Portland Passenger Rail

GIL said:
I believe the mid-last-century routes between Portland (and points northeast) and New York City (and points South, to Washington) did not stop in / near Boston. The route can be explored here:

Bar Harbor Express - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org
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Agreed; I have held the opinion that the train should follow the 495 routing through the Merrimack Valley to the Worcester Main, and then either the route to Springfield or cut directly under that to the P&W to (I believe) New London. (THere is a railroad underpass there by Worcester Union Station.) But my impression is that, with Amtrak and Massachusetts trying mightily to get the Inland Route going, the cross-platform transfer (which keeps the Maine-funded train closer to home) is going to be the plan.
 
The East Wind was another train that avoided Boston when navigating from Washington DC to Portland.

America has become really bad at putting pride into building place-making spaces. Railroads were regulated private enterprises, but they still put effort into their infrastructure. They did so because it was its own form of advertising. These days that doesn’t happen because of a litany of reasons (costs, regulations, apathy).
 
$8.5-$12 million per mile seems REALLY high...even for reactivating an inactive corridor (the lower road)

Correct me if my math or information is wrong...but The 2012 Downeaster extension to Brunswick cost about $55 million for 26ish miles of track work. Including a lot of new 115-lb Continuously-welded rail, new ties, grading and signaling...That works out to a bit over $2 million per mile. Granted the Lower Road would need a substantial amount of work in places, plus PTC installation... but $8 million + per mile seems VERY high.
 
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To me the greater potential is on making Brunswick-Portland-Boston service 8 daily round trips (including an AM Northbound) and then branching them something like 6r/ts to Augusta and 2r/ts to Rockport. Or get to hourly on BON-POR and split them 25% to Lewiston, 25% to Rockport, 50% to Augusta.
 
Cosakita18 said:
$8.5-$12 million per mile seems REALLY high...even for reactivating an inactive corridor (the lower road)

Correct me if my math or information is wrong...but The 2012 Downeaster extension to Brunswick cost about $55 million for 26ish miles of track work. Including a lot of new 115-lb Continuously-welded rail, new ties, grading and signaling...That works out to a bit over $2 million per mile. Granted the Lower Road would need a substantial amount of work in places, plus PTC installation... but $8 million + per mile seems VERY high.
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Bear in mind that was just after the great recession when construction costs were unusually low, and the Portland-Brunswick rail corridor was still in active use at the time, and a decade of inflation has happened since then.

This study does go into some detail about their estimates on page 40:

A cost factor of $3.5M to $5.3M per mile was used to project cost ranges for infrastructure improvements along active corridors and a cost
factor of $8.5M to $12.0M per mile was used for improvements along less active or inactive corridors.
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I don't know about the "inactive rail" estimate but I'd say that $3.5M to $5.3M per mile estimate for an active corridor is in line with what we spent in 2012, given how construction costs have roughly doubled in recent years.
 
Maine DoT is proposing $3 million for a two-year pilot of passenger service on the Rockland Branch using secondhand Diesel-Multiple Units (DMUs) operated by Midcoast Rail Service, which took over operating rights on the Rockland Branch last year. Right now, the corridor is only used for local freight service.

The service would run 3x daily, 7 days a week all year round between Rockland and Brunswick and would be timed to interchange with Downeaster Trains.

full article:
www.trains.com

Maine DOT proposes $3 million for pilot of Brunswick-Rockland RDC service - Trains

PORTLAND, Maine — The prospect of regular passenger service on a state-owned route between Brunswick and Rockland, Maine, received a big boost last week when Maine’s Department of Transportation budgeted $3 million to advance a two-year pilot project utilizing 1950s-era Budd Rail Diesel Cars...
www.trains.com www.trains.com

Most passenger rail startups consume cash by beginning with a ridership study, but that isn’t happening here. As Midcoast Rail's Smith puts it, “We can just run the damn service and see if it works!”
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I would also say we need a lot more of this mindset when it comes to transit development. Don't talk about doing it...Don't study doing it....Just do it.
 
It's easier to "just do it" when there's not a huge initial capex hit, like upgrading 100 miles of track. I was able to find the 2014 Maine Eastern schedule online (search for 2014_MERR_Schedule.pdf) and their heritage equipment was scheduled to make it from Brunswick to Rockland in 2 hours (stops in Bath, Wiscasset and Newcastle) so 1:50 with refurbished RDC's should be doable... and using ADA-compliant equipment hopefully will mean that NNEPRA and Amtrak should be able to treat it as a connecting service instead of essentially ignoring it.
 
I think any substantial money spend for the Downeaster should be focused on the year-round service spine, and that would be Brunswick to Boston. Not sure the cost or timeline to upgrade the tracks to reach 70mph, but that would help as many passengers are now commuting for business and not just pleasure. If not that, then some new passenger cars would help. In another thread, I noted the incredible trains I rode on in Switzerland last summer, and that alone would give the service a big bump. Also, a new and improved food car and QR code food/drink delivery system. I know that I will not leave my seat to go to the food car for fear of it being taken (when riding alone). They could charge a delivery service fee and increase sales/profit. Food and drink can be a big part of the transportation model today. I get to fly First Class for work, and I can't seem to ever want to go back. Upgrade the food options and deliver it in a box with the transaction finished. How hard is that? So, this along with newer passenger cars (maybe not all but some) with a greater window viewing size (instead of de facto portholes) has now become more than merely functional, but fun. For a short period of time before Covid, I rode some commuter trains from Grand Central in Manhattan to New Haven and it was horrible, painful (two hours). I'd imagine the Boston suburb ones are no better. This way, the Boston to Brunswick spine is almost a destination in itself.
 
DanielPWM19 said:
Not sure if this is old news, but was posted by WBLM on 03/16/23:

"14 Hour Train Ride from Montreal to Boston with Stops in Maine in the Making"

wblm.com

14-Hour Train Ride From Montreal to Boston With Stops in Maine is in the Making

Ditch the car and take the train!
wblm.com wblm.com

Also, why can't we get faster trains in the US? Seriously?
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This is not going to happen. It's not practical going sideways, then down through Maine and then southwest to Boston. Driving by car is just under five hours. Why spend another 9 hours on a train? To look out the window at trees?
 
TC_zoid said:
This is not going to happen. It's not practical going sideways, then down through Maine and then southwest to Boston. Driving by car is just under five hours. Why spend another 9 hours on a train? To look out the window at trees?
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The Boston-Portland-Auburn-Bethel-Sherbrook-Montreal routing via CSX and the SLR is probably the best and most practical Boston-Montreal alignment and it -COULD- work as an overnight service... but getting passenger service up and running would require a lot of RoW work and signaling work on a big stretch of the SLR (and CSX between Royal Junction and Auburn)....not to mention equipment procurement (Amtrak and VIA's fleets are stretched pretty thin right now) Is this meant to be a fully private venture or operated by Amtrak / Via Rail? To my knowledge neither have even acknowledged the possibility of a BON-Montreal service.
 
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The article says
According to WMUR this is not on a fast track. It would be at least two years before this becomes a reality, and that's being optimistic.
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It's been talked about for well over two years already. AFAIK it's intended to be privately operated (not Amtrak and VIA) and they've been pitching it as a "hotel train". Also, a decade or so ago Maine did an analysis that came up with a cost of a billion dollars to make the route to Montreal usable. (I'm not sure what it would take just to make the old ski train to Bethel doable again, but in those days you had Les Otten at the River and the St. Lawrence and Atlantic was independently owned and willing to try new ideas.)
 
TC_zoid said:
This is not going to happen. It's not practical going sideways, then down through Maine and then southwest to Boston. Driving by car is just under five hours. Why spend another 9 hours on a train? To look out the window at trees?
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It's an overnight sleeper train, so people won't be looking at anything. I agree that it probably won't go anywhere, but if it does ever happen, I could see riding it.
 
I've often heard it touted as the "Old Orchard Express" and that the Quebec-OOB crowd was a big potential market.

(The train wouldn't even need a baggage car...the Quebecois pack very light when they go to OOB....Just speedos. :p )
 
Cosakita18 said:
I've often heard it touted as the "Old Orchard Express" and that the Quebec-OOB crowd was a big potential market.

(The train wouldn't even need a baggage car...the Quebecois pack very light when they go to OOB....Just speedos. :p )
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The Montreal Gazette article that was linked to in the WBLM story even mentioned OOB in the headline!
 
Portcity75 said:
Every penny spent on rail in Maine should be towards making Portland to Boston a viable option.
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My semi-realistic proposals for improving the Downeaster and cutting Portland-Boston to a 2-hour trip are:
  1. (Most obviously) Build a new Portland Union Station somewhere on the existing mainline. Not just a glorified park-and-ride but a proper station anchored by transit-oriented, mixed-use development.

  2. Finally finish PTC installation to allow for more frequency and potentially speeds above 79 mph.

  3. Built ~14 miles of new Double Track through Kennebunk, Arundel and Biddeford to connect the Ocean Park siding to the Wells double track segment. This would create over 20 miles of continuous double track

  4. In New Hampshire, Build another ~14 miles of new double track connecting Rockingham Junction with existing double track in Plaistow which extends all the way to North Station.

  5. These new double track segments would reduce conflicts with freight trains allow for a lot more schedule flexibility and allow The Downeaster to run 7 round trips per day and potentially even more if NNEPRA were to acquire a 4th trainset when the new "Airo" trainsets are delivered in 2026-28 (There are potential complications with that since the Brunswick layover facility can only accommodate 3 trainsets)

  6. Rebuild some curves with speed restrictions to allow for more continuous 79 mph running. Similarly, do targeted track work to remove speed restrictions at some crossings and bridges.

  7. Stop calling in Haverhill and Woburn. They're low-ridership stops which already have decent MBTA Commuter rail service. The large majority of riders boarding / alighting in Haverhill are Massachusetts commuters who use the Downeaster as an "express" alternative to the Commuter Rail.

 
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