Fenway Center (One Kenmore) | Turnpike Parcel 7, Beacon Street | Fenway

[Pheldy34]

Maybe they could name bridges after the streets they carry - instead of some sports star that no one will remember in a decade.

Sounds like a Yankee fan talking...pretty sure we'll remember the greatest clutch hitter in Boston Red Sox history for many decades to come.

 

[Equilibria]

Incidentally, with the renaming of Yawkey Way Extension after Ortiz, Yawkey Station now makes no sense. One step closer to an end to Tom Yawkey's racist legacy, if the MBTA chooses to act.

 

[F-Line to Dudley]

Incidentally, with the renaming of Yawkey Way Extension after Ortiz, Yawkey Station now makes no sense. One step closer to an end to Tom Yawkey's racist legacy, if the MBTA chooses to act.

Wish BU would've thought of that before naming the new dining hall/student center on Deerfield after Yawkey (yeah it's Jean Y., but they didn't put a first name on the sign readily visible from Kenmore so it's cringeworthy all the same).



I doubt there's a lot of pressure for a re-name because the station's gone by Yawkey for 28 years now. Maybe switch to the "Fenway Center" redev namesake when it's all built out for integrity-of-concept's sake.

 

[whighlander]

Incidentally, with the renaming of Yawkey Way Extension after Ortiz, Yawkey Station now makes no sense. One step closer to an end to Tom Yawkey's racist legacy, if the MBTA chooses to act.

Equilibria -- So are we to ignore the many millions of $ given by the Yawkey Foundation to things such as: the newly opened Yawkey Gallery on the Charles River at the MOS, and other things such as the Yawkey Center for Outpatient Care at Massachusetts General Hospital, Dana-Farber's Yawkey Center for Cancer Care and on and on

Further examples with which I was unaware until today:

• 
  December 14, 2015
  The Yawkey Foundations Make Lead Gift to Rebuild Detox Facility at The Dimock Center
• 
  September 18, 2014
  Yawkey Foundations' $10 million gift endows BU nonprofit internship program
• 
  August 19, 2013
  Yawkey Foundation Provides Grant to Establish Lou Gorman Pavilion at Stonehill College
• 
  July 22, 2013
  Cape Cod Health Care Receives Major Grant from Yawkey Foundation II
• 
  May 1, 2013
  Salvation Army unveils Yawkey Aquatic Center
• 
  February 2012
  A New Aquarium Experience Is Coming to Central Wharf
• 
  November 1, 2011
  The Home For Little Wanderers Holds Groundbreaking at Longview Farm
• 
  August 3, 2011
  Yawkey Foundation Funds Little League Pitching Study
• 
  July 5, 2011
  Yawkey Foundation Awards $2 Million to New England Baptist Hospital
• 
  June 1, 2009
  Children's Hospital Boston Opens Door of New Yawkey Family Inn
• 
  October 1, 2008
  Special Olympics Massachusetts Breaks Ground on Yawkey Sports Training Center
• 
  September 26, 2008
  The Campaign for Catholic Schools and the Archdiocese of Boston Announce $15 Million Yawkey Foundation Grant

You are talking about a man born in the beginning of the 20th Century [1903] who lived most of his life in an entirely different era [he died in 1976]
you might be instructed by the following page
http://yawkeyfoundation.org/history.html

 

[whighlander]

Wish BU would've thought of that before naming the new dining hall/student center on Deerfield after Yawkey (yeah it's Jean Y., but they didn't put a first name on the sign readily visible from Kenmore so it's cringeworthy all the same).



I doubt there's a lot of pressure for a re-name because the station's gone by Yawkey for 28 years now. Maybe switch to the "Fenway Center" redev namesake when it's all built out for integrity-of-concept's sake.

F-Line -- same admonition to you -- do a miniscule bit of homework about Tom and Jean Yawkey and their Foundation -- you wont appear quite so ignorant about their complete history

You are attempting to place your 1Q 21st C morality and ethics on top of people who grew up in the early 20th C and lived most of their lives prior to the Civil Rights Act of 1964. Perhaps that was an era before you were a cognizant adult.

Mr. & Mrs.Yawkey although from Detroit and Long Island respectively were Married in South Carolina in the 1940's. Yes, they lived a good part of the time in the midst of Jim Crow South. Yes Tom Yawkey was late to the table to enable a black man to have a significant role in the Red Sox organization either as a player, coach or staff member.

However, to simply dismiss Tom, Jean, the Red Sox Organization and the Yawkey Foundation as racist is just plain being uniformed of the totality of their lives and positive contributions to both Boston and South Carolina.

 

[F-Line to Dudley]

F-Line -- same admonition to you -- do a miniscule bit of homework about Tom and Jean Yawkey and their Foundation -- you wont appear quite so ignorant about their complete history

Was this one of the questions on the test, Professor?. . .

“This current ownership does not run away from the history of this team,” Red Sox historian Gordon Edes told me last week. Edes confirmed the story of the Robinson tryout, though stressed that the culprit has never been positively identified. “We embrace it as part of the Red Sox story. I think it was Larry Lucchino who called it ‘an undeniable legacy of racial intolerance.’ John Henry has referred to ‘the shameful past.’ ”

Well, clearly John Henry and Larry Lucchino aren't as well-versed in the art of plausible deniability as some people.

You are attempting to place your 1Q 21st C morality and ethics on top of people who grew up in the early 20th C and lived most of their lives prior to the Civil Rights Act of 1964. Perhaps that was an era before you were a cognizant adult.

This is excellent. So many fun ways to apply this pretzel logic. CLEARLY the Civil Rights Act of 1964 wasn't cognizant that it was imposing its mid-20th century morality on people who lived most of their lives before that. People who were engaging in discrimination blatant enough that society as a whole decided it had to act. Apparently in bizarro Whiggy-world the reformers were...proceeding ignorantly of history. ³

This counterpoint is really the hill you want to die on, Professor? By all means...please proceed.

Mr. & Mrs.Yawkey although from Detroit and Long Island respectively were Married in South Carolina in the 1940's. Yes, they lived a good part of the time in the midst of Jim Crow South. Yes Tom Yawkey was late to the table to enable a black man to have a significant role in the Red Sox organization either as a player, coach or staff member.

However, to simply dismiss Tom, Jean, the Red Sox Organization and the Yawkey Foundation as racist is just plain being uniformed of the totality of their lives and positive contributions to both Boston and South Carolina.

Hard not to notice that you didn't name any of those positive contributions amongst totality of their lives...just sorta trailed off there after the 'yeah, he was kinda racist in attitude and actions' part. And did a bullet list to Eq's post that listed Foundation donations done greater than 16 years after the totality of the last Yawkey's life had ended.

The post you are willfully misrepresenting states in plain English that Jean Yawkey--who does not have the mile-long trail of racist action on the public record as her husband--is the namesake of BU's Yawkey Center. No one's posts here have contested the legitimacy of Jean Y.'s donations to BU or attributed any malice to it. BU goofed by giving no distinction that building is named for her and the Yawkey Foundation she cultivated. That does her and the Foundation's charitable contributions to the University a great disservice because the Yawkey surname in isolation is default-assumed to mean the much more infamous and higher-profile Tom. In public consciousness and by proximity 3 blocks from the now mercifully-retired street name explicitly named after him and the transit station explicitly named for wayfinding said street named after Tom Yawkey.

The 20,000 Sox fans streaming past that BU building every gameday are not pulling up Wikipedia on their smartphones while crossing Brookline Ave. to get the detailed life history of Jean Yawkey and dilineate reputations between the surnamesakes...as you, Mr. Wikipedia, have conspicuously neglected to do in your retort. They're making a snap judgement of "Oh, another place named after that dead racist? How embarrassing.", because that's been hot-button for years locally re: expunging the Yawkey Way name. Tone-deaf by BU; it leaves the public "uninformed of the totality of her life", in your own words.



But that's beside point. Because, Professor, you're just doing your usual schtick of logging on in the middle of the night where you're guaranteed the last word...posting a word salad that starts with a personal admonishment of a poster by name, leading with a fallacious counterpoint left hanging without substantiation...then running bravely for the hills. And looking really, adorably stupid for your threadshit efforts because you're not half as clever at pulling a snow job as you seem to think you are. But by all means, if you want that rep to be the snap judgment people make upon passing the Whighlander Center for Learned Bullshittery in bucolic Lexington...feel free to work that transparent schtick ever stupider.

 

[whighlander]

Was this one of the questions on the test, Professor?. . .
Well, clearly John Henry and Larry Lucchino aren't as well-versed in the art of plausible deniability as some people.

The 20,000 Sox fans streaming past that BU building every gameday are not pulling up Wikipedia on their smartphones while crossing Brookline Ave. to get the detailed life history of Jean Yawkey and dilineate reputations between the surnamesakes...as you, Mr. Wikipedia, have conspicuously neglected to do in your retort. They're making a snap judgement of "Oh, another place named after that dead racist? How embarrassing.", because that's been hot-button for years locally re: expunging the Yawkey Way name. Tone-deaf by BU; it leaves the public "uninformed of the totality of her life", in your own words.

F-Line -- i think that you can make positive contributions to most of the things you chose upon which you chose to comment.

Most prominently you seem to be one of the AB Forum's resident experts matters related to the technical workings of the T

However, for some perverse reason with respect to my posts -- all you seem to be able to do is launch ad hominem attacks -- well I can take that and I'm fully capable of defending my self

However, like at least one other "brand" on the Forum you suddenly and without warning launch an ad hominem attack on a target of opportunity -- this time on the Yawkey Foundation.

Apparently the fact that in about the past 10 years the Foundation has contributed $418M worth of good works seems to be of no consequence

Just because F-Line says so all references to the word Yawkey must somehow now be treated as if they were the major source of evil in the world -- Come-On -- you can do better than that

Why not attack Amos Hostetter who made his money peddling retransmitted TV signals and now through his Barr Foundation is going to remake Boston to suit his whims and visions -- but is his foundation building facilities to remedy disease -- No his foundation is stopping others from building -- aka BANANA.

 

[odurandina]

i don't know a lot about Tom Yawkey. What i hear about the 50 year Yawkee ownership legacy ain't real good. Was he an epic racist in a racist town?? Probably. Anyone who liked that - would have had a far more difficult time liking his crappy baseball teams. He resided over a loser that forms a great swath of the Curse of the Bambino from a period that spanned from unprecidented decay to Boston's comeback including but not limited to the cellar 50's (1950-66), you got talent and never won late-'60s, the trade away the black players/swoon-your-September '70s, and good riddance Yawkey '80s.

*(caught a break when he croaked before he could trade away Jim Rice).

 

[F-Line to Dudley]

F-Line -- i think that you can make positive contributions to most of the things you chose upon which you chose to comment.

Most prominently you seem to be one of the AB Forum's resident experts matters related to the technical workings of the T

However, for some perverse reason with respect to my posts -- all you seem to be able to do is launch ad hominem attacks -- well I can take that and I'm fully capable of defending my self

However, like at least one other "brand" on the Forum you suddenly and without warning launch an ad hominem attack on a target of opportunity -- this time on the Yawkey Foundation.

This is rich coming from someone who trades in strawman arguments prefaced with ad hominems as his resident schtick for replies. Like this for example...levying a charge of ad hominems against a poster then magically deflecting it to a non-sentient institution when the Foundation's rep has been well-dilineated from Tom Yawkey's.

Like clockwork:

Who is this supposed to be fooling?

Now are you going to attempt to address the topic at-hand with substantiation for your "admonishment"? You haven't done so here. Go ahead. Back up your point for a change instead of schticking with more deflection.

Apparently the fact that in about the past 10 years the Foundation has contributed $418M worth of good works seems to be of no consequence

Counterpointing a charge never made: staw, staw, everywhere a bale of straw.

Just because F-Line says so all references to the word Yawkey must somehow now be treated as if they were the major source of evil in the world -- Come-On -- you can do better than that

The Sox requested to scrub the name off a street because of a history of racial animus within their organization which they duly acknowledge happening under that ownership, which they duly acknowledge a desire in the present ownership to distance themselves from with statement of action, and which they duly acknowledge gives the surname default--and pervasively shared--negative public connotations that cannot be rehabilitated. That's supporting evidence from the public record. Where's your supporting evidence for this increasingly vague counterpoint? Oh, right...ad hominem prefacing strawman.

Nobody's putting a gun to your head to keep willingly deflecting, deflecting, deflecting with more off-topic obfuscation. You made a conscious choice to hit the quote button and start digging that hole.

Why not attack Amos Hostetter who made his money peddling retransmitted TV signals and now through his Barr Foundation is going to remake Boston to suit his whims and visions -- but is his foundation building facilities to remedy disease -- No his foundation is stopping others from building -- aka BANANA.

I don't even know what this word salad is saying, but it sure isn't a direct reply to the topic.

Reinforce your schtick with repetition at your peril. It's nobody's credibility to flush but your own.

 

[JumboBuc]

Incidentally, with the renaming of Yawkey Way Extension after Ortiz [...]

This renaming is already live on Google Maps. Impressive...

As for the bridge, I think a more fitting tribute to Ortiz would have been to name it "Our Fuckin' Bridge", but whatever...

 

[curcuas]

This thread is ridiculous. Can we please at least get the giant pictures out of the feuding so the rest of us can scroll past them? Thanks

 

[whighlander]

This is rich coming from someone who trades in strawman arguments prefaced with ad hominems as his resident schtick for replies. Like this for example...levying a charge of ad hominems against a poster then magically deflecting it to a non-sentient institution when the Foundation's rep has been well-dilineated from Tom Yawkey's.


Who is this supposed to be fooling?

Now are you going to attempt to address the topic at-hand with substantiation for your "admonishment"? You haven't done so here. Go ahead. Back up your point for a change instead of schticking with more deflection.

Counterpointing a charge never made: staw, staw, everywhere a bale of straw.

.....

I don't even know what this word salad is saying, but it sure isn't a direct reply to the topic.

F-Line -- at least allow your posting to have some logical content

That last line above is the most prescient observation you made -- but unfortunately your response when you are staring in mirror

Rather than boring everyone with a 2nd grade version of WfB vs Gore Vidal

here's one I thought of on my way crossing the Comm Ave B tracks this afternoon by the BU Bridge

There is an iconic name on the left -- Kennedy

The roots of the family that you undoubtedly worship are not particularly clean -- let's look back a few years and see if perhaps by the Kennedy standards the Yawkeys are not really that unacceptable

Both of President Kennedy's grandfathers were somewhat on the edge of corruption Irish-American Democrat Politicians

President Kennedy's father, Joseph Patrick "Joe" Kennedy Sr., the "Ambassador" was a serial philanderer and somewhat on the edge of legality financial manipulator, and just this side of bootlegger -- but let those dogs lie -0-

Let's look at his illustrious record as "Ambassador" to the Court of St. James [aka the US Ambassador to the UK].

Papa Joe -- no not Stalin [Kennedy was at least a true-blue anti-Communist] -- was appointed by his friend, President Franklin Roosevelt in 1938. For a number of years Winston Churchill had been warning about the growing power of Nazi Germany. Kennedy chose to side with Neville "Peace in our Time" Chamberlain" -- OK -- that might just be Joe's natural pacifism [he opposed WWI]. Kennedy went a bit further as the initial persecution of Jews in Austria and Germany came to light

quoting from the Wikipedia Article on the Ambassador [refs are quoted below]

On June 13, 1938, Kennedy met with Herbert von Dirksen, the German ambassador to the United Kingdom, in London, who claimed upon his return to Berlin that Kennedy had told him that "it was not so much the fact that we want to get rid of the Jews that was so harmful to us, but rather the loud clamor with which we accompanied this purpose. [Kennedy] himself fully understood our Jewish policy."[45] Kennedy's main concern with such violent acts against German Jews as Kristallnacht was that they generated bad publicity in the West for the Nazi regime, a concern that he communicated in a letter to Charles Lindbergh.[46]

Kennedy had a close friendship with Viscountess Nancy Witcher Langhorne, wife of Viscount Waldorf Astor of the Astor family. The correspondence between them is reportedly replete with anti-Semitic statements.[47] According to Edward Renehan:

As fiercely anti-Communist as they were anti-Semitic, Kennedy and Astor looked upon Adolf Hitler as a welcome solution to both of these "world problems" (Nancy's phrase)..... Kennedy replied that he expected the "Jew media" in the United States to become a problem, that "Jewish pundits in New York and Los Angeles" were already making noises contrived to "set a match to the fuse of the world".[48]

By August 1940, Kennedy worried that a third term as the President for Roosevelt would mean war. As Leamer reports, "Joe believed that Roosevelt, Churchill, the Jews, and their allies would manipulate America into approaching Armageddon."[49] Nevertheless, Kennedy supported Roosevelt's third term in return for Roosevelt's promise to support Joseph Kennedy Jr. in a run for Governor of Massachusetts in 1942.[50] However, even during the darkest months of World War II, Kennedy remained "more wary of" prominent American Jews, such as Associate Justice Felix Frankfurter, than he was of Hitler.[51]

Kennedy told the reporter Joe Dinneen:
It is true that I have a low opinion of some Jews in public office and in private life. That does not mean that I..... believe they should be wiped off the face of the Earth..... Jews who take an unfair advantage of the fact that theirs is a persecuted race do not help much..... Publicizing unjust attacks upon the Jews may help to cure the injustice, but continually publicizing the whole problem only serves to keep it alive in the public mind.

by the time that German bombs were falling on London in the Autumn of 1940 even Franklin Roosevelt** had had enough and was forced to act [perhaps to save his Presidency?] -- Kennedy was allowed to resign

"Democracy is finished in England. It may be here," he stated in the Boston Sunday Globe of November 10, 1940. With Nazi German troops having overrun Poland, Denmark, Norway, Belgium, the Netherlands, Luxembourg, and France, and with bombs falling daily on Great Britain, Kennedy unambiguously and repeatedly stated his belief that this war was not about saving democracy from National Socialism (Nazism) or from Fascism. In an interview with two newspaper journalists, Louis M. Lyons, of The Boston Globe, and Ralph Coghlan, of the St. Louis Post-Dispatch, Kennedy said:

It's all a question of what we do with the next six months. The whole reason for aiding England is to give us time ... As long as she is in there, we have time to prepare. It isn't that [Britain is] fighting for democracy. That's the bunk. She's fighting for self-preservation, just as we will if it comes to us..... I know more about the European situation than anybody else, and it's up to me to see that the country gets it.[6]

His views were becoming inconsistent and increasingly isolationist; British MP Josiah Wedgwood, 1st Baron Wedgwood, who had himself opposed the British Government's earlier appeasement policy, said of Kennedy:

We have a rich man, untrained in diplomacy, unlearned in history and politics, who is a great publicity seeker and who apparently is ambitious to be the first Catholic president of the U.S.[42]

In British government circles during the Blitz, Kennedy was widely disparaged as a defeatist. He retreated to the countryside during the bombings of London by German aircraft, at a time when the British Royal Family, Prime Minister, government ministers, and other ambassadors chose to stay in London. (This prompted a member of Britain's Foreign Office to say, "I thought my daffodils were yellow until I met Joe Kennedy.")

When the American public and Roosevelt Administration officials read his quotes on democracy being "finished", and his belief that the Battle of Britain was not about "fighting for democracy", all of it being just "bunk", they realized that Kennedy could not be trusted to represent the United States. In the face of national public outcry, and pressure from the Roosevelt Department of State, which no longer wanted him, Kennedy submitted his resignation late in November 1940.

** Franklin's son James was a partner with Kennedy during prohibition in some questionable business dealings involving scotch whiskey imports and shares in distillers

Bibliography from wiki

Brinkley, Alvin. Voices of Protest. Vintage, 1983.
Goodwin, Doris K. The Fitzgeralds and the Kennedys: An American Saga. Simon & Schuter, 1987.
Hersh, Seymour. The Dark Side of Camelot. Back Bay Books, 1998.
Leamer, Laurence. The Kennedy Men: 1901–1963. Harper, 2002.
Thomas Maier. The Kennedys: America's Emerald Kings. Basic Books, 2003.
Kessler, Ronald. The Sins of the Father: Joseph P. Kennedy and the Dynasty He Founded. Warner, 1996
Nasaw, David. The Patriarch: The Remarkable Life and Turbulent Times of Joseph P. Kennedy. The Penguin Press, 2012
O'Brien, Michael. John F. Kennedy: A Biography. St Martin's Press, 2005.
Renehan, Edward. The Kennedys at War: 1937–1945. Doubleday, 2002.
Renehan, Edward. "Joseph Kennedy and the Jews". History News Network. George Mason University, April 29, 2002.
Schwarz, Ted. Joseph P. Kennedy: The Mogul, the Mob, the Statesman, and the Making of an American Myth. Wiley, 2003.
Smith, Amanda (ed.). Hostage to Fortune: The Letters of Joseph P. Kennedy. Viking, 2001, the major collection of letters to and from Kennedy
Whalen, Richard J. The Founding Father: The Story of Joseph P. Kennedy. The New American Library of World Literature, Inc., 1964.

Refs from Wiki

6 Boston Sunday Globe, November 10, 1940.
42 Davis, John H. (1993). The Kennedys: Dynasty and Disaster. S.P.I. Books. p. 94. ISBN 978-1-56171-060-7.
43 Leamer pp. 152–53; William E. Leuchtenburg, In the Shadow of FDR: From Harry Truman to George W. Bush (2001) pp. 68–72.
44 Leamer 115.
45 Hersh 64; Renehan 29.
46 Renehan 60.
47 Renehan 26–27; Leamer 136.
48 Renehan, "Joseph Kennedy and the Jews".
49 Leamer 134.
50 Fleming, Thomas. The New Dealers' War: F.D.R. And The War Within World War II, Basic Books, 2001.
51 Renehan 311.

Now of course Rose was the long suffering Catholic wife -- so I guess we need to keep the Greenway -- but that Presidential Library tainting the sacred name of the UMass T Stop -- can't have that. What about that school for future political leaders as Harvard -- can't have that one stay either. Let's see there are some charitable manifestations tied to that despicable anti-Semite family.

And for future research if anyone wants to investigate the other Rose and her maltreatment or perhaps prescribed medical abuse orchestrated by her father ......

 

[underground]

Delete your account.

 

[mdd]

Can we get a tl:dr of that?

 

[FenwayResident]

Can we get a tl:dr of that?

I gave it an honest read, and my best guess at his argument is:

1) There's a bridge named after some Kennedy (unclear which one)
2) Kennedy family = bad
3) Therefore all public assets named after them should be renamed, except the Rose Kennedy Greenway because she's Catholic (?)

 

[CSTH]

I think it's:

1) Kennedys are bad
2) kennedys are democrats
3) There is infrastructure named after kennedys
4) it doesn't matter that Tom Yawkey was a racist

 

[HalcyonEra]

I think it's:

1) Kennedys are bad
2) kennedys are democrats
3) There is infrastructure named after kennedys
4) it doesn't matter that Tom Yawkey was a racist

It would be much better if nothing was named after anyone. There is not a soul on this planet that you cannot dig up dirt on. Especially when revisionist history becomes en vogue, as it is now.

 

[Brad Plaid]

Halcyon you are exactly right, we all live in glass houses.

 

[Equilibria]

http://www.bostonglobe.com/business...r-mass-pike/JGkzVaMwUbq3qkJJDlnHfK/story.html

Construction in Spring 2017, hopefully.

 

[HalcyonEra]

http://www.bostonglobe.com/business...r-mass-pike/JGkzVaMwUbq3qkJJDlnHfK/story.html

Construction in Spring 2017, hopefully.

Phase 2 (the tower) in 2018/19 seems overly optimistic.