New Red and Orange Line Cars

(Quote)
The crossovers that allow trains to move from Wellington Yard onto the main tracks are nearing the end of their useful life and are in need of replacement. This work is necessary to support the new Orange Line trains coming into service—the new crossovers will provide access to the vehicle test track and will help ensure a smooth transition to and from the main line.

Replacing the tracks will also help improve safety and reliability of the Orange Line. (End Quote)

I stand corrected. Must've put this out after yesterday' mishap-.
 
Looks like its outright bus-sub now instead of single track operations after this mishap; in addition, the entire fleet of CRRC trains both Orange and Red have been pulled from service for the time being. *why couldn't it have been one of the 1200s that derailed :(* Possibly an overreaction, possibly not.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1372022900631420930
 
Wow! A three-week full-time bustitution is no small thing.

Obviously there have been prolonged bustitutions on the Green Line: the ongoing Lechmere Viaduct rehab, the track & intersection upgrades last year, etc.

When is the last time there was a bustitution for this long on the HRT (Blue/Red/Orange) system? Wollaston closure? What about for more than just one station? Winter 2015? Longer ago?
 
This is probably the fourth or fifth time that the Orange Line had lost the benefits of the new cars. The Red Line's first. Its only new train so far. I thought that these tracks were already taken care of. Looks like they'll spend the first few years of their lives, at least, being yanked off the tracks due to technicalities. :(
 
Last edited:
Sucks to run into issues, but now is the time to find them with T ridership in the dumps due to Covid.
 
bigeman312 said:
Wow! A three-week full-time bustitution is no small thing.

Obviously there have been prolonged bustitutions on the Green Line: the ongoing Lechmere Viaduct rehab, the track & intersection upgrades last year, etc.

When is the last time there was a bustitution for this long on the HRT (Blue/Red/Orange) system? Wollaston closure? What about for more than just one station? Winter 2015? Longer ago?
Click to expand...
Sounds like the incident has triggered some accelerated switch/track replacement that was already planned.

But instead of taking service down for 4 months of weekends, they are pulling the bandaid off and closing the section for three weeks to get the work done faster. Given low COVID ridership, this makes sense.

Probably a good move from a PR sense too, since the hoi polloi and media are really anxious to blame the accident on the "Chinese cars", whether or not they are at fault. Don't want another incident there.
 
But they could've at least let the one new train on the Red Line alone & let it continue to run. There is just no sense in saying;The new trains have started running now!!, if they are going to keep on yanking them off the tracks for things that are their fault. You just can't use them with decades-old tracks & signaling. They knew better. Get all the stuff done first, then let the new trains get a chance to prove themselves worthy to remain in good standing. They were just putting the carriage in front of the horse. :(
 
Last edited:
I struggle to think of an industry comparator with as many derailments as the T on rapid transit. To a layman it feels like a demonic "Oprah's Least Favorite Things" and all the "gifts" are derailments on every rail based mode since the beginning of the Baker Administration.
 
Interesting though that the train had over 100 passengers midday. Shows that t ridership is coming back (right as service is being cut).
 
tysmith95 said:
Interesting though that the train had over 100 passengers midday. Shows that t ridership is coming back (right as service is being cut).
Click to expand...

Depends on where you start your reference at.

Relative to the recent January low - Yes, ridership is climbing.

But that's barely back to the October levels (before ridership crashed again w/case spikes), and looks like <30% of pre-pandemic ridership.

Raw ridership data through 3/16 here: https://massdot.app.box.com/s/21j0q5di9ewzl0abt6kdh5x8j8ok9964 (Gated Station Validations by Line).
 
Just as when something seems to be gaining a little momentum, seems like it gets smacked down again. Ever since August, 2019, these new trains have been put on the tracks & then yanked off. They need to work on the tracks & signaling themselves.

When will they learn? Can't mix the old with the new. This is what seemed to be happening with the Breta Type 9 trolleys & the Kinki Type 7's , especially at the Riverside junction in the tunnel. I think that they knew, or should've known that. They need to get rid of old tracks in problematic switch areas, or they will just keep on coming back to haunt them. :(
 
millerm277 said:
Raw ridership data through 3/16 here: https://massdot.app.box.com/s/21j0q5di9ewzl0abt6kdh5x8j8ok9964 (Gated Station Validations by Line).
Click to expand...

This is great! Thanks for the data. Some tidbits I mined. Here is where the ridership is as of Friday, 3/12/21 (the most recent complete data set provided here):

LineRelative to Peak DateRelative to '20 PeakRelative to Friday, 2/28/20 Pre-Pandemic BaselineRelative to MinimumRelative to Friday, 4/10/20 Mid-Pandemic 'Full-Service' Minimum
Blue32% (10/31/18, Red Sox parade)42% (Thursday, 3/5)44%9369% (5/24/20, Blue Line shutdown. Not sure why validations were recorded)339%
Green19% (10/31/18, Red Sox parade)25% (Friday, 2/28)25%921% (Sunday, 4/12/20)431%
Orange22% (2/5/2019, Patriots parade)26% (Wednesday, 2/12, Bruins - Canadiens)28%1128% (Sunday, 12/13/20, Orange Line shutdown between TMC and Sullivan)332%
Red20% (2/5/2019, Patriots parade)24% (Wednesday, 2/12), Bruins - Canadiens)25%674% (Sunday, 4/12/20)331%
Silver13% (Friday, 3/29/2019)13% (Thursday, 2/27)14%880% (Sunday, 4/12/20)338%

Key takeaways:
  • These modes have increased roughly 3x-4.5x since the lowest ridership period of mid-April.
  • Blue Line has 40%-50% of its pre-pandemic ridership.
  • Green/Orange/Red Lines have 20%-30% of their pre-pandemic ridership.
 
So let me get this straight; Will the new trains return to service once this problem with the switch tracks is squashed at Wellington? There are many of them on the entire line. I think that they should investigate most of them to see whether or not they are alright. Or will those be a problem also & another excuse to yank the new trains off the line again?

The old trains, even though they are on borrowed time, seem to be getting by from the skin of their own teeth. As long as the new trains keep being taken out of service, they hang around longer. :(
 
HelloBostonHi said:
So the going theory is that the new cars are too heavy for the old tracks in Wellington: https://www.nbcboston.com/investiga...s-derailed-six-times-what-went-wrong/2336846/
Click to expand...
Some numbers: at AW0, the #12 Hawker Siddeley cars weighed: A: 68,780lbs, (cab) and B: 67,360lbs.

The technical specs from the original procurement in 2013, also AW0, called for max weights of A/cab: 75,125 lbs. B: 72,800 lbs on the orange line. I can't seem to find detailed specs for the new CRRC cars.

Now I'm curious; could it actually be both the greater weight (assuming the CRRC cars are right at that limit) and the difference in weight between cab and trailer in married pair, as the cab can be ~2400lbs heaver than the trailer, while in the #12 cars that difference is only ~500 lbs? Though, accounting for variability with a full passenger load it really shouldn't matter.
 
Stlin said:
Some numbers: at AW0, the #12 Hawker Siddeley cars weighed: A: 68,780lbs, (cab) and B: 67,360lbs.

The technical specs from the original procurement in 2013, also AW0, called for max weights of A/cab: 75,125 lbs. B: 72,800 lbs on the orange line. I can't seem to find detailed specs for the new CRRC cars.
Click to expand...

Yes, but how much less do they weigh in 2021 with 40 years of corrosion and speed holes slowly making them more efficient?
 
Stlin said:
Some numbers: at AW0, the #12 Hawker Siddeley cars weighed: A: 68,780lbs, (cab) and B: 67,360lbs.

The technical specs from the original procurement in 2013, also AW0, called for max weights of A/cab: 75,125 lbs. B: 72,800 lbs on the orange line.
Click to expand...

Quick railway terminology explainer:
AW0, empty weight, AW1, weight with seated passenger load, AW2, weight with average peak-‐hour passenger load, AW3, crush loaded weight.. [in] US standards, passengers are usually assumed to weigh an average of 155 lb (70 kg).
Click to expand...
 
Heh. That AW1-3 weight metric they're using is hilariously outdated. The average weight of a U.S. adult female is 15 lbs. heavier than that...U.S. adult males 35 lbs. heavier. 155's a cromulent average for Brazil, be we a bit too THICC for that here. You couldn't make that average stick for Real 'Murcans even if you adjusted low for any onboard minors and took an unusually optimistic view of Greater Boston's fitness levels relative to the nation (both probably canceled out by the average bulk of personal belongings lugged per trip).
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Back
Top