MBTA Buses & Infrastructure

Small sign of Hope in the youngsters in the city.
This young guy who works in my group says the other day, he's done with riding the train. The bus is awesome as he says.

Of course he's commuting from out by BC to Kendall square, and the bus is a much straighter shot with much less walking..

Small isolated incident, but good to hear someone say it.

To Cybah's point maybe the stigma is disappearing, at least with the new youth movement in the city.
 
As a Boston transplant (albeit a long time ago) I never understood the bus stigma.

I do prefer the trains for speed -- when they make sense. But I use the buses all the time for cross-cutting routes where taking the train is just slow, indirect and painful.

With the apps, bus service is not bad at all (could be more frequent on some routes; could use more bus lanes -- Mass Ave, #1 bus, I am talking about you!)
 
Smartphones and apps have infinitely improved the usability of Boston's buses. The routes are irregular, so you used to need to memorize a lot of information. Smartphone helps with that. And frequency and OTP is still a weak spot on almost every route, which the the apps help with. I had given up on buses entirely until the live tracking apps came out. Now I use them occasionally.
 
fattony said:
Smartphones and apps have infinitely improved the usability of Boston's buses. The routes are irregular, so you used to need to memorize a lot of information. Smartphone helps with that. And frequency and OTP is still a weak spot on almost every route, which the the apps help with. I had given up on buses entirely until the live tracking apps came out. Now I use them occasionally.
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Same. I was apart of the pilot for NextBus in with the MBTA because i am a 111/116/117 rider.

I used to carry around a large stack of paper schedules and print outs for various buses I ride. The apps really make all the difference, especially if you are in an area where you aren't familiar with what routes are nearby. GPS on your app tells you.

Its easier now with the apps because you know how long you're going to wait.. so you can have that extra cup of coffee, or hit the rest room before you go OR not wait out in a cold, snowy, street corner for a bus that may or may not show up.
 
cybah said:
Same. I was apart of the pilot for NextBus in with the MBTA because i am a 111/116/117 rider.

I used to carry around a large stack of paper schedules and print outs for various buses I ride. The apps really make all the difference, especially if you are in an area where you aren't familiar with what routes are nearby. GPS on your app tells you.

Its easier now with the apps because you know how long you're going to wait.. so you can have that extra cup of coffee, or hit the rest room before you go OR not wait out in a cold, snowy, street corner for a bus that may or may not show up.
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Same here. I love that I can wait until I see the bus coming down Broadway thru Revere on the apps and not leave my apartment until it's 5 min away, especially in the heat or cold.
 
JeffDowntown said:
As a Boston transplant (albeit a long time ago) I never understood the bus stigma.

I do prefer the trains for speed -- when they make sense. But I use the buses all the time for cross-cutting routes where taking the train is just slow, indirect and painful.

With the apps, bus service is not bad at all (could be more frequent on some routes; could use more bus lanes -- Mass Ave, #1 bus, I am talking about you!)
Click to expand...

Also speaking as a transplant from a long time ago, I can say that I ride the buses fairly often, and agree that the apps have made them much more useful. That said, I think the real problem with MBTA buses isn't stigma, but that they are, in fact, often not all that useful. We do not have enough cross town routes. The vast majority are oriented toward feeding rapid transit routes, and while they are quite successful from that standpoint, they fail to a large extent as a singular mode option.

As an example of this point, think about Roslindale and JP. They are right next to each other, but there really aren't any buses serving both neighborhoods with the sort of exception of the 38, which really only skirts the edge of Rozzie. Why can't some 39s be through routed to Roslindale Square? Why can't some 34s be through routed to the monument? A lot of trips taken by car or not at all might be more likely taken on the bus under such routing. I get that feeding the subway is important, but there are lots of trips that might not require the subway and shouldn't require two to three buses.
 
Here's a question for someone like Winstonboogie: how tight a turn can a standard bus "do"?

Could a new bus "do" this turn in West Medford Sq from Playstead Rd southbound to High St westbound:

I ask because F-Line and I recently had an exchange (at RR.net) in which we proposed changes to the buses once the GLX opens to College Ave, roughly as follows:

A new route from Winchester Center to Davis Sq overlaid on the:
134 (Winchester - Wellington)
95 (Playstead Rd West Medford - Sullivan Sq)
94 (High St West Medford - Davis Sq)

Google Map of a 94-95-134 bus

- Winchester connected to both Green & Red (instead of just Orange on the 134)
- W.Medford & Hillside gets a bus that doubles-up both the 80 (to GLX) and 94 (to Davis)

Other Route Changes that seem in order once the GLX gets to College Ave:

Repurpose the 32x Express Routes (Medford to Haymarket)

Route 326 (express from W.Med & High St-Med Sq to Haymarket)
- remove I-93 segment
- run instead from Med Sq to Davis Sq via 96's GLX College Ave Connection
- could extend to Winchester
- or eliminated entirely to "fund" the 94-95-134 mashup, above

Route 325 (express from N.Med & Salem Ave-Med Sq to Haymarket)
- remove I-93 segment
- run instead from Med Sq to Davis Sq via 96's GLX College Ave Connection
- could extend to Stoneham via Fellsway West & 132's route

Reform the 80s
Extend the 80 from Arlington Center to Arlington Heights
- provides GLX access to Arlington Center & "outer" Arlington @ College Ave
(free up fleet for this by truncating 80 to Union Sq GLX and stop reduction close to College, Ball, & Gilman Sqs)

Extend the 89 from Clarendon Hill to Arlington Center (full time)
- provides GLX access to Arlington Center & "inner" Arlington @ Ball Sq.
(free up fleet for this by a 2-to-1 stop-reduction along Broadway)



------------
Then, when the GLX gets to MVP, I would propose:
Extend the 88 via North St to MVP
(truncate the 88 to Union Sq)

Do a CT/Ring route that'd hit some mix of
+ Alewife
+ Clarendon Hill
+ GLX
+ Medford Sq
+ Orange Line
 
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I would go a little further and divert the 350 to Medford instead of Alewife, or introduce another route that connects the 350 corridor with the Green Line via West Medford (like a 350A, North Burlington to Medford, or even a connecting route from Arlington Heights). It would likely be a quicker route downtown, and avoid the rush hour gridlock that plagues Alewife Brook Parkway.
 
A typical inner turning radius of a standard 40-foot bus is 21.5 feet,
 
In the GLX2MVP hearing last night, they showed a picture that said that the 101 Bus ran on Boston Ave. Shown this image as a blue line:
23847228_10154907407436681_2493497750346653843_o.jpg


This is technically true, but only (as far as I know) for a few trips per day, when the 101 serves as a school bus for Medford High at the AM rush and "afterschool" times.
https://www.mbta.com/schedules/101/line?variant=1010139#variant

How many other cities have a similar "school bus variant" of a standard MBTA bus? How, as a practical matter, do people actually use these buses (how do they learn when a bus is in "school bus mode")?
 
Arlington said:
How many other cities have a similar "school bus variant" of a standard MBTA bus? How, as a practical matter, do people actually use these buses (how do they learn when a bus is in "school bus mode")?
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69 & 72 have some interesting routing for single trips centered around arrival/departure at CRLS.
 
39 does as well, going from JP to Longwood Ave for the BLS.
 
I believe the 38/37/36/35 all do their normal routes then down the 39 route after Forest Hills to BLS, too. To answer the question as to if people actually use them: well, kids definitely do, and any non-high school person who also got on the bus had an instant look of regret/grimace when they realized they were stuck on a bus full of high school kids.
 
Also the 34 and 32, and some of the 2x numbered Dorchester buses. And then there are similar re-routings on many routes to Humbolt and Townsend for BLA students.
 
Arlington said:
how tight a turn can a standard bus "do"?
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https://www.newflyer.com/site-content/uploads/2017/09/729-NFL-Xcelsior-Final.pdf lists a 44' turn radius for both the 40' and 60' variant of typical New Flyer buses, although it notes that the radius can vary with different wheel types.

https://www.proterra.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/08/Proterra-Catalyst-Vehicle-Specs.pdf lists a 41.9' turn radius for 42.5' long Proterra buses.

A new route from Winchester Center to Davis Sq overlaid on the:
134 (Winchester - Wellington)
95 (Playstead Rd West Medford - Sullivan Sq)
94 (High St West Medford - Davis Sq)

Google Map of a 94-95-134 bus

- Winchester connected to both Green & Red (instead of just Orange on the 134)
Click to expand...

That certainly sounds like a good routing to me.

Extend the 80 from Arlington Center to Arlington Heights
- provides GLX access to Arlington Center & "outer" Arlington @ College Ave
(free up fleet for this by truncating 80 to Union Sq GLX and stop reduction close to College, Ball, & Gilman Sqs)

Extend the 89 from Clarendon Hill to Arlington Center (full time)
- provides GLX access to Arlington Center & "inner" Arlington @ Ball Sq.
(free up fleet for this by a 2-to-1 stop-reduction along Broadway)
Click to expand...

Why not extend both 87 and 89 to Arlington Heights, and eliminate 79? According to the PDF schedules, 87's trip from Arlington Center to Davis (8:20 AM to 8:34 AM is 14 minutes) is faster than 79's trip from Arlington Center to Alewife (8:36 AM to 8:54 AM is 18 minutes), and then a lot of riders would avoid a few additional minutes of Red Line time from Alewife to Davis.

80 seems to be the route that most closely duplicates the Green Line extension, and I think it might be best to truncate it to only cover Arlington Center to College Ave once the Green Line Extension is open.

Then, when the GLX gets to MVP, I would propose:
Extend the 88 via North St to MVP
(truncate the 88 to Union Sq)
Click to expand...

I find it suboptimal that 88 and 90 both run along Highland Ave as separate routes which duplicate each other between Davis and McGrath; the combined headways aren't terribly even. Also, in the post-Assembly Sq Orange Line world, 90's duplication of the Orange Line between Wellington and Sullivan seems likely to not be high ridership. I think having a combined Davis to Sullivan via Highland route would make the most sense, but that route should possibly not be serving the Cross St segment of 90's current route, so maybe we should have a new route serving Assembly Sq, Cross St, and then Prospect St to Central Sq in Cambridge and maybe beyond to Boston University and maybe Coolidge Corner.
 
Joel N. Weber II said:
Why not extend both 87 and 89 to Arlington Heights, and eliminate 79? According to the PDF schedules, 87's trip from Arlington Center to Davis (8:20 AM to 8:34 AM is 14 minutes) is faster than 79's trip from Arlington Center to Alewife (8:36 AM to 8:54 AM is 18 minutes), and then a lot of riders would avoid a few additional minutes of Red Line time from Alewife to Davis.
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Nice. This is something the T should do *right now*
 
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