Ferdinand Building Renovation + Addition | Dudley Sq | Roxbury

Re: Dudley Sq's Ferdinand Building to be Restored/ Renovated

I think the issue's transit more than anything. South Boston, the South End, Mission Hill, JP, etc all had horrible reputations at one point, but convent transit combined with low prices will make people overlook a lot. Unfortunately for Dudley, people don't see the Silver Line as convenient transit. It's too bad, because it's a pretty nice spot in reality.
 
Re: Dudley Sq's Ferdinand Building to be Restored/ Renovated

czsz said:
Hopeful thoughts, but given the number of government offices already moved to Roxbury (see the BPD HQ) and proximity of universities and hospitals, you'd think it would have seen a pick-me-up long ago. Reputation can haunt an area for a long time after its objective conditions have been seriously improved...
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CZ -- sometimes you need a dense enough concentration of good to overcome a bad reputation

Someone mentioned Kendall and the two Cambridge Housing Authority projects between Kendall and Central -- they didn't have particularly good reputations as recently as the late 90's

Yet today MIT is building a mammoth building for Pfizer right across the street from one of the projects

On the other hand -- I don't think that any Cambridge HA project had as bad a reputation for crime and violence as some of the Roxbury / Dorchester Boston HA projects
 
Re: Dudley Sq's Ferdinand Building to be Restored/ Renovated

Question.

If you were an architect or developer and were given the chance to add on to a really beautiful, well crafted older building, wouldn't you want your addition to, if not match the quality, at least compliment the original building in some way, shape or form?

Looking at the building all I can see is:
"Here is what we used to be capable of building, and here is what we are capable of building today."

It's embarrassing.
 
Re: Dudley Sq's Ferdinand Building to be Restored/ Renovated

If I was the developer or architect on this particular project, the only thing I'd say is, "what would you like this to look like Mr Mayor?"
 
Re: Dudley Sq's Ferdinand Building to be Restored/ Renovated

I get client preference and budget constraints but even working within those two handicaps I would think they could be creative enough to come up with something better than....that.

Maybe not. Maybe this is best we are capable of doing today.
Give them their trophy & ribbon, pat them on the head and move on.
 
Re: Dudley Sq's Ferdinand Building to be Restored/ Renovated

JS38 said:
More renderings from the Globe:

http://www.boston.com/yourtown/boston/roxbury/gallery/dudley_square/?p1=Well_Local_YourTownlinks
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JS -- those renders make the complex look quite inviting -- particularly the restored Ferdinand facade and some of the interiors

Not sure I'd walk around in the neighborhood after dark -- but I could easily see a nice late spring or or early autumn lunch-time visit to meet with someone
 
Re: Dudley Sq's Ferdinand Building to be Restored/ Renovated

Just something new-looking in Dudley will help - it doesn't even need to be brilliant looking. At least the old facade is still there for some looks.

I don't think this will be a game changer for the neighborhood, but it certainly won't hurt.

The real game changer will be the Green Line Washington Street extension, through Dudley down until at least the Franklin Park Zoo. This restores Dudley to its central commercial and transit position within a dense streetcar suburb, much like what Coolidge Corner is to north Brookline. I expect this kind of extension could be done for a tenth the price of the Somerville branch.
 
Re: Dudley Sq's Ferdinand Building to be Restored/ Renovated

I think the issue's transit more than anything. South Boston, the South End, Mission Hill, JP, etc all had horrible reputations at one point, but convent transit combined with low prices will make people overlook a lot. Unfortunately for Dudley, people don't see the Silver Line as convenient transit. It's too bad, because it's a pretty nice spot in reality.
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Where is all the great transit in the South End? It's all concentrated (Orange Line) on the edge of the neighborhood to the north (you've acknowledged the Silver Line doesn't count). Same goes for South Boston, where the Red Line is insanely peripheral to most of the neighborhood. JP actually lost a lot of transit-related convenience when the Green Line was cut back...

The real game changer will be the Green Line Washington Street extension, through Dudley down until at least the Franklin Park Zoo. This restores Dudley to its central commercial and transit position within a dense streetcar suburb, much like what Coolidge Corner is to north Brookline. I expect this kind of extension could be done for a tenth the price of the Somerville branch.
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Did I miss something about this being a sure thing and not just a crazy transit pitch?
 
Re: Dudley Sq's Ferdinand Building to be Restored/ Renovated

i kinda like the building. it is interesting and will definitely become a wayfinding structure.
 
Re: Dudley Sq's Ferdinand Building to be Restored/ Renovated

czsz said:
Where is all the great transit in the South End? It's all concentrated (Orange Line) on the edge of the neighborhood to the north (you've acknowledged the Silver Line doesn't count). Same goes for South Boston, where the Red Line is insanely peripheral to most of the neighborhood. JP actually lost a lot of transit-related convenience when the Green Line was cut back...
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Go down to the South End, South Boston, Mission Hill, JP, etc., and tell me where the leading edge of gentrification was and where the most expensive real estate is. 15 minutes or less to the T all around. The only outliers I can think of are City Point and the JP/Brookline boarder, but that's only because they've always been nice.
 
Re: Dudley Sq's Ferdinand Building to be Restored/ Renovated

I clicked through the slideshow and only saw a bad 1980s office park building that may or may not have been rejected for the current Tip O'Neil Federal Building. Where are the renderings for this expensive landmark school committee building supposed to be?
 
Re: Dudley Sq's Ferdinand Building to be Restored/ Renovated

underground said:
Go down to the South End, South Boston, Mission Hill, JP, etc., and tell me where the leading edge of gentrification was and where the most expensive real estate is. 15 minutes or less to the T all around. The only outliers I can think of are City Point and the JP/Brookline boarder, but that's only because they've always been nice.
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I can only speak for the two neighborhoods I've lived in:
The east end of South Boston has always been nicer (i.e., "more expensive" - your words) than the west end in spite of having poorer transit access. Proximity to the ocean and distance from industrial uses have had a much larger impact on home values than the immediacy of the T.
The section of the South End closest to Mass Ave station has not gentrified at nearly the pace of the Tremont Street / Washington Street corridors despite much better access to transit. The leading edge of gentrification in the South End was the area closest to the Back Bay (the affluent neighborhood, not just the transit station).
 
Re: Dudley Sq's Ferdinand Building to be Restored/ Renovated

Yeah, I said that east Southie (City Point) was the nice end. The issue is that it's always been the nice end. It was the nice end before gentrification, so it's not really a surprise that it's still the nice end. The west end is different, and the level of development there is pretty shocking considering that not so long ago it was one of the poorest parts of the country.

On the South End, I didn't say that transit causes gentrification in and of itself. Only that it can be a predictor. If T stations could gentrify a neighborhood on their own, Quincy would probably look a lot more like Cambridge. My point is that the parts that have gentrified the most have been close to transit (and yeah, being close to the Back Bay probably didn't hurt either).

Just to bring this back around to the topic, Dudley's a nice little neighborhood, but will it gentrify? Who knows, but I don't think the Silver Line is selling too many people on it. Maybe if city officials have to ride it every day, they'll push their boss the mayor to upgrade to a real trolly.
 
Re: Dudley Sq's Ferdinand Building to be Restored/ Renovated

Somewhere I saw the number 30,000 related to people boarding / passing through? the Dudley T Station

That sounds like a quite considerable number which would put Dudley on the top X list -- if there is any incentive to doing something beyond the current Silver Line -- that would be it

F-Line -- do you have any real numbers?
 
Re: Dudley Sq's Ferdinand Building to be Restored/ Renovated

Beton Brut said:
Actually, the DNA of the addition feels fifty years old, and very British. Of course, James Stirling's thoughtful fusion of Wright, Aalto, and industrial aesthetics has been value engineered out.
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I have to say, Mecanoo are great designers, but this does not have the punch I would hope or expect from them. Something messy about it for my taste. And hey, didn't they tell these guys that Dudley Square could use some brightening up?

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Re: Dudley Sq's Ferdinand Building to be Restored/ Renovated

^^^^
The Element reminds me of the Lucky's Bar scene at Mohegan Sun
 
Re: Dudley Sq's Ferdinand Building to be Restored/ Renovated

Is that official now? Last I remember it was still:

ferdinand2__1330983998_0789.jpg
 
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