Re: Fall River/New Bedford Commuter Rail
I was going to let it go, because (perhaps) there are more appropriate places to litigate what one feels about members of this site who are unnecessarily inflammatory, trollish, or obvious trolls. But, since, as trolls do, Rover has continued to fuel the fire I will respond to these remarks here.
What I was referring to, and what F-Line was quite definitely referring to in his initial remark that kicked off this whole spat, was not simply Rover's most recent post, but his history on this site of [what I would most definitely call] shitposting. His general modus operandi is to to wade in with snipes but then back away when confronted, using facts very selectively, and making not-so-subtle digs at people who disagree with him and then NOT RESPONDING in detail to the thoughtful, reasoned counterpoints against whatever it is he may be saying.
Now, this combination of jabs and pseudointellectual bloviation might not be trolling—really, the only question is whether this is a learned personality trait that has helped him win arguments in his social circles in the "leafy, loaded and liberal suburb" in which he resides or whether he is intentionally trying to upset people. Rifleman wanted to stir things up, no other goal as far as I can tell. Certainly a troll. I think perhaps Rover, at least consciously, would like to participate in the discussion here. But the way he goes about it—jab, then talking around the points of the opponent, then flat out failing to address in any specific, concrete, factual way the specific, concrete and factual counterpoints that have been levied at him—is NOT in good faith, and I for one do not feel contribute positively to this forum. The repeated pattern of skirmish, insult, then dodge constitutes the very definition of shitposting, even if it's not as absurdly obvious as armpitsofmight or Rifleman. Yes, I'm well familiar with the former user.
The fact that F-Line attacks people who disagree with him, at times, and may or may not have thermostat regulation issues does not change the fact that Rover is not negotiating in good faith. I do not like that one user's history (a user who's contributed a lot more, in fact) is being used to negate the argument here. F-line has also been rude to me, and yeah, that's not OK, but it doesn't change the facts of this particular case. Furthermore, while he may go on the attacks against people he disagrees with, he never, ever, has accused anyone on here of being a troll, simply in the heat of a dispute—when the person is not trolling. He may bark, but that accusation is not levied lightly. So let's just be a little bit more objective here. He is correctly responding in anger to someone who perseverates in playing fast and loose with the facts but when the counterpoints are levied, won't actually respond in anything more than either cherry picked information that ignores the real points or platitudinous generalities; in either case, always heavily laden with sarcastic tone. I think people who don't seem to realize what's going on here may need review some of the past to understand the context.
Exactly. Facts, please. This is a typical sample of a point-counterpoint with this user. Ernie posts this, and yet, this is the response we get to this actually reasoned post:
I'm sorry, how is this not shitposting? This is a pseudo-reasoned response, replete with personal snipes. Bringing in the additional towns of the South Coast without any (apparent) knowledge of transit patterns of those towns, where people work, where the demand is, or even actually bothering to look up the populations but just guessing that, oh, maybe they add up to 100k and that somehow makes this project equivalent should arouse suspicions in any reader. Notice that having a granular knowledge of movement patterns of the urban regions may be lacking in almost all of us here on aB, but simply indicating that "I've been to the bus station in FR, F-Line probably hasn't, ergo he doesn't know what he's talking about re: every single very well reasoned point about this project" is utterly insane.
The fact that each response we ever get is, in the correct words of F-Line, "dripping [with] contempt and personal attacks", again reinforces my impression that this is either a troll or a troll equivalent who is not actually here to debate in good faith, but, at the very possible best, here to derive self-satisfaction over his own arguments and, at worst, to piss other people off. People on here put a lot of time, effort and knowledge into their posts, and to see someone so consistently play so fast and loose with facts in combination with personal insults, is a user I for one don't appreciate on this forum.
I was going to let it go, because (perhaps) there are more appropriate places to litigate what one feels about members of this site who are unnecessarily inflammatory, trollish, or obvious trolls. But, since, as trolls do, Rover has continued to fuel the fire I will respond to these remarks here.
What I was referring to, and what F-Line was quite definitely referring to in his initial remark that kicked off this whole spat, was not simply Rover's most recent post, but his history on this site of [what I would most definitely call] shitposting. His general modus operandi is to to wade in with snipes but then back away when confronted, using facts very selectively, and making not-so-subtle digs at people who disagree with him and then NOT RESPONDING in detail to the thoughtful, reasoned counterpoints against whatever it is he may be saying.
Now, this combination of jabs and pseudointellectual bloviation might not be trolling—really, the only question is whether this is a learned personality trait that has helped him win arguments in his social circles in the "leafy, loaded and liberal suburb" in which he resides or whether he is intentionally trying to upset people. Rifleman wanted to stir things up, no other goal as far as I can tell. Certainly a troll. I think perhaps Rover, at least consciously, would like to participate in the discussion here. But the way he goes about it—jab, then talking around the points of the opponent, then flat out failing to address in any specific, concrete, factual way the specific, concrete and factual counterpoints that have been levied at him—is NOT in good faith, and I for one do not feel contribute positively to this forum. The repeated pattern of skirmish, insult, then dodge constitutes the very definition of shitposting, even if it's not as absurdly obvious as armpitsofmight or Rifleman. Yes, I'm well familiar with the former user.
The fact that F-Line attacks people who disagree with him, at times, and may or may not have thermostat regulation issues does not change the fact that Rover is not negotiating in good faith. I do not like that one user's history (a user who's contributed a lot more, in fact) is being used to negate the argument here. F-line has also been rude to me, and yeah, that's not OK, but it doesn't change the facts of this particular case. Furthermore, while he may go on the attacks against people he disagrees with, he never, ever, has accused anyone on here of being a troll, simply in the heat of a dispute—when the person is not trolling. He may bark, but that accusation is not levied lightly. So let's just be a little bit more objective here. He is correctly responding in anger to someone who perseverates in playing fast and loose with the facts but when the counterpoints are levied, won't actually respond in anything more than either cherry picked information that ignores the real points or platitudinous generalities; in either case, always heavily laden with sarcastic tone. I think people who don't seem to realize what's going on here may need review some of the past to understand the context.
Exactly. Facts, please. This is a typical sample of a point-counterpoint with this user. Ernie posts this, and yet, this is the response we get to this actually reasoned post:
I'm sorry, how is this not shitposting? This is a pseudo-reasoned response, replete with personal snipes. Bringing in the additional towns of the South Coast without any (apparent) knowledge of transit patterns of those towns, where people work, where the demand is, or even actually bothering to look up the populations but just guessing that, oh, maybe they add up to 100k and that somehow makes this project equivalent should arouse suspicions in any reader. Notice that having a granular knowledge of movement patterns of the urban regions may be lacking in almost all of us here on aB, but simply indicating that "I've been to the bus station in FR, F-Line probably hasn't, ergo he doesn't know what he's talking about re: every single very well reasoned point about this project" is utterly insane.
The fact that each response we ever get is, in the correct words of F-Line, "dripping [with] contempt and personal attacks", again reinforces my impression that this is either a troll or a troll equivalent who is not actually here to debate in good faith, but, at the very possible best, here to derive self-satisfaction over his own arguments and, at worst, to piss other people off. People on here put a lot of time, effort and knowledge into their posts, and to see someone so consistently play so fast and loose with facts in combination with personal insults, is a user I for one don't appreciate on this forum.
