Rose Kennedy Greenway

kz1000ps said:
IMO it's all about the tourists. Think about the routes they walk -- Quincy Market to the North End, QM to Columbus Park and Long Wharf and then down to Rowes Wharf -- and that is where you'll see the parcels most in use. It's quite easy to predict, actually.

The only exception is the stupid light blade patches which, besides a Zumba class making good use of the grass once, I've never seen get much of any kind of love. But everything else from the North End Parks down to Rowes Wharf gets good use.
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There is definitely a lot more that could be added, particularly in the ramps. However, sometimes just an area of flat grass is good to have for versatility and a place to get away from the kids and tourists. (This is not an excuse or apology for the underperformance of much of the greenway, just saying, if it does get there, its ok to have some blank slates left over)
 
Flow of consciousness:

I was talking to someone 100% outside of the design community the other day about the greenway. He remarked how stupid it was to put a bunch of parks there instead of more buildings. People who have no interest or knowledge of the built environment know this...

Similarly, when I was maybe 12 or so, I remember watching a special on the Big Dig on the Discovery Channel or some such. (Remember when Discovery actually taught you things!?!). They talked about how the Central Artery tore through the city and demolished a ton of buildings. Then they showed they were going to replace it with a park. My preteen self thought "that's stupid, it should be buildings".

So... how did we end up with a linear park when most people seem to inherently know it should have been redeveloped?

Of course, now that it's there we should do with it what we can. I think its moderately successful, although how could it not be being directly in the center of the city? One thing I really hate is how public officials keep touting it as the best thing since the revolution to happen to Boston. Its not. Everyone knows it. Stop lying.

I still think either Christopher Columbus Park or the park in front of the Long Wharf needs to go, or a piece of each. There is just way too much open space there. It doesn't work as one large park (a'la the common) because of all the cross streets, bad design, and lack of programming.

Ideally I'd love to see Atlantic Ave brought through the arch of the Long Wharf, through the harbor garage, and reconnected in front of Rowes Wharf. Something like 20'sidewalk|20' cycle track|20'sidewalk, with the cycle track accessible to emergency vehicles. I think a strip of pavement running through there would really help bring the continuity of the area back, and possibly restore some foot traffic to Atlantic Ave/Commercial Street, which feels like a back alley instead of the main thoroughfare it is. But that's just me.

/ramble.
 
I think if it were a few small parks it would probably do fairly well. Something along the lines of the levanthal park at P.O. sqaure, where people can spill out of their buildings for lunch and some fresh air.

Is 93 deep enough to build over? I would think that anything of significant height would be out of the question, but some mid rise buildings would fit in nicely.
 
I still think either Christopher Columbus Park or the park in front of the Long Wharf needs to go, or a piece of each. There is just way too much open space there.
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There may be too much open space generally, but why would you build over two wildly popular parks? "Too much" would imply non-use - those parks are packed with people using them. Maybe get rid of the more southern stretches, or at least re-think them, but there's nothing that needs to be changed about Columbus or the Ring Fountain.

I'm also going to disagree with your claim that everyone knows we should have built buildings. While I agree with you that we should have more buildings on that stretch, if everyone knew that, we'd have done it. Constructing the park was overwhelmingly popular at the time. I think you'd find it's still the overwhelmingly preferred outcome for most Bostonians, regardless of what we know now. Buildings cause SHADOWSSSS HORROR!!!, but parks solve all the worlds problems.
 
I will axe murder anyone who dares mess with Christopher Columbus Park; it is near perfect as is. Go ahead and mess with everything else in the area but do not. touch. Columbus. Park.
 
Holy Jesus! My experience with Chris Columbus park must have been on an off day!

Its perfect, never mind!

*runs away*
 
I'm not quite as vehement as kz1000ps, but leave Christopher Columbus Park alone. It's popular and it works.
 
Shepard said:
I find it hard to believe that people really want to walk through a maze between highway ramps and parking garages... I guess I'm wrong?
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Going off topic slightly, but you'd be surprised how popular the North Bank bridge is, between Cambridge and Charlestown. Which is threaded through a large amount of highway and railroad infrastructure.
 
Christopher Columbus Park is one of the successful parts, although horribly named.

If they want to keep the Greenway a park, what they really need to do is narrow the highway around it. I was reading "Asphalt Nation" recently and the author mentions that the original plan was an EIGHT lane roadway enveloping the RKG. I guess the current six lane form was a concession of sorts. But it's still too much.

The crossing streets are also too wide. A nice thing might be some kind of pedestrian/cycletrack zone in the Greenway, but the thing is cut up so much by ramps and roadways that it's not really that attractive. I remember discussing this with someone last summer and he said that he wouldn't mind taking his kids to ride bikes there IF it wasn't so terrible.

Most of this applies to the southern half of the RKG, ie. the dead part that is often choked by exhaust fumes.
 
Curbside parking on the surface roads would do wonders by buffering traffic However, there is often jammed traffic from the Aquarium to South Station so I don't think we'll see lane reduction anytime in my lifetime.
 
The jams are caused by what has to be about the worst set of miss-timed lights in the entire city, which is saying something. Add parking, cycle tracks, or a straight up lane reduction along with re-timing the lights and I bet everything would be just fine.
 
underground said:
The jams are caused by what has to be about the worst set of miss-timed lights in the entire city, which is saying something.
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THIS! The light turns green and just as you start to accelerate, the next light 50 yards ahead turns red. Repeat that 5 times. It is brutal. Even without any traffic, it can easily take 6-10 min to go 5 or so blocks.
 
I always wonder why lights aren't run better in Boston. It really is terrible.
 
Even without any traffic, it can easily take 6-10 min to go 5 or so blocks.
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Seriously. It can take 15 minutes easily to go from the North End to South Station at 8 am on a Sunday. That's ridiculous. MassDOT should be flat out embarrassed.
 
Does MassDOT have jurisdiction over the signal timing of the JFK Surface Road? Wouldn't that be the city?
 
Whenever we were lucky enough to get some tickets to the Garden at my old joint, the boss would inevitably ask "you want a ride?" My response was always (unless pouring), no thank you.

Ultimately still quicker to drive, but so irksome. The walk is nice. Driving a mile to drop 40 bucks on parking makes no sense to me anyways.
 
Does MassDOT have jurisdiction over the signal timing of the JFK Surface Road? Wouldn't that be the city?
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I'm assuming it's MassDOT down to history, but I don't really know.
 
underground said:
Seriously. It can take 15 minutes easily to go from the North End to South Station at 8 am on a Sunday. That's ridiculous. MassDOT should be flat out embarrassed.
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So weird, since the lights are terrible for pedestrians too.
 
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