Four Seasons Tower @ CSC | 1 Dalton Street | Back Bay

Got real lucky today with my flight flying through South Boston to land at Logan instead of coming in from the northeast through Winthrop like it usually does.

Click the link for a larger size:
One_Dalton_1 by Kent Xie, on Flickr

One_Dalton_2 by Kent Xie, on Flickr

One_Dalton_3 by Kent Xie, on Flickr

One_Dalton_4 by Kent Xie, on Flickr

One_Dalton_5 by Kent Xie, on Flickr

One_Dalton_6 by Kent Xie, on Flickr

One_Dalton_7 by Kent Xie, on Flickr

One_Dalton_8 by Kent Xie, on Flickr

Based on some of the shots, the core looks to be just below the Prudential Skywalk (probably 2 - 3 floors below).
 
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This thread has officially reached the building fetishism level of the Millenium tower thread. Just saying.

cca
 
^^This is awesome. When will we know 1 Dalton has surpassed MT??

Horn blast? Globe feature? Will we ever see another 700 foot tower built in Boston?

Is even 1 more Boston-supertall possible given our anti-height hysteria and regional squat fatty fetish?
 
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odurandina said:
^^This is awesome. When will we know 1 Dalton has surpassed MT??

Horn blast? Globe feature? Will we ever see another 700 foot tower built in Boston?

Is even 1 more Boston-supertall possible given our anti-height hysteria and regional squat fatty fetish?
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The Glob will most likely run a front page article about urban shadows being this century's version of the Black Plague, so that's how you'll know. ;)

Regarding your other point, if the Christian Scientists make a mint off of this building, and I don't see how they wouldn't, I'd expect them to find another corner lot to build even higher on in a few years. Why wouldn't they? Their campus is still NIMBY proof and their lower cost structure is unique compared to the rest of the city. Winthrop Sq developers had to acquire land and pay 153M extortion and who knows how much more to grease the local politicians. Christian Scientists don't have to do any of that. They already own the property and no politician or court of law is going to go along with extorting a church. That probably saved them $250M vs Winthrop Square. Unless they really don't like money I can easily see them building another one.
 
Rover said:
The Glob will most likely run a front page article about urban shadows being this century's version of the Black Plague, so that's how you'll know. ;)

Regarding your other point, if the Christian Scientists make a mint off of this building, and I don't see how they wouldn't, I'd expect them to find another corner lot to build even higher on in a few years. Why wouldn't they? Their campus is still NIMBY proof and their lower cost structure is unique compared to the rest of the city. Winthrop Sq developers had to acquire land and pay 153M extortion and who knows how much more to grease the local politicians. Christian Scientists don't have to do any of that. They already own the property and no politician or court of law is going to go along with extorting a church. That probably saved them $250M vs Winthrop Square. Unless they really don't like money I can easily see them building another one.
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Well, Winthrop Square was only really limited by the FAA, and, as it was a city owned parcel, the city should be getting every penny they can out of it.
 
cca said:
This thread has officially reached the building fetishism level of the Millenium tower thread. Just saying.

cca
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Deservedly so.


Rover said:
Regarding your other point, if the Christian Scientists make a mint off of this building, and I don't see how they wouldn't, I'd expect them to find another corner lot to build even higher on in a few years. Why wouldn't they? Their campus is still NIMBY proof and their lower cost structure is unique compared to the rest of the city.
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This is probably why they decided against building the 3rd tower for now. It would make sense to bring that one much higher. I do believe that parcel sits on the FAA line so would only be able to go about 500', but still that's still over 200' more than they were originally proposing.
 
Rover said:
...Winthrop Sq developers had to acquire land and pay 153M extortion...
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Calling the BS flag on this big time. This was a competitive bidding process, whereby millennium outbid other developers. The 153M is not extortion, it reflects the market value of that parcel...and Millennium will no doubt turn a substantive profit off of that. Meanwhile the city was 100% pro-development on that parcel.
 
DZH22 said:
This is probably why they decided against building the 3rd tower for now. It would make sense to bring that one much higher. I do believe that parcel sits on the FAA line so would only be able to go about 500', but still that's still over 200' more than they were originally proposing.
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That is my read of the FAA map as well. The 1 Dalton site is unique in the Christian Science Center footprint, as just squeezing into the 900 ft.+ FAA height area. The rest of the complex is in 500 ft. restriction area.

As often mentioned, the only other seemingly viable Back Bay locations for 900 ft. + are the Dalton Street Garage, The Hynes Convention Center, and the Lord and Taylor sites. And all of these are going to get much more NIMBY resistance.
 
Yes, the Garage is 500' territory.

Isn't it planned for ~250' or something from the 'all lame all the time' era?

Lord & Taylor is 350~360' (no ambiguity) max height. No nimby's to hate on here, unfortunately.
 
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Rover said:
The Glob will most likely run a front page article about urban shadows being this century's version of the Black Plague, so that's how you'll know. ;)

Regarding your other point, if the Christian Scientists make a mint off of this building, and I don't see how they wouldn't, I'd expect them to find another corner lot to build even higher on in a few years. Why wouldn't they? Their campus is still NIMBY proof and their lower cost structure is unique compared to the rest of the city. Winthrop Sq developers had to acquire land and pay 153M extortion and who knows how much more to grease the local politicians. Christian Scientists don't have to do any of that. They already own the property and no politician or court of law is going to go along with extorting a church. That probably saved them $250M vs Winthrop Square. Unless they really don't like money I can easily see them building another one.
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I don't think you know what extortion means.
 
This building changes the Back Bay skyline forever. All my life its been 2 spikes and all their little squat friends (111 Huntington is not quite tall enough to really change that).
 
odurandina said:
Yes, the Garage is 500' territory.

Isn't it planned for ~250' or something from the 'all lame all the time' era?

Lord & Taylor is 350~360' (no ambiguity) max height. No nimby's to hate on here, unfortunately.
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I respectfully disagree with this reading of the Logan Airspace Map:
http://www.massport.com/media/1545/boston-logan-airspace-map.pdf

Dalton Street garage seems to squeak into the 1000 ft. plateau area.
Most of the Hynes Convention Center is in the 975 ft. plateau area.
Lord & Taylor is in the 950 ft. plateau area.

500 ft region cuts across just south of the Pru and Hancock Towers.
 
The Prudential master plan was updated a couple years back. None of these hypothetical skyscrapers are part of this and amending the "plan" would require significant negotiations. I wouldn't get too excited.
 
JeffDowntown said:
Lord & Taylor is in the 950 ft. plateau area.
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True indeed.

But, if developed, the Lord & Taylor site has shadow issues. A few years ago new restrictions were decreed for Trinity Church, Old South Church & Copley Square (Copley Tower is grandfathered).

But not only would a proposal at Lord & Taylor cause issues for new shadows cast upon Copley Square monuments – anything taller than ~360' would also run afoul of the updated Shadow Law for the Common, Public Garden & Comm Ave Mall.

If the Lord & Taylor site is developed it will be another Avalon Exeter scale highrise.
 
I still find that FAA height maps core southern border zigs and zags suspicious when all the other lines around the box are dead straight.
 
4E6BXLhh.jpg
 
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