Fall River/New Bedford Commuter Rail (South Coast Rail)

king_vibe said:
It takes 90 minutes to drive from NB to Boston if you're lucky, and that's not even counting parking.
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Oh yeah, definitely. I'd rather commute 90 minutes on the train than in a car or bus. But 90 minutes commuting each way is still 3 hours per day spent commuting. It's certainly more palatable than driving, but I don't think it's appealing enough to have an outsized impact on the the city in terms of attracting a ton of Boston commuters. The people it'll appeal to are the people who already do the commute (there are good number of them), and a handful of people who work hybrid schedules only requiring a few days per week in the office and/or people who can work on the train and count those 3 hours as part of their work day. It's a fairly small group. If the trip time were 50-60 minutes, the appeal would be a good deal broader.

FWIW, I lived in Dartmouth for several years and did the Dartmouth-Boston commute. No matter how I tried to make it better (taking the bus from New Bedford, driving to Quincy for the Red Line, driving to Middleborough/Lakeville and Commuter Rail, carpooling, van share, etc.), it was not worth it. Not even for the lower cost of living. SCR would have been an improvement and easily the preferred method, but it's still a loooong day.
 
Im not very familiar with New Bedford but it appears that if rt-18 was put on a road diet and de-highway-itized they could have pretty easily brought the commuter rail right in front of downtown. Rt-18 seems way overbuilt for being an access road from 95.

As far as the station where it is at least theres a lot of empty/industrial land around it that could be redeveloped.
 
stick n move said:
Im not very familiar with New Bedford but it appears that if rt-18 was put on a road diet and de-highway-itized they could have pretty easily brought the commuter rail right in front of downtown. Rt-18 seems way overbuilt for being an access road from 95.

As far as the station where it is at least theres a lot of empty/industrial land around it that could be redeveloped.
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Totally agree. I lived in New Bedford in the early 1970s when Route 18 was designed and built, unfortunately, as a freeway with sweeping ramps and interchanges. Transform it into a boulevard with at grade intersections and there would be ample room for CR tracks and a station.
 
Charlie_mta said:
Totally agree. I lived in New Bedford in the early 1970s when Route 18 was designed and built, unfortunately, as a freeway with sweeping ramps and interchanges. Transform it into a boulevard with at grade intersections and there would be ample room for CR tracks and a station.
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They already changed Rt 18 from highway to boulevard south of downtown. The next phase is from downtown north to I-195.
 
If they coordinated the downgrading of Route 18 with the commuter rail project, I guess they theoretically could have extended it another 1,500 feet or so to the edge of downtown without disrupting too much. That would have been nice. But I don't think the current location is a killer.
 
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A good chunk of people already make 90min commutes from Fitchburg, which is a small city, and Worcester (on the local train). I don’t think the commute time is much of a barrier especially with the job market accessibility for those without a car in FR/NB. Tens of thousands do that daily on the Redline from Braintree.

Bus service to and from downtown looks like it’s every 10-15min along Purchase and Achusnet.
 
Really hope Mbta improves old colony line…one delay and everything turns into a sht show…no wonder everyone just decides to take chances on 93. Worst highway/worst train line. Mbta is great if you don’t care about being on time.
 
Greenwood Industries

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“Boston isn't the only place Greenwood is working on major infrastructure. The South Coast Rail project will connect Boston and Fall River by commuter rail for the first time since 1958. Greenwood has been installing metal roofs at each of the new stations. This one at the Fall River station wont just make the commute to Boston easier, it will also benefit people visiting Fall River, as its just a short walk to Battleship cove.”

Link


Church street station
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Middleborough station
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East Taunton station
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https://commons.m.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:South_Coast_Rail_construction_in_2023
 
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Expected opening for SCR is pushed back to summer of next year. Which was seeming inevitable. They kept saying it would be late 2023, but there haven't been any big updates in a long while.

fallriverreporter.com

South Coast Rail now expected to be ready next summer

Chris Lisinski Passenger service on a commuter rail expansion to southern Massachusetts is not expected to begin until next summer, MBTA officials said Thursday, which would be about half a year later than prior forecasts. During a wide-ranging presentation about the status of the highly...
fallriverreporter.com

I've been wanting to visit New Bedford for a little while and was hoping to take the train. I guess I'll be driving.
 
Question - Have any efforts been made to plan for an extension of South Coast Rail from Fall River to Newport, RI and safeguard the ROW that such an extension would require? I was able to find an article explaining why the project would be a good idea, but the only official plan it cited was from the 90s. Obviously, the most expensive hurdle would be replacing the bridge. Hopefully, a federal grant could help with that. The station in Newport could get pricey if they go too fancy with it, but ideally you'd just keep it to a platform with some shelters. The rest of the project seems like it would be very straightforward track replacement. Maybe you'd need some crossing gates too.

Newport is comparable to Cape Cod as a summer destination. If the Cape Flyer is anything to go by, such a project would be a huge success. And unlike the Cape, Newport is a decently-sized city in its own right with a compact and walkable core. Year-round intercity service to Boston could therefore be compared to the Downeaster as well, which is one of Amtrak's most successful expansions of the past 20-30 years. The tracks also end right at Newport's main bus station and one block away from the Block Island ferry dock, so the intermodal connections would be great. Finally, if Rhode Island passed something like IRAP, it could also support the reactivation of freight service to industries on Aquidneck Island.

All in all, seems like a mega-win if the bridge can be figured out!

On the political/policy side, I can see an argument that MA needs to finish SCR Phase II before anything can happen due to otherwise-uncompetitive trip times, but I think there is also an argument that a committment from RI to work on a Newport extension could come first and be part of the argument for actually doing Phase II - it would add riders and bring down the per-rider cost of the project. Planning for the bridge in particular can't come soon enough given my hunch that the timeline on that would be at least 5+ years.
 
michaelw37 said:
Question - Have any efforts been made to plan for an extension of South Coast Rail from Fall River to Newport, RI and safeguard the ROW that such an extension would require? I was able to find an article explaining why the project would be a good idea, but the only official plan it cited was from the 90s. Obviously, the most expensive hurdle would be replacing the bridge. Hopefully, a federal grant could help with that. The station in Newport could get pricey if they go too fancy with it, but ideally you'd just keep it to a platform with some shelters. The rest of the project seems like it would be very straightforward track replacement. Maybe you'd need some crossing gates too.

Newport is comparable to Cape Cod as a summer destination. If the Cape Flyer is anything to go by, such a project would be a huge success. And unlike the Cape, Newport is a decently-sized city in its own right with a compact and walkable core. Year-round intercity service to Boston could therefore be compared to the Downeaster as well, which is one of Amtrak's most successful expansions of the past 20-30 years. The tracks also end right at Newport's main bus station and one block away from the Block Island ferry dock, so the intermodal connections would be great. Finally, if Rhode Island passed something like IRAP, it could also support the reactivation of freight service to industries on Aquidneck Island.

All in all, seems like a mega-win if the bridge can be figured out!

On the political/policy side, I can see an argument that MA needs to finish SCR Phase II before anything can happen due to otherwise-uncompetitive trip times, but I think there is also an argument that a committment from RI to work on a Newport extension could come first and be part of the argument for actually doing Phase II - it would add riders and bring down the per-rider cost of the project. Planning for the bridge in particular can't come soon enough given my hunch that the timeline on that would be at least 5+ years.
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I don't think you'd ever see regular CR service down there; it's just too long. But an in-season "Newport Flyer" with RIDOT support for the out-of-district running miles is definitely a good possibility.

Right now the ROW south of the Port of Fall River turnout is out-of-service. But there are plans for a freight reactivation to the state line so that a big local customer, Gold Medal Bakery, who currently transload at the port can start receiving flour hoppers at their home siding at their big Bay St. factory not used since the mid-1990's. There's also a barge transload dock next to Gold Medal's plant with an owner that wants to load barged goods like municipal road salt onto railcars. The reactivation plan has formal grant applications filed by Mass Coastal RR that have been passed over on a couple previous rounds of funding, but they are still pending so this is very likely to happen...so the line in MA will be secure long-term.

In Tiverton, RI the line is considered likewise "out-of-service"/non-abandoned (including the missing bridge). RIDOT (line owner) has quid pro quos with Providence & Worcester RR (the operator) to keep the freight rights "active" to the Naval base, even though there hasn't been any activity to the base since 1988 (and P&W outsourced the work to Conrail rather than roam themselves so far from home to their remote Newport territory). That allows the state to keep the trail lobbies at-bay and allows for a simple reactivation to full operating status with 3 months' notice to abutters, no public input, and no legal challenges. The only things subject to negotiation would be any upgrades planned to the line beyond its former minimal Class 1/10 MPH operating standard. That quid pro quo between state and P&W is crucial for bypassing the abutter NIMBY's. While the tracks are still in the ground, 35 years of inactivity means the physical plant would have to be built from scratch on 2.7 miles of state-owned track. One missing road overpass would have to be replaced, and then the Sakonnet River bridge would have to be replaced. The river channel is only 365 feet at the rail crossing, so it wouldn't be a particularly big movable bridge that would need to be built. An appropriate comparison would be the new Gloucester Drawbridge on the Rockport Line...about half the length of Sakonnet, but double the tracks and double the moving spans. RIDOT is continuing to slowly upgrade the tracks on Aquidneck Island for the tourist train, and has aims on eventually getting it up-to-spec for running an RDC shuttle on-island during tourist season at much-expanded schedules from the current tourist train. They've stated in their State Rail Plan that they are interested in studying some sort of service from Fall River once SCR is settled. So while there are some cost hurdles for rebuilding the bridge and Tiverton trackage, the interest is definitely there and the have the legal wherewithal to steamroll any NIMBY opposition.
 
I've often wondered why the extension/reactivation to Gold Medal has yet to happen? What becomes of the IRAP money allocated for it? MDOT ran a brush cutter down
there when it was announced, but nothing since. Wonder how powerful the marina/condo people are (since they got their backs up when this was announced)?

And down at Tiverton, there are houses built close to the track (Riverside Drive) with boats stored on the ROW.
 
Teban54 said:
The concerns about slow speed and lack of trips (due to the Phase 1 alignment) definitely deserve more attention.

But I have to say, I'm tired of people bringing up gentrification every time a transit project is done. I can see why people are concerned, but do they really prefer the alternative of having lackluster or no transit access?
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"We should improve society"

but gentrification!
 
Teban54 said:
The concerns about slow speed and lack of trips (due to the Phase 1 alignment) definitely deserve more attention.

But I have to say, I'm tired of people bringing up gentrification every time a transit project is done. I can see why people are concerned, but do they really prefer the alternative of having lackluster or no transit access?
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I’m originally from the South Coast and following the local reaction to the project has been fun. Among other silly concerns, people seem to believe that SCR will simultaneously bring in “undesirables” who will ruin FR/NB with drugs AND lure in all of the wealthy people from Boston who will drive real estate prices (and taxes) up and push the locals out.

Meanwhile, the slow travel time and limited number of trips are the real issues that don’t seem to get much attention. I sure hope the political will is there to make sure Phase 2 happens.
 
Lrfox said:
I’m originally from the South Coast and following the local reaction to the project has been fun. Among other silly concerns, people seem to believe that SCR will simultaneously bring in “undesirables” who will ruin FR/NB with drugs AND lure in all of the wealthy people from Boston who will drive real estate prices (and taxes) up and push the locals out.

Meanwhile, the slow travel time and limited number of trips are the real issues that don’t seem to get much attention. I sure hope the political will is there to make sure Phase 2 happens.
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What exactly is the point of building a bunch of low ridership rail that still has third world country infrastructure (single track, single platform, diesel run, surrounded by a sea of parking rather than in a town center)? Like I know the projected ridership/headways will be low enough that a single platform/track is all you need, but given that I can think of a thousand projects that will benefit more people for a similar cost. Like electrification out to 128 and fixing the old colony pinch.
 
Why do people think that third world has worse passenger rail infrastructure OR public transport than USA? It might be not as safe, but it does exist, and covers more of the population.
There are a lot of things that the third world has to catch up in, but public transport might not be one of them?
 
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