What has kept you or the other 1/3rd of Boston and without cars from taking intercity buses that cover the same distance for about the same cost and time as the future commuter rail?
MassDOT Rail: Springfield Hub (East-West, NNERI, Berkshires, CT-Valley-VT-Quebec)
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Charlie_mta
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I like New Bedford well enough. I went to UMass Dartmouth for my civil engineering BS degree, it was a great college, and I loved going there. I really liked the Paul Rudolph design of the campus and its buildings. I was the first, and only, person in my family to ever go to college, as my parents hadn't even finished high school. New Bedford was alright. You can't beat the location;: on the ocean, really nice beaches very close by, and a sense of history. I didn't mean to come across as knocking it.
For sentimental reasons, I like Greenfield better, as my family roots go back centuries just west of there in the small town of Heath, plus I spent a lot of time in Heath and Greenfield as a kid on trips with my dad to see our extended family, so I am a bit biased.
I mean... The decline of intercity bus ridership at this point is fully a national trend. Dattco who was the prior operator on the New Bedford to BOS route pulled the plug in early 2023 citing monthly losses of 30k, until Peter Pan stepped in to offer the route. The Coach USA/Megabus bankruptcy in June just really puts a point on it - but I don't know that you can really point to a single causal factor.
Most interestingly, that's largely even as the onboard buses themselves has getting increasingly better. Wi-Fi, leather seats, etc, with premium offerings like the Jet or Napaway- despite claims of popularity, they haven't expanded or have indeed shutdown - and that's in corridor service. Perhaps people are less willing to put up with multi hour bus rides in an environment where Spirit and Frontier are available will get you there cheaper and faster? I know that late last year there were some calls to nationalize greyhound, and that some states have basically started their own services - Colorado's Bustang, Virginia Breeze, Ohio GoBus, all of which appear to be doing well by all accounts.
Koopzilla24
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It's not like I've never been to New Bedford before but the ease and comfort of a train as opposed to a bus on a highway make it a much nicer proposition for a day trip. Rail travel is simply more attractive to people and gets attention. The same goes for why it'd be good for Greenfield when you could argue the same that people already just drive there since car ownership is much higher there. There's also the capacity restriction of the intercity bus as well as the subjective fun of travelling with friends and family on a train versus the bus (chatting loudly, sitting together in big groups, not being tied down to sitting still in your seat, etc). Add on top of all that more people are familiarized with taking the train in Greater Boston than an intercity bus and many probably didn't know it existed or weren't interested. Which boils down to the most important answer to your question: Maybe nobody really gave a damn about New Bedford before when it was only connected by a few buses or a lengthy drive, but now that it's a part of the MBTA Commuter Rail system it'll be more present in people's minds as "hey maybe we should head to New Bedford for a day?" Simply seeing it on the Commuter Rail map is like free advertisement for the two cities. The only negative that can be taken from it is "less ridership than anticipated" which isn't really that negative if it added a vital preferred transportation option for some people and brings at least some additional tourism and interest.
Ah my mistake for misreading into that. I also enjoy Greenfield more than New Bedford and I struggle to find something positive to say about Fall River besides Battleship Cove, which is far from where the Phase I terminus will be, but I really believe both Greenfield and New Bedford have so much more to offer as historic New England cities than most Bay Staters and surrounding New Englanders realize that I hope rail connections would spark renewed interest in.
HenryAlan
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More than that, I suspect a great deal of people figured a New Bedford and other places only reachable by bus weren't worth giving a damn about. That's kind of where I was at for a long time regarding the area. Even as an avid Moby Dick fan, New Bedford seemed both remote and uninviting before talk about the train started to filter in to my consciousness. In more recent years, I have visited, and found the downtown and waterfront quite charming.
millerm277
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I'm not saying you're wrong about the decline of intercity bus usage, but Daatco's service was pretty much a city commuter only service.
2019 service levels were: 3 trips per day weekdays (+1 on Fri), 0 trips on Sat, 1 trip on Sun.
Mon-Thurs:
Inbounds from NB were 5:00AM, 7:00AM, 3:00PM.
Outbounds from Boston were 7:00AM, 4:30PM, 5:30PM.
That wasn't really a service usable by anyone other than a commuter.
I'm dubious of the proposition that $1.1 billion dollars is worth spending for nice day trips to the tune of $20 million/annum in ongoing operations. Especially when $40 million could buy a number of new intercity coaches and another $100m could be a seeder to many years of all-day intercity service to/from the South Coast in many directions vastly improving mobility for hub and non-hub trips.
It's quite charming even after stepping off a Peter Pan or previously Dattco bus. ;-)
Koopzilla24
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Buses stuck in traffic with very limited capacity compared to the train make them not a reasonable option for most people to take for regular trips. The train comes with trip comfort and schedule reliability that a bus in mixed traffic cannot compete with making it work for a much larger net of people new and/or existing. It will also be connecting NB/FR to significant places other than Boston that the buses don't go such as Quincy, Brockton, and Bridgewater. There's an entirely different interconnected mobility network that comes with the SCR project that the prior DATTCO routings did not supply and it is a much more efficient and usable way of doing so than if you were to try to provide the same thing with buses.
Regardless of all the reasons for rail over intercity bus here, $1.1bil in capital costs over half a decade for a project that not only reintroduces passenger rail but also greatly improves freight rail in a region of 300k+ residents is a worthwhile investment for the state to make economically but also a drop in the hat for this state's $759.5 billion annual GDP and $58bil annual budget. The 20mil/year in operations is also a ~1% increase of the MBTA's annual budget so really not a significant factor. I also like the idea of the state also spending a measly $140mil, plus whatever $mil for annual operations costs, for a Southeast Mass intercity bus network.
Nothing charming about a bus stuck in traffic
Are we still talking about Northern Tier, or are we talking about SCR? Either way, that's why you give MassDOT contracted coaches the ability to run on the shoulder. Bus-on-shoulder, even if limited to when traffic is below a given speed, makes it a more attractive and reliable proposition.
bigeman312
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There are many reasons why I (and others) don’t ride intercity buses places, but do ride trains to comparable locations. Speaking for myself only, but as a single anecdote that exists in a sea of many many many people (as evidenced by the data), one of those reasons is the ability to bring a bicycle. I’ve taken the train to Rockport, Gloucester, and Manchester-by-the-Sea, and biked along the water, to beaches, to businesses, and sometimes back to Boston. I take the train to West Concord and ride the Bruce Freeman up to Lowell, patronizing businesses, then take the train back from there. I take the train to Concord, then bike back to Boston via the Reformatory Branch and Minuteman trails, patronizing local businesses and stopping by at ponds along the way. Not everybody is a cyclist who enjoys to take the train to facilitate rides in new places, but many have their reasons. And that fact is evidenced by the data referenced above.
Would I take a bus to Greenfield, Fall River or New Bedford? Absolutely not. Would I take a train to those places, then ride around that part of the state and check out the natural beauty, built environment, and businesses that exist there? You betcha. Everyone has their reasons. The bottom line is that people, for a myriad of reasons, prefer to take a Commuter/Regional train over an intercity bus and I don’t blame them one bit.
Would I take a bus to Greenfield, Fall River or New Bedford? Absolutely not. Would I take a train to those places, then ride around that part of the state and check out the natural beauty, built environment, and businesses that exist there? You betcha. Everyone has their reasons. The bottom line is that people, for a myriad of reasons, prefer to take a Commuter/Regional train over an intercity bus and I don’t blame them one bit.
My wife and I have done at least one North Shore bike ride a year this way. So fucking great, show up to North Station, grab a newspaper, take your bicycle and enjoy an incredibly beautiful train ride up to the North Shore. Also the beaches are much cheaper if you show up by bicycle (they used to be free, but nothing is anymore)