with City Hall.

The site could open for business by 2012, Simon executives said. However, Simon is designing the project to ameliorate concerns that the project might overshadow Copley Square - literally.

During months of planning and early discussions, some neighborhood activists raised fears that the tower might cast shadows Copley Square and the nearby Commonwealth Avenue Mall.

The minimize such risks, Simon plans to build the high-rise on a four-story podium and make the tower itself thin and tapered.
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Re: Copley Place plan calls for condo tower

Beton Brut said:
Our pal at the Herald has weighed in. He of course, users the "s-word" in the first sentence.
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I love Scott van Voorhis. He has to be laughing every time he writes soar, right?
 
Re: Copley Place plan calls for condo tower

PerfectHandle said:
I love Scott van Voorhis. He has to be laughing every time he writes soar, right?
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I would think that at this point he must be. How dumb can he (and the Herald) be anyway?

Is it me or does he look like some big boss's dorky brother-in-law who was given an easy well-paying job?
 
Re: Copley Place plan calls for condo tower

I believe he posts on, or at least reads, this board. A couple of times I thought I saw echoes in his articles of things in the posts. That, plus his perverse pleasure in the use of the word "soar", which seems to be an irritant to some members.
Let's "out" him!
 
Re: Copley Place plan calls for condo tower

I wonder if Scott and the word soar are sorta like the movie Supertroopers and betting if you can say meow ten times... Him and his cronies could be just laughing their asses off everytime they read his article and tallying it on a board. one soar= 5 shots at the bar that night.

The proposal itself is alright. Why doesn't anybody learn they should just propose it taller than the JHT and they will get what they want
 
Re: Copley Place plan calls for condo tower

I'd like to see him leave his mark in Boston but not in the same way the Gehry did with the Strata Center.
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You mean you'd like to see it tucked away on a side street deep within a university campus?

Actually, that's where most of Boston's best architecture is. Take note: the business community in this city is not usually where to look if you want something above the level of a crapsterpiece.

I have to say, though, the skyline looks sexy with this rendered in...a nice "arched back effect". You guys should be realistic, though - render it as the fat box it will turn out as.
 
Re: Copley Place plan calls for condo tower

Pre-NIMBY:

Lake_Point_Tower4.jpg


Post-NIMBY:

images%5Cprojects%5Catlanticterminal.jpg
 
Re: Copley Place plan calls for condo tower

Czsz, that second rendering "sores".
 
Re: Copley Place plan calls for condo tower

I'm pretty optimistic about the chances of this one going forward at 47 stories. NIMBYs did not shrink the Clarendon or 111 Huntington, and the Columbus Center tower on parcel 16 is actually taller than what was originally proposed. Its immediate neighbors are a mall, a hotel, and a parking garage. Where are the complaints going to come from?
 
Re: Copley Place plan calls for condo tower

Only the shadow knows.
 
Re: Copley Place plan calls for condo tower

czsz said:
You mean you'd like to see it tucked away on a side street deep within a university campus?
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I meant that I personally didn't feel that the Strata was on par with some of his other work. I don't think it's nearly as good as his Bilbao Guggenheim, the EMP in Seattle, Hotel Marques de Riscal, Dancing House, etc. It's not his worst by any stretch, but I don't consider it among the best. If someone like Calatrava was recruited for this project I would hope they would do better.

However, I would like it if it looked similar (but not a duplicate of) to the Lake Point Tower in Chicago. While the base in that rendering looks similar, according to the VanSoaris article, this will taper as it rises so as not to cast shadows of death on Copley Sq. or Comm Ave.
 
Re: Copley Place plan calls for condo tower

The minimize such risks, Simon plans to build the high-rise on a four-story podium and make the tower itself thin and tapered.
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This sounds promising.

You can expect a total freak-out from all the usual suspects. I hope Simon is prepared to wage war on the NIMBYs of the Back Bay.

This corner does need something badly--as it is, it's horrid in every way. It would be great if they're planning on major ground-level improvements as well. They can start by building a sidewalk on this side of Stuart St. I do realize there's an offramp there, but come on, let's show a little creativity.
 
Re: Copley Place plan calls for condo tower

Despite the Boston Museum frizz-out (which could be a good thing in the end -- maybe they'll need to build apartments and retail on the former Museum site to cover over the tunnels...), this could be a good day for Boston development. First this tower, which definitely has potential to be big and b-b-b-b-bad, and then the Shreve's decision (or salutary indecision). Fingers crossed, since I'm worried there's nothing but an essentially arbitrary decision or two between a great outcome and a terrible one, on all counts...
 
Re: Copley Place plan calls for condo tower

Simon is no pushover. They are a deep pockets company, REITS galore.
 
Re: Copley Place plan calls for condo tower

Its immediate neighbors are a mall, a hotel, and a parking garage. Where are the complaints going to come from?
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This is the town where Joe Fallon was coerced into paying $25k towards a museum for the West End, so some of his Seaport plans weren't mired in extra red tape. This is the town where David D'Alesandro held up Columbus Center for years fighting over a 100 square foot pile of trash and dirt off Stanhope street so it could become a park for who nobody ever knows. Grudges die hard in Boston (especially among zealots of the Back Bay and South End), so nothing would surprise me.
 
Re: Copley Place plan calls for condo tower

Copley Place owner unveils tower plan
By Scott Van Voorhis
Friday, March 21, 2008


A luxury condo and retail tower almost as tall as the Prudential building would soar over Copley Square under plans unveiled yesterday by the upscale Copley Place Mall?s owner.

Retail giant Simon Properties proposed a major expansion of the mall?s Neiman Marcus store, as well as new shops and restaurants - all topped by 300 condos priced at $1 million and up.

?With all the services and amenities Copley Place offers, we thought residential was just a natural component,? said Carl Dieterle, executive vice president of development for Simon.

The project?s launch comes after months of planning and efforts to head off concerns raised by some neighborhood activists that the proposed 47-story tower might cast a long shadow across nearby Copley Square and other Back Bay landmarks.

While acknowledging the shadow issue, Simon executives contend the tower?s design will limit the project?s impact.

The high-rise will take shape on a four-story podium, with the tower itself thin and tapered to create the least amount of shadow possible on Copley Square and on the nearby Commonwealth Avenue mall, Dieterle said.

Citing research Simon commissioned, Dieterle conceded the tower will cast a shadow across some of Copley Square and the Commonwealth mall - but only between 11:30 a.m. and 1 p.m. in the winter and fall months. ?It?s pencil like,? he said.

Still, the prospect of any additional shadows on Copley Square and the Commonwealth Avenue mall will have to thoroughly reviewed, said state Rep. Marty Walz (D-Back Bay).

And the design of the high-rise, given its proximity to the widely acclaimed Hancock tower, also needs to be carefully considered.

?It will be reflected in the facade of the Hancock Center and it has a very prominent position on the Back Bay skyline,? Walz said. ?This needs to be a spectacularly beautiful building.?

More than just a new tower is planned, with a major retail expansion also in the works.

The project aims to add 54,000 square feet to the existing Neiman Marcus store, as well as an additional 60,000 square feet of retail and restaurant space. A four-season winter garden is also planned.

And despite concerns over a weakening economy, Simon?s Dieterle notes the project won?t open until 2012 - likely putting it in a recovering real estate market.


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Re: Copley Place plan calls for condo tower

Scott Van Voorhis said:
A luxury condo and retail tower almost as tall as the Prudential building would soar over Copley Square under plans unveiled yesterday by the upscale Copley Place Mall?s owner.
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That's twice in two days. He's got to be doing this on purpose.

I like the way this design is being described ("pencil-like","thin and tapered"). Let's see it already.

Marty Walz's reaction is also semi-promising.
 
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