General Infrastructure

[statler]

'Tis the most wonderful time of the year!

 

[JeffDowntown]

Do we actually not have a thread on the $1 billion plus straightening the Pike, Soldiers Field Road project? If we do, I cannot find it.

MADOT picked their direction today: Soldiers Field Road up on a viaduct over one side of the Pike (all at ground level). Wider park, bike paths by the river.

https://www.bostonglobe.com/metro/2...ton-project/vV3UpnbIRkgstimTdYNLqM/story.html

 

[JeffDowntown]

Do we actually not have a thread on the $1 billion plus straightening the Pike, Soldiers Field Road project? If we do, I cannot find it.

MADOT picked their direction today: Soldiers Field Road up on a viaduct over one side of the Pike (all at ground level). Wider park, bike paths by the river.

https://www.bostonglobe.com/metro/2...ton-project/vV3UpnbIRkgstimTdYNLqM/story.html

Never mind, I see that this multiple road, rail and riverside path project is considered a Development Project rather than a Transit and Infrastructure Project. How quaint.

 

[Arlington]

For the record, the Weekend Discount Pass($10 unlimited) was officially reinstated somewhere around Jan 9th after a month's handwringing after it was ended on Dec 9th.

So the Civil Rights analysis must have gone OK (or be initially positive enough to extend the "trial"). Have they published detailed data somewhere?

So bafflingly stupid:

Globe: The MBTA’s weekend commuter rail discount went pretty well. But now it’s over

 

[millerm277]

For the record, the Weekend Discount Pass($10 unlimited) was officially reinstated somewhere around Jan 9th after a month's handwringing after it was ended on Dec 9th.

So the Civil Rights analysis must have gone OK (or be initially positive enough to extend the "trial"). Have they published detailed data somewhere?

FTA told them that they didn't need to stop the pilot at all while they do the analysis.

https://commonwealthmagazine.org/transportation/t-notes-10-weekend-fare-didnt-need-to-go-away/

 

[DominusNovus]

So, has anyone else been unimpressed with the general response to this relatively minor snowstorm we had over the weekend? I don’t think anyone got towed in Boston, and they barely plowed before the freezing rain froze it all.

 

[statler]

They finally have a sign and name for the project I posted earlier this month.

MITMCo West Campus Drainage Project - Talbot Street Outfall

Just what we need, more Charles River outfall

There is a lot about how our infrastructure works that I'm really unsure about. Is this a combined sewer overflow? If it's not a CSO was there no way to route this to Deer Island? Is Deer Island at max capacity (in terms if new hook ups)? Is this a new additional outflow or a replacement for an existing one?

 

[HelloBostonHi]

Not sure if this made it on here but the MBTA has issued an RFP for replacing the tracks and signals in the "central green line tunnel" (kenmore/symphony to North Station)
http://bc.mbta.com/business_center/bidding_solicitations/pdf/Q21PS01_Statement%20of%20Qualifications.pdf

I'm assuming (hoping) that this is related to the type 10/"Green Line Transformation" project that the capital group is working on because it wouldn't make any sense to replace all the track again...

 

[Equilibria]

Not sure if this made it on here but the MBTA has issued an RFP for replacing the tracks and signals in the "central green line tunnel" (kenmore/symphony to North Station)
http://bc.mbta.com/business_center/bidding_solicitations/pdf/Q21PS01_Statement%20of%20Qualifications.pdf

I'm assuming (hoping) that this is related to the type 10/"Green Line Transformation" project that the capital group is working on because it wouldn't make any sense to replace all the track again...

It's not. The GL Transformation project work is some ways down the line. I can't imagine that this work will conflict with it, though. The tracks and signals should work just fine for the new fleet.

 

[millerm277]

There is a lot about how our infrastructure works that I'm really unsure about. Is this a combined sewer overflow? If it's not a CSO was there no way to route this to Deer Island? Is Deer Island at max capacity (in terms if new hook ups)? Is this a new additional outflow or a replacement for an existing one?

No, just new stormwater drainage improvements (no sewage). Here is a page with a bit more inforrmation.

https://courbanize.com/projects/coc-wc_stormwaterproject/updates

 

[F-Line to Dudley]

Not sure if this made it on here but the MBTA has issued an RFP for replacing the tracks and signals in the "central green line tunnel" (kenmore/symphony to North Station)
http://bc.mbta.com/business_center/bidding_solicitations/pdf/Q21PS01_Statement of Qualifications.pdf

I'm assuming (hoping) that this is related to the type 10/"Green Line Transformation" project that the capital group is working on because it wouldn't make any sense to replace all the track again...

It's just cycled track renewal, which hasn't been done at any comprehensive level in the Central Subway in about 20 years and is now getting overdue. The signal replacement is likewise just cycled renewal...this time replacing end-of-life copper cabling with consolidated fiber optic and replacing the incandescent signal lights with high-visibility LED heads.

GLT isn't even published as a study yet. The only relevance this current work has for the future is that the fiber optic changeouts adds enough data bandwidth to the signal transmission that they can later adopt higher-tech signaling post-GLT when they decide which next-gen system they want to use.

 

[HelloBostonHi]

It's not. The GL Transformation project work is some ways down the line. I can't imagine that this work will conflict with it, though. The tracks and signals should work just fine for the new fleet.

I was under the impression that some pretty major infrastructure changes with respect to turning radiuses and tracks etc to support type 10s, but I could be entirely mistaken.

 

[F-Line to Dudley]

I was under the impression that some pretty major infrastructure changes with respect to turning radiuses and tracks etc to support type 10s, but I could be entirely mistaken.

Those changes haven't been itemized yet. It's not possible to draft a vehicle specs sheet for what a Type 10 can and cannot do until GLT publishes the work from the field surveys and ballparks costs of the mods. That field work is all ongoing. There's nothing actionable to work with until they publish the comprehensive GLT results and resulting recommendations. That's still a long ways off.

In the meantime, the rail they replaced in the subway from about 1998-2000 to enable rollout of the finicky Type 8's is getting pretty worn out. Waiting any longer on the cycled replacement is going to mean increasing derailments with all the thousands of axles that run over every single inch of that revenue track per day. So they're rolling up a bunch of miscellaneous maintenance chores in a wad and advertising it all as a single project to get that and other stuff like the end-of-life signal cable replacement done in a package.

 

[KentXie]

I just want to post about how useless it is to have Logan Airport 3 miles away from Downtown yet it takes just as long as it would take a person to drive from SeaTac to Downtown Seattle or SFO to Downtown San Francisco.

Logan Car by Kent Xie, on Flickr

SeaTac Car by Kent Xie, on Flickr

SFO Car by Kent Xie, on Flickr

What's the point of having the airport so close again?

 

[ant8904]

I'm not examining all the data I should exam before I ask this... But are you comparing travel time for 5:30 PM weekday Boston versus 2:30 PM weekday San Francisco and Seattle?

 

[George_Apley]

Yeah, factor for timezones and check the west coast again at 8:30pm EST.

 

[mass88]

Not really surprising. The road infrastructure in both Seattle and San Francisco is a lot better than Boston. Better layout, wider highways, better on and off ramps, etc.

 

[dshoost88]

I just want to post about how useless it is to have Logan Airport 3 miles away from Downtown yet it takes just as long as it would take a person to drive from SeaTac to Downtown Seattle or SFO to Downtown San Francisco.

Logan Car by Kent Xie, on Flickr

SeaTac Car by Kent Xie, on Flickr

SFO Car by Kent Xie, on Flickr

What's the point of having the airport so close again?

I'm not examining all the data I should exam before I ask this... But are you comparing travel time for 5:30 PM weekday Boston versus 2:30 PM weekday San Francisco and Seattle?

Yeah, factor for timezones and check the west coast again at 8:30pm EST.

Not to add insult to injury, but it looks like your origin and destination points aren’t apples to apples. You made Downtown the Boston destination, but the airports are the destinations in your SeaTac/SFO example.

Also, I wonder how the journey times vary for alternative transit modes. A blue line journey from Airport to Government Center at rush hour couldn’t take more than 12-15 minutes. I recall that journey taking me almost an hour in SF.

 

[KentXie]

I'm not examining all the data I should exam before I ask this... But are you comparing travel time for 5:30 PM weekday Boston versus 2:30 PM weekday San Francisco and Seattle?

The screenshot I took doesn't adjust but I did run the map with the timezone adjusted and the travel time was about 5 minutes longer and still shorter in terms of miles per minute.

Part of this I assume is that having an airport outside the most congested areas in the city means that airport traffic does not contribute to downtown traffic (i.e. someone from a Seattle suburb going to Sea-Tac would not need to drive through downtown to reach the airport). Perhaps putting an airport right next to Downtown may not be the most efficient idea after all. Unfortunately the location of Logan, built on the most Eastern portion of the city means that all airport traffic West and South of Boston will have to funnel through Downtown.

Boston would do better having an airport west of the city so that none of the airport traffic coming from or going to the surrounding suburbs have to drive through the city to reach it.

 

[stick n move]

I just want to post about how useless it is to have Logan Airport 3 miles away from Downtown yet it takes just as long as it would take a person to drive from SeaTac to Downtown Seattle or SFO to Downtown San Francisco.

Logan Car by Kent Xie, on Flickr

SeaTac Car by Kent Xie, on Flickr

SFO Car by Kent Xie, on Flickr

What's the point of having the airport so close again?

Because if it were as far as the others itd take over 45 mins.

The screenshot I took doesn't adjust but I did run the map with the timezone adjusted and the travel time was about 5 minutes longer and still shorter in terms of miles per minute.

Part of this I assume is that having an airport outside the most congested areas in the city means that airport traffic does not contribute to downtown traffic (i.e. someone from a Seattle suburb going to Sea-Tac would not need to drive through downtown to reach the airport). Perhaps putting an airport right next to Downtown may not be the most efficient idea after all. Unfortunately the location of Logan, built on the most Eastern portion of the city means that all airport traffic West and South of Boston will have to funnel through Downtown.

Boston would do better having an airport west of the city so that none of the airport traffic coming from or going to the surrounding suburbs have to drive through the city to reach it.

Boston is a bit over 700 thousand people in 2019, the metro area is what 4.5 million people? The airport serves the region and metro area. All 4.5 million people plus even more from further out have to go through downtown Boston plus cross a harbor to get to the airport. Hanscom off of i95 would have made much more sense if that plan for relocation had went through. I95 is the major artery for the region, connect it with a subway line, done. Logan is really not that beneficial being where it is because of the massive choke point especially being on the other side of the harbor. Its probably too late now, but I think this was a massive oversight due to traffic and stymieing construction forever. East Boston also could have been connected with a bridge allowing pedestrian/bike access w/o Logan as well.

Tbh it could still be economically viable, Hanscom already exists it would just need expansion, but the value of that Logan Airport land would be multiple multiple billions in development. Logan is maxed for expansion which is a hinderance to the region, maybe this plan should be revived? It would allow brand new terminals which LAX, Laguardia, JFK, are all doing anyways.

Norwood may be an ever better location, its also off of 95, more within the Boston area and has tonssss of room for expansion + no millitary base, and a commuter rail line that is just past a part that is already slated to be converted to orange. Plus part of rejection of the Hanscom expansion was outrage by the “rich people towns” over more overflights. Norwood already has 2 runways, with tons of room, Logan has 6, Londons Heathrow fits in more flights than Logan on its 2 runways.

https://marketurbanismreport.com/how-to-replace-bostons-logan-airport-pt-1/

Heres an article which actually describes how the commuter rail is actually the best option for airport service. Plus especially with NSRL that gives the entire region access to the airport. Either way this would mean a direct connection from the airport to south station. Norwood has Amtrak AND Commuter rail, the more I look into this the more it looks like a no brainer. With many airports building brand new terminals, when that decision comes up for Boston I think relocation needs to be on the table as well. A replacement would have to be close to the city, but also serve the multi millions of the metro, I think metro west is the answer.

Look at the immense amount of housing, expansion area the city would have, all with 0 filling in the harbor. We could double the size of the city, ease airport congestion, huge influx of cash which could go towards transit, solve housing, height restrictions...etc. Relocation may be THE future of this city imo.


https://marketurbanismreport.com/the-case-for-closing-bostons-logan-airport/