Portland, ME - New Construction Continued

Noticed today that the Portland Data Center Building on Cumberland Avenue is currently having it's facade refreshed and painted. Due to it's visibility from I 295, this will be a nice improvement over the aged gray concrete look that had been neglected for many decades. At 108 ft, this structure was Maine's tallest when it was finally finished in 1908, two years prior to the opening of the Fidelity Building (Peoples United Bank) on Congress Street in 1910.

Detailed information on the building is difficult to find, but I was told that it was originally 5 floors around 1905 with the additional 3 floors added in 1908. Maybe John French could confirm the building's place in Portland's history at the turn of the century. We could use a couple of photos Corey!
 
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http://www.portlanddailysun.me/inde...7865-plans-for-fore-street-hotel-move-forward

This hotel will go back to the historic preservation board next week, review the color scheme changes (brick hue, textured panels) as well as lighting and sign placement details, and then come for a public hearing before the planning board, at which point a decision may be made, from how I understood things. The streetscape to this building will be a fantastic improvement.
 
grittys457 said:
And as suspected it's dead...

By Carol McCracken (Post # 1,228)

The construction of phase 2 of the Hampton Inn by the Sea has been delayed for at least a year. The second phase of the former Jordan’s Meats Co, located in Portland’s Old Port was to have begun this fall. The reason for the delay is the loss of a tenant in one of the buildings, according to sources close to the situation. Construction had been slated to begin on this $18 million dollar deal before the winter weather set in, but that won’t happen now.

This past August the city gave unanimous approval for a tax break for phase 2 of the development which was to have included street-level retail, offices and 18 high-end, ($500,000.)luxury condominiums on about an acre of land, with the entrance on India Street. Parking was to have been provided for both office workers and condominium owners.

In February of 2010, Mark Woglon and Greg Keish, principals in the Old Port Hospitality LLC, and officers in Opeeche Construction, NH., bought the former Jordan’s Meats Factory. Soon thereafter, the two submitted plans for the development of phase one of the property. But only three months later, the site was demolished by a major fire that sent smoke billowing all over Portland. The factory had been closed since 2005 and was a large employer in the area. In between 2005 and 2010, Westin Hotels purchased the property with the intent of developing the property, but never did.

Phase One of the development included a luxury Hampton Inn, whose franchise Wolgan owns, a Sebago Brewing Co. restaurant and Portside condominium units that reportedly sold quickly. All properties face on Fore Street which faces Portland Harbor.

No one at Opeeche Construction, NH, responded to a telephone call and an email from mhn.com
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Is this 40 India Street? If so that's too bad. My girlfriend and I were just looking at their website and thinking it would be a great location when we move back to Maine. The units are pricey though, starting at about half a million.
 
Max said:
Is this 40 India Street? If so that's too bad. My girlfriend and I were just looking at their website and thinking it would be a great location when we move back to Maine. The units are pricey though, starting at about half a million.
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Yeah, that's the one. Again, though, I have to say that this is, in my opinion, not an indication that this project won't happen, just that it won't start construction this fall. That's entirely different from saying it's a done deal. The project is fully approved and sitting in an ideal location. Why build without a tenant? And if a tenant is lined up in the winter, you can't build (frozen). And then the spring is prime hotel season (don't want to ruin business for Hampton Inn). But, I wouldn't be surprised if the same or a substantially similar project commences sometime next year. Otherwise, all of the money spent thus far (including cost of land) is wasted. That's not good business. You will see a project here, but not one starting this fall. This was a world class proposal and I hope the developers come forward with these plans when a tenant materializes and a good construction schedule is available.

$500,000 is pricey, but it's ten times less (literally) than the cost of units proposed on the same site 6 years ago ($5 million Westin penthouse) and if you look at the cars in MiCucci's parking lot during the day, plus the proximity to the coolest neighborhoods/districts in Maine (Old Port, Downtown, and Munjoy Hill), plus waterviews and a top notch recreational trail, it starts to make a little more sense.
 
Thanks for the info. I didn't realize the project depended so heavily on what I'm assuming would be the ground-floor tenants. Everything above the ground floor would be condos, right? According to their website at least half of the condos are under contract.

I assume they are looking for restaurants, retail, etc? Or are they able to lease the ground floor as office space?
 
There were two commercial components to this structure. Ground floor retail was one, and upper floor commercial office (two sided, at least, I think) was the other. Above that were the condos, to my understanding. I think, if I had to guess, the tenant that would pay the lion's share of the rent here would be in the commercial space. To fund a project like this, the different tenants balance one another out, you are right (meaning it typically isn't the case that one tenant in a mixed use structure makes or breaks a place), but that varies by developer's profit margin, which may have been thinner here than most people realized. Also, it's one thing to say a mixture of uses will help down the line if an existing tenant leaves, and another to build on speculation that one will show up. If you do the spec approach, and turn out to be wrong for at least a period of time, you are guaranteed a financial loss, whereas if you build with tenant commitments, you are simply facing a potential bump in the road later on if a tenant pulls out and doesn't renew a lease. Bottom line is -- why build empty space? There will be a project here, and I bet it will look very similar to what has been proposed. How similar probably depends on how soon a tenant lines up with an acceptable construction window. Also, if the land is sold, and the new owner doesn't also own the Hampton Inn property (i.e., if there is a division of the site), the new owner could line up a tenant and start building in the Spring without anymore regard to the hotel's tenants than someone across the street would have to pay, assuming there is no agreement to the contrary on which the sale is dependent, that is.
 
An eye-catching article was added to the PPH website this afternoon:

$17.5M hotel proposed for Old Port
It's the third hotel to be proposed in the Old Port since this summer.
By Randy Billings rbillings@mainetoday.com
Staff Writer


PORTLAND — One of the largest landowners in the city is hoping to build a Courtyard by Marriott in the Old Port.


J.B. Brown & Sons has proposed a 131-room hotel, 7,000-square-foot restaurant and 14 market-rate apartments at the corner of Commercial and Maple streets.

The plans were submitted to the city on Oct. 22. The project, estimated to cost $17.5 million, will need to be reviewed by the Historic Preservation Board and the Planning Board.

It's the third hotel to be proposed in the Old Port since this summer.
Vincent Veroneau, president and chief executive office for J.B. Brown, said he hopes to have his approvals in hand by the end of the year and begin construction in the spring. That would allow the development to open in May 2014, he said.
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This lot was previously proposed for an office building by J.B. Brown.

Also, when did Portland get the 45 degree view on Google Maps? Looks great (the quality of the image, not all the parking lots in this photo)!

gmap.png
 
Corey said:
An eye-catching article was added to the PPH website this afternoon:

$17.5M hotel proposed for Old Port
It's the third hotel to be proposed in the Old Port since this summer.
By Randy Billings rbillings@mainetoday.com
Staff Writer




This lot was previously proposed for an office building by J.B. Brown.

Also, when did Portland get the 45 degree view on Google Maps? Looks great (the quality of the image, not all the parking lots in this photo)!

gmap.png
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I just noticed the article at lunch. Looks like hotel is where the money is at. This will keep the others on their toes. HP board looks like it will have the first renderings.
 
Patrick said:
I just noticed the article at lunch. Looks like hotel is where the money is at. This will keep the others on their toes. HP board looks like it will have the first renderings.
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Holy crap, that is a lot of surface parking. You never quite notice from street level just how much of the peninsula is still covered with surface parking. This would be a great project for the city as it would help to fill out that gateway area of Commercial street.

It would be great to get development further west along Commercial Street, and I know that some has been proposed, but currently when you get off the bridge and drive down Commercial Street towards the Old Port you sort of feel like you're in a no-man's land for awhile.
 
PortlandArch said:
Yeah, that's the one. Again, though, I have to say that this is, in my opinion, not an indication that this project won't happen, just that it won't start construction this fall. That's entirely different from saying it's a done deal. The project is fully approved and sitting in an ideal location. Why build without a tenant? And if a tenant is lined up in the winter, you can't build (frozen). And then the spring is prime hotel season (don't want to ruin business for Hampton Inn). But, I wouldn't be surprised if the same or a substantially similar project commences sometime next year. Otherwise, all of the money spent thus far (including cost of land) is wasted. That's not good business. You will see a project here, but not one starting this fall. This was a world class proposal and I hope the developers come forward with these plans when a tenant materializes and a good construction schedule is available.

$500,000 is pricey, but it's ten times less (literally) than the cost of units proposed on the same site 6 years ago ($5 million Westin penthouse) and if you look at the cars in MiCucci's parking lot during the day, plus the proximity to the coolest neighborhoods/districts in Maine (Old Port, Downtown, and Munjoy Hill), plus waterviews and a top notch recreational trail, it starts to make a little more sense.
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Thanks for the additional information. I just noticed they have updated their website to indicate they expect construction to start fall 2013 and occupancy to be January 2015. Now looks like they have about 3/4 of the condo units "reserved" though.
 
I'm all for building more stuff but this maxes out the hotels needed and that's without considering the press herald building, fore street, thompsons point and the Westin

This foodie/best small city buzz isn't enough to carry this city forever. Like I tell Patrick, we have to start building some real destinations/attractions intown
 
^ They were saying the same thing about the number of restaurants here 15 years ago — and since then, lots of new restaurant spaces have been renovated, opened, and succeeded. Building more restaurants helped add to the city's reputation as a food town, and that, in turn, attracted more than enough new business to keep the sector growing.

I suspect that the same will happen with the new hotels. It's indicative of how popular the city has become, especially as a weekend destination from NYC and Boston, and as more hotels open, and begin marketing Portland as a destination, then more people will visit. I'm a little concerned about turning into more of a tourist town than we already are, but I don't think that 2 or 3 new downtown hotels will have that big of an impact — especially if all they're replacing are dirt parking lots.

And speaking of restaurants, they're definitely thrilled at all the new hotels being planned. Tourists dine out, and adding more hotels downtown means a lot more business for them, and more foot traffic in general on our streets.
 
cneal said:
I suspect that the same will happen with the new hotels. It's indicative of how popular the city has become, especially as a weekend destination from NYC and Boston, and as more hotels open, and begin marketing Portland as a destination, then more people will visit. I'm a little concerned about turning into more of a tourist town than we already are, but I don't think that 2 or 3 new downtown hotels will have that big of an impact — especially if all they're replacing are dirt parking lots.
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I tend to agree with you about the hotels, just from personal experience. Over the last few years my girlfriend and I have stayed in almost every hotel and Bn'B in the city while we're visiting my family. From January through March it is relatively easy to get a nice room at the Hilton Garden Inn or Marriott Residences or Danforth Inn for less than $150/night. The rest of the year it's much more difficult, and sometimes impossible. Between June and August we forget about hotels altogether and go for vacation rentals, because the nice hotels can easily command $250+ a night.

I think as Portland becomes more of a destination hotel demand will only grow. Southwest Airlines starting up in April will help that. There is a whole contingent of fat midwesterners who are Southwest devotees and who will come to Maine now that it's in their network. I also think increased Amtrak ridership and the potential renewal of ferry service to Nova Scotia could help.

But, I also think Grittys is right that the city needs to curate the kind of development that will be around for the long-term so that when the foodie craze cools down, which it inevitably will, there will still be reasons for people to come to Portland.
 
I am really surprised an Aquarium hasn't been built in Portland yet. The state of Maine does not have a grand aquarium that is a major tourist attraction. I know there was talk of building an aquarium @ Thompson's point and/or around the Old Port a year or two ago.
Has anyone heard any recent news on Thompson's Point facility? I'm sure it will get built, just seems the whole project has lost some political steam since the summer. I still believe the red claws could play a handful of games at the Cumberland County Civic Center and come close to selling the place out.
 
I can remember the aquarium idea being floated when I was living in Portland in the late 90's. In fact I think there was a real pitch to build it where the Gulf of Maine Research Institute was ultimately built. While many people were for the idea of an aquarium there also seemed to be a lot of derision by people who thought it was too gimmicky, as I recall. I personally think an aquarium would be appropriate if it had an emphasis on exploring Maine's maritime history.

Speaking of Thompson's Point, there is some speculation that Wright Express could be considering moving the bulk of their operations there. They're having a press conference on Thursday to make announcement about their future. I'd prefer to hear that want to build a signature 17-story headquarters in downtown Portland, but I would be glad to hear that Thompson's Point has acquired a signature tenant as well.

I have somewhat mixed feelings about the Thompson's Point project as I feel Portland is too small a city to dilute the development away from downtown, and to me there is a real physical and mental barrier between Thompson's Point and the peninsula. That said, my hat is off to Jon Jennings and his team for be willing to make such a major investment in Portland, and the Thompson's Point area is certainly not being utilized to its full potential right now.
 
grittys457 said:
I'm all for building more stuff but this maxes out the hotels needed and that's without considering the press herald building, fore street, thompsons point and the Westin

This foodie/best small city buzz isn't enough to carry this city forever. Like I tell Patrick, we have to start building some real destinations/attractions intown
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Thanks for the update Max, I suspected it would just be a when not if situation with FIM, LLC's project.

Grittmeister, you're correct. However, right now the urban development caters to people who don't live in the City (while this is changing, it's mostly true). Portland is a destination because of its best small city status, food etc. The land is too abundant and too cheap around it to make it force itself to be more at this point, with current policies. Boston, on the other hand (and any city like it) is surrounded by tons of cities with 100,000 population, which forces a lot more activity. Portland is lucky to have what it does for entertainment etc., and it is slowly developing into more than just a daytime shell with pockets of nightlife. People are moving back in, and that's what it's gonna take to get more than a veneer of urbanity. Bayside is more local, it seems, than tourists. Maybe that's the future of local Portland's downtown? Don't forget the new dental school, now framed out on Stevens Ave.
 
cneal said:
^ They were saying the same thing about the number of restaurants here 15 years ago — and since then, lots of new restaurant spaces have been renovated, opened, and succeeded. Building more restaurants helped add to the city's reputation as a food town, and that, in turn, attracted more than enough new business to keep the sector growing.

I suspect that the same will happen with the new hotels. It's indicative of how popular the city has become, especially as a weekend destination from NYC and Boston, and as more hotels open, and begin marketing Portland as a destination, then more people will visit. I'm a little concerned about turning into more of a tourist town than we already are, but I don't think that 2 or 3 new downtown hotels will have that big of an impact — especially if all they're replacing are dirt parking lots.

And speaking of restaurants, they're definitely thrilled at all the new hotels being planned. Tourists dine out, and adding more hotels downtown means a lot more business for them, and more foot traffic in general on our streets.
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The good thing about hotels is that, unlike parking structures, they are easily converted if/when the market dictates they should be. Office or residential is possible. Some of the better projects propose mixed use to begin with. I don't have any problem with a ton of hotels. The market will work itself out, and if a few fail they are still better for the public realm than a void in the street and can be converted to better use later on. Also, the alternative to a tourist town is a vacant one -- at least in Maine. I know tourist town sounds better to me -- but in addition there is PLENTY of activity generated by Mainers themselves in this city...look at Congress Street, which is almost totally devoid of tourists yet always vibrant.

P.S., this comment wasn't entirely directed at you Christian, I just happened to quote you when writing it.
 
^ Good point about the potential for future apartment conversion. Note that this proposal from JB Brown would also include 14 new housing units (that's as much housing as you'd find in a 10-acre cul-de-sac subdivision in Cape Elizabeth) on the top floor, where the best harbor views would be.

I was actually at City Hall yesterday and had a look at the plans while I was there, and noticed that the contractor for this project would be Opechee, the very same firm that built the Hampton Inn and owns the Jordans Meats site.

This proposal looks very similar to that one. In addition to the new apartments on the building's top floor, there's also ground-floor retail space and a ground-floor lobby and porte cochere. The architecture and materials being proposed also look very similar — but then again, they're using face brick and aluminum cladding, and that pretty much describes the materials on every new building in this town, so that can't be considered much of a coincidence.

There would be a very small parking lot in the back of the building, but otherwise the developers propose to use the existing paved lot facing York Street, on the rear half of the block.
 
Is it so hard to design a building that doesn't look like every other damn building in the city? Is it really that hard to google some different designs and make a go of it?

Yes the Jordan's meat project, especially phase II, looks great for those styles but I'm sick of those types. They even blew the design on Intermed. That could have been so much better and it looks great from the Trader Joe's intersection but looks like a squat brick structure from 295. Looks like One City center had a one night stand with Back Bay Tower then gave it up for adoption.

While I'm upset, is there a crappier more unfriendly to the street office building than 511 congress? Even with a plaza and window retail it might as well be set back 5000 feet. In fact, I think if you walk into the building you get sent to another dimension.

And I doubt an aquarium would be feasible but that's what I'm talking about. Something to go to, something to do. You can only walk around outside and do so much. We should have picked the whole damn public market up by helicopters and dropped it down on to the parking lot next to Boru. That place was ideal, just a block too far away. Imagine how popular it would be now post foodie town explosion?

How about a Gap or some normal retailer downtown? Finally brought in a chain with Urban Outfitters but I really don't need a quirky T-shirt with Doogie Howser on it for 35 dollars or size 24 waist jeans for men.

Give the people who live and work in this area stuff they need and not just entire stores that sell salt items. Yes I expect that's what will become of Bayside in the future but there's no reason not to diversify the old port now.

And I'm done
 
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