Fall River/New Bedford Commuter Rail (South Coast Rail)

Brattle Loop said:
Especially if the inherent anemic schedules and resultant subpar usability tank ridership to the point that the state kills Phase II outright, in which case FR/NB are left with mediocre service and the rest of the Old Colony is screwed too. I think a lot of us concerned about Phase I aren't so much opposed to the idea of it as to the danger that its inadequacies will cause SCR to fail outright, with collateral and completely avoidable consequences for other services as well.
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Yeah, that's the worst-case scenario that I really hope doesn't come to fruition. It's such a shame that there aren't any modifications to the Old Colony mainline included as part of Phase 1, even if they wouldn't be finished until after the planned start of service in late 2023. Double tracking the platforms at JFK/UMass and Quincy Center should have been part of Phase 1 (or at least should happen soon afterward) but it seems like there is absolutely no interest from the state or the MBTA to undertake such a project.
 
Brattle Loop said:
Especially if the inherent anemic schedules and resultant subpar usability tank ridership to the point that the state kills Phase II outright, in which case FR/NB are left with mediocre service and the rest of the Old Colony is screwed too. I think a lot of us concerned about Phase I aren't so much opposed to the idea of it as to the danger that its inadequacies will cause SCR to fail outright, with collateral and completely avoidable consequences for other services as well.
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This is my biggest concern. I would have fully supported a phased approach that had SCR running from South Station to Taunton via BBY and Stoughton with supplemental bus service between Taunton and Fall River/New Bedford as Phase I. It's been said, but Taunton is the city that benefits the most in a full build out as it's closest to Boston and will see more frequency than both Fall River and New Bedford. Taunton-Boston via Stoughton is viable standalone service that could easily be extended/built upon if demand is there (and I'm fairly certain it is). But I question the political will for going through with Phase II of the current plan if Phase I is as weak as it appears to be.
 
jklo said:
That's crazy. You'd think you would move closer at some point.
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To each his own I guess. Never saw myself living anywhere in the Boston metro-area, even from Bridgewater in. Too crowded, too congested.
 
Can’t seem to find it on the mbta site, nor searching through this thread: can someone direct me to a close-up map of phase 2? One where you can see where the route is going, relative to actual locations in towns?
 
You can also zoom in on google earth and follow the row on there, its still visible.
 
themissinglink said:
Yeah, that's the worst-case scenario that I really hope doesn't come to fruition. It's such a shame that there aren't any modifications to the Old Colony mainline included as part of Phase 1, even if they wouldn't be finished until after the planned start of service in late 2023. Double tracking the platforms at JFK/UMass and Quincy Center should have been part of Phase 1 (or at least should happen soon afterward) but it seems like there is absolutely no interest from the state or the MBTA to undertake such a project.
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Agree totally. The whole strategy seems like such a waste. Get the trains running to Taunton, which will be great and will revitalize Taunton (and Ive heard a lot of people are already moving to Taunton as an escape from Boston prices), be a success story, and then extend lines further south. It makes no sense whatsoever to do it the other way.
 
The problem with that approach is that getting to Taunton is the vast majority of the difficulty. Historically, Boston-Taunton-South Coast service either used the Dighton and Somerset (either via Braintree or via Canton Junction), or the Mansfield-Taunton line.* Both of them are now abandoned, and portions of ROW in Mansfield and Randolph are redeveloped. That leaves you four (even slightly realistic) options to get to Taunton:
  • Go via Attleboro. Either you build a new 3-mile bypass (as proposed in the 1990s), or have a reverse move at the station. Either way, you have to deal with creating NEC congestion and the Taunton grade crossings. Rather indirect route.
  • Go via Mansfield. The original ROW through downtown is redeveloped, so you'd have to build a new ROW along 140 and 495. Deals with NEC congestion (slightly less than Attleboro) and the Taunton grade crossings. Fairly direct route.
  • Go via Canton Junction and Stoughton. Reactivate the ROW through three very rail-hostile towns, and deal with a lesser amount of NEC congestion. Flat and straight ROW - the most direct route.
  • Go via Middleborough. Highly indirect route, Old Colony mainline bottleneck, requires a reverse move at Taunton to serve FR/NB, and hurts potential Cape Cod service. All active ROW, and can avoid most Taunton grade crossings depending on where you put your station.
Meanwhile, once you get to Taunton, getting to FR/NB is easy. Restore active ROW for passenger service, build stations, build layovers. They're also much bigger cities (NB #9 with 101k, FR #10 with 94k) than Taunton (#21 with 59k). So tl;dr: because of the unique circumstances of which rail lines are active, there's no scenario in which it makes sense to just build to Taunton.

* Early Boston-Fall River service ran via Middleborough and didn't serve Taunton. That routing was down to a single daily round trip by the 1920s, and ended around 1931. The ROW between Middleborough and Myricks is now obliterated. The Phase 1 alignment via Middleborough and Cotley Junction is not a routing ever used before, as there was never a complete wye at Cotley.
 
The EGE said:
  • Go via Attleboro. Either you build a new 3-mile bypass (as proposed in the 1990s), or have a reverse move at the station. Either way, you have to deal with creating NEC congestion and the Taunton grade crossings. Rather indirect route.
  • Go via Mansfield. The original ROW through downtown is redeveloped, so you'd have to build a new ROW along 140 and 495. Deals with NEC congestion (slightly less than Attleboro) and the Taunton grade crossings. Fairly direct route.
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I don't remember which study it was, but as I recall, when they examined the Attleboro (and Mansfield?) alternatives, the simulator literally crashed trying to fit all of the rush hour trains. Specifically, the problem was that those alternatives prevented the reuse of the Stoughton Line's slots, and instead forced the simulator to fit in additional slots for South Coast trains in addition to the Stoughton trains. If I remember correctly, the AM rush had an OTP of, like 60% (as opposed to >90% for the Stoughton alts), and the PM rush just made the simulator crash.

I realize "the simulator crashed" probably isn't as dire as it sounds, but it cracked me up when I first read the study and it cracks me up now.
 
The 2011 DEIR said the Attleboro alternative would require adding a 4th track from Forest Hills to Back Bay. There were a lot of questionable things in that study, like electrification being used to make up for other deficiencies (rather than, you know, for superior service and environmental benefit like TM is advocating for) and the cost of the swamp trestle, but adding a 5th NEC branch definitely would be a major issue. (It's worth noting that at times that FR/NB service went via Mansfield, Canton Junction-North Easton shuttle were usually operated rather than through trains).
 
Commuter rail map at Freetown station, from the ABC6 story:

img-8646-scaled.jpg


Curiously, while the branches are labeled "Fall River Line" and "New Bedford Line" like the N/R branches are, the trunk is labeled "Middleborough Line.

Lots to nitpick about this map. Poor design choices (River Works with angled label, the clumsy turn at Middleborough), errors (SL5 not shown), things already obsolete (additional CR service at Oak Grove and Forest Hills aren't shown), weird geography (B/C/D branching, Wonderland seemingly in Winthrop), etc.
 
Interesting the way it shows the Cape Flyer as if it were an MBTA service. It kind of is, but also kind of isn't.
 
The EGE said:
Lots to nitpick about this map. Poor design choices (River Works with angled label, the clumsy turn at Middleborough)...
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I agree there are many poor design choices on the map, but the clumsy turn at Middleborough is certainly not one. That accurately depicts the crappy routing for SCR phase 1 to New Bedford and Fall River.

HenryAlan said:
Interesting the way it shows the Cape Flyer as if it were an MBTA service. It kind of is, but also kind of isn't.
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I'm amazed the Cape Flyer route is finally acknowledged on an MBTA commuter rail map, after 9 years in service. Long past time that happened. I just wish the train name was labeled, to help the public look up the train online.
 
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