Rock Row (née The Ridge, née Dirigo Plaza) | Westbrook, ME

The concert venue is the main keynote arena for the project, but I believe they're planning lots of flexible breakout and floor space as well in the rest of the complex, which is exactly what the Civic Center lacks.

Today's Press Herald followup: Convention center boosters in Maine cheer $75 million plan for Westbrook.


If a streetscape like that emerges, the chamber could support a space at the scale Waterstone envisions, Hentzel said. Though backers are certain the Portland area can accommodate the business and visitors one convention center would attract, two would be too many.
“I don’t think we can sustain two convention centers so close together,” Hentzel said. “It would need to be one or another, and frankly, we are running out of land in Portland.”
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Tom Nevers said:
Also, Max, have you visited The Gateway in Salt Lake City? Full of what I believe are chains and it’s rife with issues associated with quasi-public space but the layout, gathering spaces, weird nooks, art, lighting, and architecture make it an interesting place to walk thru. I’m not packing my bags to buy a condo in the units there but it is well integrated with downtown SLC, has good transit access, and is an easy walk from many local restaurants and shops. Definitely worth visiting if you have a few nights in SLC.
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I have not, but I'm sure there are some developments like this that are better integrated into the existing environment than others. The location of Rock Row is somewhat arbitrary (I guess the quarry and the surrounding undeveloped land are the raison d'etre), but otherwise it's just kind of an offshoot of a busy commuter / commercial arterial.

That said, what's going on at Portland Foreside is not too dissimilar from this kind of manufactured neighborhood, with some notable differences: it's a direct continuation of an existing built environment, the site has been previously developed in different incarnations (primarily industrial), etc. Portland Foreside has the potential to be much more interesting and integral to the community if they can do it right.
 
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Another example of a manufactured environment being plopped down in the middle of nowhere would be The Downs - the website lists "Town Center" as still in the design phase, so it's hard to tell what/if it will be up being. But I assume along the lines of Rock Row, but heavier on the housing?
 
The contributors on this thread have impressive insight and suggestions for this development. The two cities should get direction here. But they won't, of course, and it will more than likely be a big yawn or de facto failure.
 
Corey said:
The renderings look pretty cool. I'm surprised/not surprised the article talks a lot about the need for parking garages and doesn't mention need for a location with good public transportation access. Seems it would make sense to connect this sort of venue directly to downtown/jetport/Thompson's Point but maybe those plans are progressing separately.

Also, interesting choice to place this rendering in a random city other than Westbrook 🤓

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It looks like SoCal....or somewhere in the Southwest.
 
I don't understand why Westbrook/Portland and its residents are falling for this (except for us). The entity, Waterstone Properties, appears to be a property management company, not a true developer with a vision. That illustration would need to show something designed for a cold environment (the pool is facing east). Are they that stupid? No, they think Mainers are stupid. It's arrogance. They are assuming Mainers won't figure it out before the $115 million dollar bond is floated. They will then simply hire engineering and construction firms to build on a half-baked idea. It will be semi-successful at best. If you want something cool and smart, hire Jim Brady along with Shamrock Marketing (entertainment) to create something worthwhile. Both are native to Maine and both have many impressive development and entertainment endeavors accomplished in Maine. Stop the madness, please. No more out-of-state companies that don't care about anything but money. Maybe all of the participants in this blog need to march on city hall to knock some sense into their heads. But then again, this company has a lock on the land, so never mind.
 
TC_zoid said:
I don't understand why Westbrook/Portland and its residents are falling for this (except for us). The entity, Waterstone Properties, appears to be a property management company, not a true developer with a vision. That illustration would need to show something designed for a cold environment (the pool is facing east). Are they that stupid? No, they think Mainers are stupid. It's arrogance. They are assuming Mainers won't figure it out before the $115 million dollar bond is floated. They will then simply hire engineering and construction firms to build on a half-baked idea. It will be semi-successful at best. If you want something cool and smart, hire Jim Brady along with Shamrock Marketing (entertainment) to create something worthwhile. Both are native to Maine and both have many impressive development and entertainment endeavors accomplished in Maine. Stop the madness, please. No more out-of-state companies that don't care about anything but money. Maybe all of the participants in this blog need to march on city hall to knock some sense into their heads. But then again, this company has a lock on the land, so never mind.
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"Lacking Vision" isn't something the Greater Portland Area has lacked ever ... (sarcasm).
 
It looks like the CLT office building has been scaled down by 2 stories (from 8 to 6) but construction is set to commence in Q2 of this year according to the updated brochure on the Rock Row website.

The scale down is disappointing but not totally surprising given current demand for office space.

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Both parcels have opportunity for rail sidings depending on the sale of Pan Am to CSX. The homeless behind Lowes are going to be upset. Also the property they acquired from Harcross will probably be contaminated from the chemical that were stored on site. This site does have a siding but Pan Am lost that customer due to lack of servicing the line. Also I could see light rail from these parcels with housing.
 
Dr. StrangeHat said:
Rock Row adding to their footprint: https://www.pressherald.com/2022/02/15/rock-row-development-in-westbrook-acquires-more-land/

These are the parcels they acquired:

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As a Westbrook resident that lives fairly close to this development, I find this incredibly exciting. I wish more growth would happen in downtown Portland as far as taller buildings and a commuter rail system. Locals have worried about losing the "charm" of Westbrook, but don't understand it has always been a de facto suburb of Portland and the growth has generally been positive.

I further hope this encourages the redevelopment of the lots for Kon Asian Bistro, Inn at Portland, Paul's Auto Mechanic/Sales, Amato's, Sherwin Williams, Midas, and some of the other buildings on Saunders Way. Dehler Animal Clinic is merging with Stoneledge (due to retirement), so perhaps those buildings could be more integrated into the site also. The way the old Agren Appliance building on Foden/Western Ave is being fixed up - it shows that some of these buildings don't necessarily even need to be replaced, but can be updated.

My only concern is that Westbrook finally addresses some of the issues that have been brought up for over a decade regarding speeding on Haskell, Rochester, and Forest Streets. They're being used as a cut-through to get to Stroudwater, to the Highway Connector, and to avoid the light at the Fire/Police Station on Main Street. Traffic impact should be further studied and solutions found to divert traffic away from these neighborhoods.
 
There was a plan at one time at the Westbrook Arterial to run a connector across the farm property on stroudwater to gorham. This would be an alt to rt 25.
 
JB Brown bought that land that was supposed to developed in a mall setting. Nothing ever came out that.
 
PWMFlyer said:
JB Brown bought that land that was supposed to developed in a mall setting. Nothing ever came out that.
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I'm going to be "that guy" and personally hope the farmland on Stroudwater doesn't get developed. We need some open green space, farmland, and so on. I'm sure at some point it'll be developed much like the old Camelot location or Golf Course off Spring. I'm more a supporter of building "up" than "out". Rock Row is great since it was already a barren wasteland.
 
DanielPWM19 said:
I further hope this encourages the redevelopment of the lots for Kon Asian Bistro, Inn at Portland, Paul's Auto Mechanic/Sales, Amato's, Sherwin Williams, Midas, and some of the other buildings on Saunders Way. Dehler Animal Clinic is merging with Stoneledge (due to retirement), so perhaps those buildings could be more integrated into the site also. The way the old Agren Appliance building on Foden/Western Ave is being fixed up - it shows that some of these buildings don't necessarily even need to be replaced, but can be updated.

My only concern is that Westbrook finally addresses some of the issues that have been brought up for over a decade regarding speeding on Haskell, Rochester, and Forest Streets. They're being used as a cut-through to get to Stroudwater, to the Highway Connector, and to avoid the light at the Fire/Police Station on Main Street. Traffic impact should be further studied and solutions found to divert traffic away from these neighborhoods.
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Wow, now Dehler is merging with Stoneledge? They just picked up Forest Ave. Veterinary Hospital (the big A-frame near Walton St.) this past fall.

I've got to wonder what's going to be worth their while to develop on the Portland side of the Turnpike; it'll just make them more vulnerable to noise complaints once the new concert venue is built.
 
markhb said:
Wow, now Dehler is merging with Stoneledge? They just picked up Forest Ave. Veterinary Hospital (the big A-frame near Walton St.) this past fall.

I've got to wonder what's going to be worth their while to develop on the Portland side of the Turnpike; it'll just make them more vulnerable to noise complaints once the new concert venue is built.
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Interestingly when I was outside at night, I barely heard the concert venue (and I'm pretty close). I can actually see the lights and hear the HS Marching Band and Football Games louder than Rock Row. I believe The sound mostly went in the other direction toward Portland/Deering? Either way, the disturbance was minimal.
 
In hindsight, I wonder if Rock Row would have designed and done all of this differently? The one time that I went there last fall.....the Chick-fil-A drive-thru snaked through the entire Market Basket parking area. Everything seemed very tight. That seems to be a universal design in Maine......build tight even though there is an endless supply of land....go figure.

I hope that they are planning on multiple parking garages for this site because I would hate to see all the space wasted on surface parking like Market Basket. Maybe a garage on corner of the new property for the concert facility? They could have a lit and landscaped path along the rail line....it can't be more than a few minute walk to the current site. Is that the general area where the new facility will be built?
 
mainejeff said:
In hindsight, I wonder if Rock Row would have designed and done all of this differently? The one time that I went there last fall.....the Chick-fil-A drive-thru snaked through the entire Market Basket parking area. Everything seemed very tight. That seems to be a universal design in Maine......build tight even though there is an endless supply of land....go figure.

I hope that they are planning on multiple parking garages for this site because I would hate to see all the space wasted on surface parking like Market Basket. Maybe a garage on corner of the new property for the concert facility? They could have a lit and landscaped path along the rail line....it can't be more than a few minute walk to the current site. Is that the general area where the new facility will be built?
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Depending on time of day, the Chick-Fil-A line can be insane. When it opened it literally started by snaking around the outer edge of the rear dirt parking lit before crossing the back driveway. I still start at that rear entrance and head towards Chase Bank if I'm going there, although I think they've cut way back on the traffic control personnel recently so maybe it's eased up.

Most of the diagrams on their site show the new convention center / concert facility right where the current one is, although oriented differently, but I think they've since said that that land is going to be used in conjunction with the medical offices (I'd have to go look at that Planning Board video).

There are plans for multiple garages per their website.

Also, my partner and I went to the new Fairfield Inn parking lot by where Denny's was and listened for a few minutes during one of the opening acts for Alice Cooper that summer they were open, and that was fairly quiet to us at that short distance.
 
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