MA Casino Developments

[dshoost88]

Does that make Wynn's Everett casino the sole viable contender for this region?

Wynn needs to be "found suitable" by the Massachusetts Gaming Commission first. This is the same group that he recently referred to as "freshmen." We'll see how that goes...

I know that, but I don't think anyone has answered my question yet. With Milford and East Boston voting against their respective casino bids, is Wynn the only present casino bid eligible for consideration in this region of the state next spring? Or is there a bid I haven't heard about?

 

[Ron Newman]

assuming that Revere is dead (as I think it is), then yes, it's Wynn Everett or nobody at all.

 

[jdrinboston]

Write this down: It'll be on the ballot in 2014

As someone who moved to Mass. in 2007 and was completely skeeved out by the way the greyhound racing was outlawed by ballot petition, I'm curious to know if there is a limit on what the ballot process can outlaw.

For example, if you could get 70,000 people to sign a petition to outlaw general dentistry or antique dealing, could such a question be put on the ballot? And would it be enforceable if the people voted in favor?

Having grown up in a state without initiative petition, it's something that I find both interesting, and ultimately horrifying.

 

[Beton Brut]

I honestly don't know the answer to your question. Perhaps there's information on the Secretary of State's webpage. My guess is that common sense plays into what is allowable, so don't worry about your teeth and your Ming vase.

This issue has always been about elected officials, under the influence of a predatory industry with a nearly limitless source of funds, imposing a legislation that would create such a wide spectrum of fiscal and sociological negatives, without the consent of the electorate.

 

[jdrinboston]

I honestly don't know the answer to your question. Perhaps there's information on the Secretary of State's webpage. My guess is that common sense plays into what is allowable, so don't worry about your teeth and your Ming vase.

This issue has always been about elected officials, under the influence of a predatory industry with a nearly limitless source of funds, imposing a legislation that would create such a wide spectrum of fiscal and sociological negatives, without the consent of the electorate.

Yet, in 2012 the electorate returned Bob DeLeo, Kathy Reinstein, and Anthony Petrucelli, among others, to the legislature in large numbers. All three were adamant in their support for Suffolk Downs and gaming. All three re-elected without breaking a sweat.

How is that not "consent?"

 

[underground]

How is that not "consent?"

Because it's only consent if you agree with the outcome. Everything else is undemocratic, no matter how many elected officials, public officials, votes from elected officials, or votes for elected officials are involved.

 

[Ron Newman]

Right now there's a court case about the casino repeal petition, as the attorney general initially found it to violate the state constitution, but then stayed her own decision. Beton Brut might have more understanding of this than I do.

 

[whighlander]

As someone who moved to Mass. in 2007 and was completely skeeved out by the way the greyhound racing was outlawed by ballot petition, I'm curious to know if there is a limit on what the ballot process can outlaw.

For example, if you could get 70,000 people to sign a petition to outlaw general dentistry or antique dealing, could such a question be put on the ballot? And would it be enforceable if the people voted in favor?

Having grown up in a state without initiative petition, it's something that I find both interesting, and ultimately horrifying.

Jdrin -- There are four parts to the MA initiative process [not counting ballots involving the MA Constitution where its more complex]:
1) Signatures are gathered and verified -- if you need 70,000 you had better gather 100,000 as some of the signatures will be found to be invalid
2) the Attorney General must rule that the In initiative Petition addresses the kind of topic that can be dealt with and not involve something which needs a Constitutional Amendment
3) the Campaign is conducted and the People Vote
4) the Legislature must act to implement the Initiative Petition

Note that #4 is not necessarily a "Fait Accompli" -- when the Legislature increased the State Income Tax to 6.75% from 5% -- the increase was challenged by Initiative Petition which passed overwhelmingly -- the Legislature chose to roll back the tax rate in stages to its current 5.25%

There have been other cases where the Legislature chose to ignore the "Will of the People" in its entirety -- this can happen because in general no one in the Legislature ever loses a reelection campaign and many have no serious opposition

 

[TheRifleman]

assuming that Revere is dead (as I think it is), then yes, it's Wynn Everett or nobody at all.

How can Everett go through as part of the land is in Boston. Now that E.Boston has rejected the Casino how can this plan actually go through?

Also Somerville, Charlestown and other surrounding towns are going to fight this since it pretty much effects their towns.

This location faces a serious uphill battle.
#1 Land is not entirely 100% Everetts
#2 Surrounding Towns don't want it.
#3 Wynn will be begging for Taxpayers money to get this enviromentally acceptable to actually build on. (This could take 10 years)


I expect WYNN will give up on this site when the lawsuits from other cities start to get wynn of the situation.

If Marty Walsh is 100% on board with the Casino that might help its chances in my opinion but I don't think he would want his legacy to be based on a casino in Everett.

 

[Ron Newman]

Wynn claims that his development plan is 100% on Everett land, and Mayor Menino decided not to contest this claim. It's probably too late for Mayor Walsh to reverse this decision.

 

[whighlander]

I honestly don't know the answer to your question. Perhaps there's information on the Secretary of State's webpage. My guess is that common sense plays into what is allowable, so don't worry about your teeth and your Ming vase.

This issue has always been about elected officials, under the influence of a predatory industry with a nearly limitless source of funds, imposing a legislation that would create such a wide spectrum of fiscal and sociological negatives, without the consent of the electorate.

Bret --- How can you seriously make a statement like " elected officials, under the influence of a predatory industry with a nearly limitless source of funds, imposing a legislation that would create such a wide spectrum of fiscal and sociological negatives, without the consent of the electorate "

These are the same elected officials many of whom have no serious opposition to reelection -- many of whom only fear the letter from the US Attorney informing them that they are a target of a Grand Jury. This is the same Legislature where everything is a deal -- and no deal is too small

Come-on -- if you are talking bout sociological negatives just look to Beacon Hill

Personally, I'd rather have legal casinos where the odds of winning are public knowledge than the Ponzi-Scheme posing as our elected representatives.

Today we have a Legislature and Governor who spend months arguing about the magnitude of ostensibly desperately needed new taxes -- with the majority of these new taxes devoted to improving transportation infrastructure. Desperate for new taxes despite there being unexpected growth in revenues from the existing taxes.

We are constantly reassured that the funds raised from the gas tax will be dedicated only to transportation -- yet when we look we find out that 2/3 is going to the General Funds.

You talk about Casinos and corruption yet we live in a state in which the pension system of the MBTA is a "State Secret." A State in which the tax on when of the most vibrant and dynamic businesses in the economy is target for a tax -- and then the same people who voted overwhelmingly for this tax -- vote overwhelmingly to repeal it a few months later.

NO!!! -- If that is the alternative -- give me Casinos any day!

 

[jdrinboston]

Jdrin -- There are four parts to the MA initiative process [not counting ballots involving the MA Constitution where its more complex]:
1) Signatures are gathered and verified -- if you need 70,000 you had better gather 100,000 as some of the signatures will be found to be invalid
2) the Attorney General must rule that the In initiative Petition addresses the kind of topic that can be dealt with and not involve something which needs a Constitutional Amendment
3) the Campaign is conducted and the People Vote
4) the Legislature must act to implement the Initiative Petition

Note that #4 is not necessarily a "Fait Accompli" -- when the Legislature increased the State Income Tax to 6.75% from 5% -- the increase was challenged by Initiative Petition which passed overwhelmingly -- the Legislature chose to roll back the tax rate in stages to its current 5.25%

There have been other cases where the Legislature chose to ignore the "Will of the People" in its entirety -- this can happen because in general no one in the Legislature ever loses a reelection campaign and many have no serious opposition

Thank you for the information. My question still remains though. Is there a limit on how wacky these questions can be? I reference my earlier question as to whether or not something as mundane and basic as the practice of "dentistry" be outlawed by the petition process?

I didn't realize that there was a Step 4. Frankly, I'm somewhat surprised that the legislature allowed the dog tracks to be outlawed following that vote. I've never stepped foot in a dog track in my life and don't intend to. Still, it just seemed kind of creepy to allow a majority of voters to outlaw an entire business on a popular whim.

 

[whighlander]

How can Everett go through as part of the land is in Boston. Now that E.Boston has rejected the Casino how can this plan actually go through?

Also Somerville, Charlestown and other surrounding towns are going to fight this since it pretty much effects their towns.

This location faces a serious uphill battle.
#1 Land is not entirely 100% Everetts
#2 Surrounding Towns don't want it.
#3 Wynn will be begging for Taxpayers money to get this enviromentally acceptable to actually build on. (This could take 10 years)


I expect WYNN will give up on this site when the lawsuits from other cities start to get wynn of the situation.

If Marty Walsh is 100% on board with the Casino that might help its chances in my opinion but I don't think he would want his legacy to be based on a casino in Everett.

Riff -- none of the above matters -- the Legislature smells CASH -- in such as situation -- they are like a pack of Pit Bulls in the back room of a meat market after hours

 

[TheRifleman]

Riff -- none of the above matters -- the Legislature smells CASH -- in such as situation -- they are like a pack of Pit Bulls in the back room of a meat market after hours

The problem is #3 building on contaimated land will be a major issue. And a major taxpayer's headache which will affect everybody. Wynn will not use his own money to clean that toxic pit.
(Not including infrastructure) If you thought Suffolk location was bad. Everett's is worse. (MBTA is the only advantage for this location) But we are talking BILLIONS for upgrades here.

Monsanto should be liable for the toxic shit they left. (EPA should be all over this)

If Wynn was a likable guy and people in this state loved him I would say defintely but I see Wynn looking for another site after dealing with the endless amounts of RED TAPE in this state.

 

[Bergeron37]

How can Everett go through as part of the land is in Boston. Now that E.Boston has rejected the Casino how can this plan actually go through?

Also Somerville, Charlestown and other surrounding towns are going to fight this since it pretty much effects their towns.

This location faces a serious uphill battle.
#1 Land is not entirely 100% Everetts
#2 Surrounding Towns don't want it.
#3 Wynn will be begging for Taxpayers money to get this enviromentally acceptable to actually build on. (This could take 10 years)


I expect WYNN will give up on this site when the lawsuits from other cities start to get wynn of the situation.

If Marty Walsh is 100% on board with the Casino that might help its chances in my opinion but I don't think he would want his legacy to be based on a casino in Everett.

No other town has a say in the matter. Everett passed it, Boston did not contest the land argument. If Wynn is found suitable, nothing will stop him from building except Steve Wynn himself (if he decides he'd rather not build).

 

[TheRifleman]

No other town has a say in the matter. Everett passed it, Boston did not contest the land argument. If Wynn is found suitable, nothing will stop him from building except Steve Wynn himself (if he decides he'd rather not build).

Not true: I'm not sure on the facts of the land situation. If the land is all Everett maybe your right. But if they find out that some of that parcel is part Boston. This deal is OVER.

 

[Ron Newman]

Some part of the parcel is in Boston, but Wynn claims that he is building only on the part in Everett. Menino had an opportunity to contest this, and decided not to.

 

[whighlander]

Not true: I'm not sure on the facts of the land situation. If the land is all Everett maybe your right. But if they find out that some of that parcel is part Boston. This deal is OVER.

Riff --- You are very brave even making that statement -- Consider you the poor butcher and a pack of a dozen Pitt Bulls in the back of the meat market with the doors locked over night

The Pitt Bulls are the members of the Legislature and Governor who smell something of the order of 1B$ per year without having Barbara Anderson screaming Taxation without Representation

You are the antiCasino folks -- the meat -- that's the $1B/year

Try to walk out of that room with a tray full of steaks -- you would be lucky to drop the tray and not be part of their meal

 

[TheRifleman]

Riff --- You are very brave even making that statement -- Consider you the poor butcher and a pack of a dozen Pitt Bulls in the back of the meat market with the doors locked over night

The Pitt Bulls are the members of the Legislature and Governor who smell something of the order of 1B$ per year without having Barbara Anderson screaming Taxation without Representation

You are the antiCasino folks -- the meat -- that's the $1B/year

Try to walk out of that room with a tray full of steaks -- you would be lucky to drop the tray and not be part of their meal

I'm betting on a aka (Beton Brut) to step forward to squash this deal because it has no Merit. The PittBulls on Beacon Hill are fucking idiots and that is why that got SMOKED from a small group of Old school Revere and Eastie Residents.

Whigh, I am not against casinos in this state or the city. But I am against them putting them in areas that are already built up to capacity which will cause major Traffic issues for the city of Boston especially for the North Shore Residents.

Everett location along with the Traffic infrastructure cannot handle a billion dollar casino in this location. The traffic is a nightmare now and this is a major connection that flows in and out of the city of Boston heading on 93.

F-Line Dudley should back me up on this location and what would it take to actually make traffic flow at a normal pace. (I don't think its possible in this area)

 

[whighlander]

I'm betting on a aka (Beton Brut) to step forward to squash this deal because it has no Merit. The PittBulls on Beacon Hill are fucking idiots and that is why that got SMOKED from a small group of Old school Revere and Eastie Residents.

Whigh, I am not against casinos in this state or the city. But I am against them putting them in areas that are already built up to capacity which will cause major Traffic issues for the city of Boston especially for the North Shore Residents.

Everett location along with the Traffic infrastructure cannot handle a billion dollar casino in this location. The traffic is a nightmare now and this is a major connection that flows in and out of the city of Boston heading on 93.

F-Line Dudley should back me up on this location and what would it take to actually make traffic flow at a normal pace. (I don't think its possible in this area)

Riff -if Steve Wynn wants that Glittering Giant Ad on the Skyline -- he has the expertise and persistence to make it work -- the old schoolies will be out of their leaugue